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Federal response to Katrina was faster than Hugo,





S3nd K3ys
... faster than Andrew, faster than Iniki, faster than Francine and Jeanne.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05254/568876.stm

Quote:
Jack Kelly: No shame
The federal response to Katrina was not as portrayed

Sunday, September 11, 2005

It is settled wisdom among journalists that the federal response to the devastation wrought by Hurricane Katrina was unconscionably slow.

"Mr. Bush's performance last week will rank as one of the worst ever during a dire national emergency," wrote New York Times columnist Bob Herbert in a somewhat more strident expression of the conventional wisdom.

But the conventional wisdom is the opposite of the truth.

...

"The federal government pretty much met its standard time lines, but the volume of support provided during the 72-96 hour was unprecedented. The federal response here was faster than Hugo, faster than Andrew, faster than Iniki, faster than Francine and Jeanne."

For instance, it took five days for National Guard troops to arrive in strength on the scene in Homestead, Fla. after Hurricane Andrew hit in 2002. But after Katrina, there was a significant National Guard presence in the afflicted region in three.

Journalists who are long on opinions and short on knowledge have no idea what is involved in moving hundreds of tons of relief supplies into an area the size of England in which power lines are down, telecommunications are out, no gasoline is available, bridges are damaged, roads and airports are covered with debris, and apparently have little interest in finding out.

So they libel as a "national disgrace" the most monumental and successful disaster relief operation in world history.

...

A better question -- which few journalists ask -- is why weren't the roughly 2,000 municipal and school buses in New Orleans utilized to take people out of the city before Katrina struck?


The lieberal media has no shame. They will do what ever then can to make the administration look bad, even with blatent lies.

It's a shame that the majority of the population will buy into it. Of course, that's what the lieberals are hoping for, and have been actually doing for many many years.
S3nd K3ys
Floodwalls repaired, floodwaters will be drained by the end of the month, death toll in the mid-hundreds instead of the 10,000 like that dumbass mayor predicted.

Turns out Bush and the feds were right to not panic and over-react.

Democrats, media, and other America-bashers = :owned: by stupidity. This is yet another example when some people wish for more dead Americans to further their own Marxist political agenda.

Once the facts start coming out, those who wish to know the truth will realize where any fault lays.

Those that hate Bush will continue to hate him regardless.
tidruG
Quote:
A better question -- which few journalists ask -- is why weren't the roughly 2,000 municipal and school buses in New Orleans utilized to take people out of the city before Katrina struck?

That's a very valid question.... what's the answer being given to that one?
S3nd K3ys
tidruG wrote:
Quote:
A better question -- which few journalists ask -- is why weren't the roughly 2,000 municipal and school buses in New Orleans utilized to take people out of the city before Katrina struck?

That's a very valid question.... what's the answer being given to that one?


I haven't heard one yet. I'm sure Mayor Schoolbus will have a finger to point away fom himself, though.
tidruG
OK To be honest, I haven't done too much research on this, but if they had a good enough warning period, and they still didn't evacuate, then logically speaking, that is one heck of a B-I-G mistake.

(PS: I merged your threads primarily because the second one didn't have a news story and also, it kind of follows this thread's topic)
S3nd K3ys
tidruG wrote:
...if they had a good enough warning period, and they still didn't evacuate, then logically speaking, that is one heck of a B-I-G mistake.
...


HuH?

Quote:
Saturday, August 27:

...

# 5:00 PM CDT: New Orleans Mayor C. Ray Nagin declares a State of Emergency and issues a voluntary evacuation order, saying he is having his legal team determine if he can order a mandatory evacuation without exposing the city to legal liability for the closure of hotels and other businesses.
...
Sunday, August 28:

# Approx. 10:00 AM CDT: New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin orders mandatory evacuations of New Orleans.

...
shr3dd
A lot of the blame that the people lay on Bush truly lies in the hands of New Orleans' own citizens. Disobeying a mandatory evacuation is technically illegal, so by staying in the city the people committed crimes, par for the course it seems like to me. The Mayor had to research to see if he had the power? His city is below sea-level, is in a prime spot for hurricanes and he doesn't know if he can actually evacuate his people? How did he get elected? He is an incompetant low-life who couldn't arrange his people a way out? You know, there were so many things he could've done. I'm not laying all the blame on him, either. The people who died refused to leave. About those who couldn't leave, I would've proposed the bus thing like previously stated in this thread. New Orleans was approprated how much money? 20 Billion for construction in 1998. What did they do? Spruced up their Mardi Gras decor and neglected the obviously weak levee in a known below-sea level area. Nothing was done by the local/state gov't to aid victims or prevent casualty. Hmmm, victims, oddly enough the "victims" brought it upon themselves. Not following a mandatory evacuation when they KNEW a CAT. 5 hurricane was coming when they KNEW they were below sea-level. Forecasts predicted major flooding and they STILL would not leave. Seems to me they victimized themselves. No blood is on Bush's hands. Does he control the weather? Did he not send the speediest hurricane relief effort ever? There's one reason there is still so many people without aid. Katrina was the biggest disaster of it's kind in US history, which means more people were affected than ever. It's common sense that it will take longer to help everyone. To those who think Bush is at fault? You are a f****** liberal. (Thanks S3nd K3ys, got that from your sig Wink )
S3nd K3ys
That reply was worth saying twice. Very Happy I may have to quote you in one of my future sigs. Wink
shr3dd
oops, probably hit it twice on accident. just take it as being told twice, now listen up libs.
noliver
shr3dd wrote:
oops, probably hit it twice on accident. just take it as being told twice, now listen up libs.


What second post ?

Wink

Have a nice day !
shr3dd
lol we all know it was there at one time lol
S3nd K3ys
So now we're getting to the point where we can start analyzing (heh, I said 'anal', heheh, cool.) the data from the storm and make some judgements concerning the rescue/relief effort, or the supposed lack thereof if you watch CNN....

In 2004, there were 12,901 deaths in the New Orleans, LA USA.

Source

12,901 / 26 weeks = 496 average deaths per 2 weeks in 2004.

So far the La. death toll is now at 513

Don't get me wrong, I am thankful that the massive numbers predicted did not materialize, and you can draw your own conclusions, but I think Mayor SchoolBus pulled a few Billion dollar wool scarf over our eyes.

There was nothing Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Ford, Carter, Nixon.......could have done to prevent property damage that happened, short of pouring Billions and Billions into a giant levee system that was doomed to continue sinking into the marsh land.

But, the small death toll does say that the response was more adequate than is being portrayed. (Considering they were predicting 10,000 deaths.) The Mississippi River is open 24 hours now, the refineries are coming back on line rapidly, the water is going to be drained much faster than predicted, and, contrary to popular belief, white peolpe died and lost their homes too.

I've heard mention that it was blown out of proportion by the media to boost their ratings. I guess it was coming to the end of the summer doldrums, and the Cindy crap was wearing thin, even on them.

I miss Cindy. At least she was cheap.

S3nd K3ys
I'm curious to see how much longer the wacked out lieberals will continue trying to make this into something it's not. The poor bastards don't know how much damage they're doing to themselves by continually lying and shouting RACIST when things like this happen. They're seriously shooting themselves in the foot.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/GovernmentReform/sr05.cfm

The truth is coming out... (it sure got quiet in here didn't it?)

Quote:
As Congress and the nation consider how to rebuild shattered lives and destroyed neighborhoods and businesses after the Katrina disaster, it is important that the need to take action swiftly does not lead to steps that cause dollars to be used inefficiently or to unwise decisions that frustrate rather than achieve long-term success. This makes it imperative that Congress keep the following guidelines firmly in mind.

The federal government should provide support and assistance only in those situations that are beyond the capabilities of state and local governments and the private sector. State and local governments must retain their primary role as first responders to disasters. The federal government should avoid federal­izing state and local first response agencies and activities.

Restructuring the National Guard

Most disasters, including terrorist attacks, can be handled by emergency responders. Only catastrophic disas­ters—events that overwhelm the capacity of state and local governments—require a large-scale military response. Assigning this mission to the military makes sense. The Pentagon could use response forces for tasks directly related to its primary warfighting jobs, such as theater support to civilian governments during a conflict, counterinsurgency missions, and postwar occupation, as well as homeland security. These forces would mostly be National Guard sol­diers. The National Guard force needs to be large enough to maintain some units on active duty at all times for rapid response in catastrophic events like Katrina, as well as sufficient to support missions at home and abroad.

The organization of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) as established by Congress fragmented the preparedness and response missions among several agencies and offices. In July 2005 , new Homeland Security Sec­retary Michael Chertoff announced the results of his “Second Stage Review” of the department’s organization and missions. He proposed consolidating preparedness activities under an Under Secretary, strengthening the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), and making it an independent agency of the department, eliminating a level of bureaucracy and focusing FEMA squarely on planning and coordinating the national (not just federal) response to disasters. Hurricane Katrina struck before his reforms could be implemented, and the result was a lack of communication and coordination among state, local, and national responders.

Improving Public Preparedness and Personal Responsibility

In comparison to the devastation of the tsunami in Southeast Asia, the U.S. capacity to save lives in the aftermath of Katrina proved unparalleled. This did not just happen. It resulted from the decisions of government leaders, vol­unteer groups, private-sector initiatives, and the selfless actions of communities and individuals. All are vital com­ponents of a national response. Yet more people could have been saved if individuals and communities had met their basic civic responsibilities . America does not have a culture of preparedness.
shr3dd
eerie silence
xalophus
To say that the best possible preparations were in place would be wrong, in view of the accuracy and the head start in terms of early warnings.
Following the timeline posted above, and it appears accurate, would you say that the early warings were taken seriously ?

If the responsibility was first with the local government, who is responsible if they fail to fulfill ?
Is it right if the federal government fails to help people just because it was the local governments responsibility first ?
is that the best excuse they have to offer ?
that it wasn't their responsibility ?

If comparing the relief operations to the previous natural calamities is the only thing that relieves the federal government of all responsibilities, I don't see the point in pursuing this any further. Or are you going to compare it to southeast Asian Tsunami ? Come on !
The "eerie silence" is what this kind of attitude deserves.


This is the exact statement "ordering" the foolish suicidal people to evacuate, issued by the federal agency FEMA -
Quote:
"There's still time to take action now, but you must be prepared and take shelter and other emergency precautions immediately." - Michael Brown, Director, FEMA

And this is the extent of disobedience on part of the foolish suicical people, as perceived by the federal agency until the disaster struck.
Quote:
"I was impressed with the evacuation, once it was ordered it was very smooth" - Michael Brown, Director, FEMA
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4216508.stm


Now onto your quotes,
Quote:
The federal government should provide support and assistance only in those situations that are beyond the capabilities of state and local governments
Wasn't this disaster clearly beyond the capabilities of the state and local government ?
doesn't the responsibility then rest with the federal goverment ?
Weren't they already involved anyway ?
I do not see how this statement is meant to discount the blame on federal government.

Quote:
result was a lack of communication and coordination among state, local, and national responders
Yet the relief efforts were adequate, you say ?

It's funny, when it's not appreciated that people believe the alleged "liberal biased" media segments like NY Times,
news articles by Jack Kelly can still be quoted as Truth ? Or is that where the non-liberals get their information from ?
Absolutely true and unbiased media, as evident from these few lines -
Quote:
It is settled wisdom among journalists that the federal response to the devastation wrought by Hurricane Katrina was unconscionably slow.
Quote:
Journalists who are long on opinions and short on knowledge have no idea.....So they libel as a "national disgrace"



Now coming to the part about the commendable performance of the federal government in this disaster.
This is how much active role the federal government played in the relief efforts -
Quote:
Michael D. Brown, Under Secretary of Homeland Security for Emergency Preparedness and Response and head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), today urged all fire and emergency services departments not to respond to counties and states affected by Hurricane Katrina without being requested and lawfully dispatched by state and local authorities under mutual aid agreements and the Emergency Management Assistance Compact.
http://www.fema.gov/news/newsrelease.fema?id=18470
Now, wasn't that an active role ?
Didn't they actively stop relief efforts ?
Is that the federal governments job ?
or do you prefer to blame the state government even for this ?

Not just being impotent at the hour of need, federal government further actively blocked external aide -
Quote:
"The Homeland Security Department has requested and continues to request that the American Red Cross not come back into New Orleans," - Renita Hosler, Spokeswoman, Red Cross
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05246/565143.stm


About his government's great show in Orleans, (you showed us enough statistics about that), this is what President Bush himself had to say -
Quote:
"Katrina exposed serious problems in our response capability at all levels of government" - President Bush
Quote:
"And to the extent that the federal government didn't fully do its job right, I take responsibility. I want to know what went right and what went wrong" - President Bush
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/katrina_washington There's also a video accompanying the news story, in case somebody decides to dismiss this as ******* liberal media.


It becomes imperative at times like these that people like Michael Brown be made scape goats and swiftly "relieved of their duties" to avoid blame landing upon those higher in the order...
Quote:
The Bush administration dumped FEMA Director Michael Brown as commander of Hurricane Katrina relief efforts Friday
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050910/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/katrina_washington

We quickly forget why people like Brown were at the helm of any emergency response solution in the first place ?
Quote:
Michael D. Brown was nominated by President George W. Bush as the first Under Secretary of Emergency Preparedness and Response in the newly created Department of Homeland Security in January 2003
http://www.fema.gov/about/bios/brown.shtm

In case you didn't know, Michael D. Brown had "extensive disaster management experience" as the Judges & Stewards Commissioner of The Arabian Horse Association ( http://secure.arabianhorses.org/apps/index.cgi?page=pressrel&prid=41 )
So, Bush nominated a commisioner of the horse association as the director of FEMA ?
His weapon of choice against a CAT5 Hurricane, or worse, a terrorist attack ?
No wait, it's the terrorist attacks that are Bush's weapons of choice in elections.


S3nd K3ys wrote:
it sure got quiet in here didn't it?
No, it wasn't quiet in here, a few people were shouting propaganda and campaigning for Bush all along. And quite loudly.
Billy Hill
xalophus wrote:
To say that the best possible preparations were in place would be wrong, in view of the accuracy and the head start in terms of early warnings.
Following the timeline posted above, and it appears accurate, would you say that the early warings were taken seriously ?

If the responsibility was first with the local government, who is responsible if they fail to fulfill ?....


You seem to be somewhat lost on this issue, xalophus. I don't have time now to debate you, but when I get time, I'll be back. Wink
Billy Hill
I've only got time to reply to a couple of your 'issues'. I'll try to get back to it later.

Quote:
To say that the best possible preparations were in place would be wrong, in view of the accuracy and the head start in terms of early warnings.


"Best possible preperations" ?? I don't believe that was said until you said it. I understand you may feel the need to pad your statements as much as possible to try to get your point across, but lets not start off by putting words in other people's posts. (If I missed it, have the courtesy of providing a quote.)

Quote:
Following the timeline posted above, and it appears accurate, would you say that the early warings were taken seriously ?


By whom? The Federal Government? Yes. Most definately. Bush declared a state of emergency two days before the hurricane hit.

The citizens? Of New Orleans, approx 6 to 8 hundred thousand is the population, of which 75% or 80% evacuated, I would say that's questionable if they all took it seriously. If they didn't, it's not the Federal Government's job, it's the City/State's job. If they couldn't get out, it's the local government's job to get them out, because they're 'frist responders', (after the citizens).

I'll try to dig up that picture of the scores and scores of busses that 'drowned' because the local government refused to let anyone drive them. They could have been used to move thousands of people, but the only one that was used was one that was stolen by a 20 year old, who drove it to get people then off to Texas. Perhaps, after seeing the picture, you'll be able to explain to me just how it was that that picture was allowed to happen.

Quote:
If the responsibility was first with the local government, who is responsible if they fail to fulfill ?


First responsibility goes to the citizens. Then local, state and finally federal.

If you rely on the government (at any level) to take care of you in a disaster of this magnatude, or even smaller, you're crazy. I live on a fault line and will be prepared to fend for myself in an emergency. I will not depend on the government to take care of me.

Quote:
Is it right if the federal government fails to help people just because it was the local governments responsibility first ?
is that the best excuse they have to offer ?
that it wasn't their responsibility ?


You're kidding, right? The federal government made it possible for local and state officials to do what ever they needed DAYS before. When they were asked for more help, they provided it.

They stepped up to the plate before they needed to and you're trying to say they didn't do anything? I'm starting to see a pattern with you, twisting things around or completely fabricating them. Lets stick with facts.

Quote:
If comparing the relief operations to the previous natural calamities is the only thing that relieves the federal government of all responsibilities, I don't see the point in pursuing this any further. Or are you going to compare it to southeast Asian Tsunami ? Come on !
The "eerie silence" is what this kind of attitude deserves.


Relieves them of all responsibilities? Mr. Bush took full responsibility! Even if, IMNSHO, he did what he should have done. Unless, of course, you would have him declare a state of Marshal Law the two days before the hurricane, in which case the Democrats would be crying because he violated the constitution, and would scream for his impeachment. Is there NO making you happy?

That's all for now. I'll try to get back tonite, but no guarentees.
hedgehog2
Quote:
liberal media


always the liberal media. why? can't republicans find something else to make a fuss about? no, because they control the house, senate, capitol, and supreme court now that roberts is nominated![/quote]
Billy Hill
hedgehog2 wrote:
Quote:
liberal media


always the liberal media. why? can't republicans find something else to make a fuss about? no, because they control the house, senate, capitol, and supreme court now that roberts is nominated!


I'm NOT a Republican. Wink

And there's a reason that the Right is gaining more and more control; the radical left's real colors are starting to show more and more every year.
xiaarra
hey,
i dont mean to be rude or anything, but when u say the response has been fast it makes me wonder. let me show it to you.

inches of rain in new orleans due to hurricane katrina... 18

inches of rain in mumbai (July 27th).... 37.1



population of new orleans... 484,674

population of mumbai.... 12,622,500



deaths in new orleans within 48 hours of katrina...100

deaths in mumbai within 48hours of rain.. 37.



number of people to be evacuated in new orleans... entire city..wohh

number of people evacuated in mumbai...10,000



Cases of shooting and violence in new orleans...Countless

Cases of shooting and violence in mumbai.. NONE



Time taken for US army to reach new orleans... 48hours

Time taken for Indian army and navy to reach mumbai...12hours



status 48hours later...new orleans is still waiting for relief, army and electricty

status 48hours later..mumbai is back on its feet and is business is as usual



USA...world's most developed nation

India...third world country..


i dont mean to hurt anyones feelings, maybe it was the fault of the administration, or maybe in India we are more used to such things that we are more efficient.
xalophus
Billy Hill wrote:
"Best possible preperations" ?? I don't believe that was said until you said it...(If I missed it, have the courtesy of providing a quote.)
Quote:
The federal government pretty much met its standard time lines


Billy Hill wrote:
I understand you may feel the need to pad your statements as much as possible to try to get your point across, but lets not start off by putting words in other people's posts.

I don't know how to answer such a comment.
I feel it's best to ignore a personal attack.
I'm used to debating in a more healthy atmosphere.
And talking of padding statements, can you deny the extensive use of "word-pads" in your statements ?

Billy Hill wrote:
By whom? The Federal Government? Yes. Most definately. Bush declared a state of emergency two days before the hurricane hit.

Pre 26th - Katrina is expected to affect several states.
26th - Louisiana governer Kathleen Blanco declared state of emergency
27th - Mississippi governor Haley Barbour declared state of emergency
27th - Katrina upgrades to CAT 3
early 28th - Katrins upgrades to CAT 4
few hours later, 28th - Katrins upgrades to CAT 5
Late night 28th - water topples over levees.

Did you say Bush declared state of emergency on 28th ?

Sources - http://www.governorbarbour.com/EO939.htm
http://www.gov.state.la.us/Press_Release_detail.asp?id=976

And
This is the precision with which such a calamity was predicted -
An article dated Oct 2004, National Geographic.
Quote:
The storm hit Breton Sound with the fury of a nuclear warhead, pushing a deadly storm surge into Lake Pontchartrain. The water crept to the top of the massive berm that holds back the lake and then spilled over. Nearly 80 percent of New Orleans lies below sea level—more than eight feet below in places—so the water poured in. A liquid brown wall washed over the brick ranch homes of Gentilly, over the clapboard houses of the Ninth Ward, over the white-columned porches of the Garden District, until it raced through the bars and strip joints on Bourbon Street like the pale rider of the Apocalypse. As it reached 25 feet (eight meters) over parts of the city, people climbed onto roofs to escape it.

Thousands drowned in the murky brew that was soon contaminated by sewage and industrial waste. Thousands more who survived the flood later perished from dehydration and disease as they waited to be rescued. It took two months to pump the city dry, and by then the Big Easy was buried under a blanket of putrid sediment, a million people were homeless, and 50,000 were dead. It was the worst natural disaster in the history of the United States.

When did this calamity happen? It hasn't—yet. But the doomsday scenario is not far-fetched. The Federal Emergency Management Agency lists a hurricane strike on New Orleans as one of the most dire threats to the nation, up there with a large earthquake in California or a terrorist attack on New York City. Even the Red Cross no longer opens hurricane shelters in the city, claiming the risk to its workers is too great.
http://www3.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0410/feature5/
It was almost like foresight !
And this is the federal government's preparedness for such an event -
Quote:
"I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees. They did appreciate a serious storm but these levees got breached and as a result much of New Orleans is flooded and now we're having to deal with it and will" - President Bush
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4204754.stm
That's right Mr President, Nobody anticipated such a thing could happen, atleast not until almost a year back !

Billy Hill wrote:
You're kidding, right? The federal government made it possible for local and state officials to do what ever they needed DAYS before. When they were asked for more help, they provided it.

No, I'm not kidding.
I've already said enough, and provided enough links to do the research.
And as always, most of what I report here goes unacknowledged by the selective reception of facts by some people.
However, I'll put it here again.
This is what federal agencies did "When they were asked for more help, they provided it" -
Quote:
Michael D. Brown, Under Secretary of Homeland Security for Emergency Preparedness and Response and head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), today urged all fire and emergency services departments not to respond to counties and states affected by Hurricane Katrina without being requested and lawfully dispatched by state and local authorities under mutual aid agreements and the Emergency Management Assistance Compact.
http://www.fema.gov/news/newsrelease.fema?id=18470

Billy Hill wrote:
They stepped up to the plate before they needed to and you're trying to say they didn't do anything?

Who stepped up to the plate ?
The President, by denying any knowledge of any forecast of a disaster ?
Or the feredal agency FEMA (and its director) by screwing up again and again ?

Billy Hill wrote:
I'm starting to see a pattern with you, twisting things around or completely fabricating them. Lets stick with facts.

What is it that I "fabricated" ?
Talking of sticking with facts, I've reported facts all along.

OR has it come down to outright denial ?

I've long seen a pattern with few people here.
1. Personal attacks and flaming.
2. Closed mindedness, Stubbornness and Denial.
3. Selective receptiveness towards facts.
4. Dubbing anything that they don't like as Lie and fabrication.
5. Collectively making fun of people with opinions different from theirs.
6. A whole lot of agreement and back-patting amongst themselves.
7. Bliss.

I read, somewhere in the general forum, a few people demanding proof and facts in debates like these.
Are Jack Kelly articles the proof ? the facts ?
Am I allowed to quote CNN or NY Times for proof ?


Billy Hill wrote:
Relieves them of all responsibilities? Mr. Bush took full responsibility! Even if, IMNSHO, he did what he should have done. Unless, of course, you would have him declare a state of Marshal Law the two days before the hurricane, in which case the Democrats would be crying because he violated the constitution, and would scream for his impeachment. Is there NO making you happy?

On 29th, when Katrina was causing mayhem as a CAT4 hurricane in several states, where was the President ?
You might have guessed, he was on vacation which he didn't cut short !

This is what was on President's agenda -
Quote:
President Participates in Conversation on Medicare - 29th
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050829-5.html
Quote:
President George W. Bush joins Arizona Senator John McCain in a small celebration of McCain's 69th birthday - 29th
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/images/20050829-5_p082905pm-0125-515h.html
Quote:
President Discusses Medicare, New Prescription Drug Benefits - 30th
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050829-11.html
Quote:
President Commemorates 60th Anniversary of V-J Day - 30th
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050830-1.html
He's got his priorities right.
Yes sir, you've got swift emergency response right there.
And hell no, please don't "declare a state of Marshal Law the two days before the hurricane", but go and take guitar lessons when the hurricane hits*.


Billy Hill wrote:
It's not the Federal Government's job, it's the City/State's job. If they couldn't get out, it's the local government's job to get them out, because they're 'frist responders', (after the citizens).

Now I must ask you, are these states/cities a part of USA or not ?
As we've seen, local governments failed to fulfill their responsibilities.
Is that not where the Federal agencies are supposed to come into the picture ?

Quote:
the magnitude of responding to a crisis over a disaster area that is larger than the size of Great Britain has created tremendous problems that have strained state and local capabilities - President Bush, Sept 3nd

Quote:
Our priorities are clear...we will not allow bureaucracy to get in the way of saving lives - President Bush, Sept 3nd
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/09/20050903.html
Wasn't it a bit late for this ?

On one hand bureaucracy is not to come in the way, on the other hand federal government is shrugging off responsibilty by laying the blame upon the local governments.

Billy Hill wrote:
First responsibility goes to the citizens. Then local, state and finally federal.

I'll have to ask here,
Are we playing blame game ?

To give an example of the scenario,
imagine a house, inhabitants asleep.
fire breaks out, fire brigades arrive late, all is gutted down.
Fire department issues a statement saying "it was the responsibility of the inhabitants and the neighbours to extinguish the fire".

Billy Hill wrote:
If you rely on the government (at any level) to take care of you in a disaster of this magnatude, or even smaller, you're crazy. I live on a fault line and will be prepared to fend for myself in an emergency. I will not depend on the government to take care of me.

Alas, many victims have learned this too, the hard way.
too late for them.





I've said enough about Michael Brown's major screwups,
However President Bush thought otherwise -
Quote:
Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job - President Bush, Sept 2nd
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/09/20050902-2.html

p.s. - "Brownie" was later removed from his post due to his "heck of a job".


*And in case you are wondering where I get the knowledge Bush playing guitars when people were dying, the articles have been removed from the media.
And it's clear the extent to which the media is ****** liberal biased.
BUT, their google cache still exists !
News Page 1 (now removed) and its google cache
News Page 2 (now removed) and its google cache
S3nd K3ys
Wow, xalophus... perhaps you didn't get the memo?

Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency for Louisiana
By VOA News
28 August 2005



President Bush has declared a state of emergency for the Gulf Coast state of Louisiana, as it braces for the expected onslaught of Hurricane Katrina, set to make landfall on Monday.

Saturday's emergency declaration authorizes federal officials to coordinate all disaster relief efforts and provide appropriate assistance in several Louisiana parishes.


Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency
Sunday, August 28, 2005



Available from MANY sources.

Also, within 2 days, this is what the feds had done:

Quote:
The President Is Directing Federal Agencies Throughout The Government To Do All In Their Power To Assist The Victims Of Hurricane Katrina. The top priority is to save and sustain lives. Today, President Bush convened a Cabinet-level task force on Hurricane Katrina response and recovery. Residents of the Gulf Coast states affected by the hurricane have lost loved ones, lost homes, and been displaced from their communities, and they will have the full support of the Federal government.

* The President Has Given The Department Of Homeland Security (DHS) Authority To Coordinate The Response. The President announced that Secretary of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff will chair the interagency task force while Michael Brown, DHS Undersecretary for Emergency Preparedness and Response, is serving as the Administration's lead on the ground.

* The President Has Called For The Coordination Of All Parties Involved In The Response And Relief Efforts. Federal, state, and local governments are working side-by-side to deliver relief to the areas physically damaged by Hurricane Katrina and to communities across the South that will be affected in the aftermath of the storm. Efforts and resources are focused on saving lives, sustaining lives, and supporting long-term recovery.

* The President Has Called On All Americans To Support The Relief And Rescue Efforts Through Charitable Contributions And Aid. Americans who wish to contribute can do so by contacting charities that are assisting with hurricane relief. For example, citizens can call the Red Cross at 1-800-HELP-NOW (1-800-435-7669) or make an online contribution to the Disaster Relief Fund at www.redcross.org.

Task Force Response

* On Tuesday, Secretary Of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff Activated The National Response Plan To Ensure That Help Gets To Those Most In Need. The National Response Plan (NRP) fully mobilizes the resources of the entire federal government to support response and recovery efforts for state and local authorities - particularly in the event of a catastrophic incident. Secretary Chertoff has declared the devastation caused by Hurricane Katrina an incident of national significance - the first-ever use of this designation.

o FEMA Is Moving Resources And Supplies Into The Hardest Hit Areas As Quickly As Possible. To date, the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) has deployed more than 50 Disaster Medical Assistance Teams, more than 25 Urban Search and Rescue task forces, eight swift water rescue teams, and two Incident Support Teams. FEMA is also working to deliver water, ice, meals, medical supplies, generators, tents, and tarps. There are currently more than 1,700 trucks which have been mobilized to move these supplies into position.

o FEMA And The Army Corps of Engineers Are Working With Louisiana Officials To Repair The Breaches In The Levees To Stop The Flooding In New Orleans.

* The Federal Government Is Working To Help Relocate Those Displaced By The Hurricane. Those in New Orleans who were taking shelter in the Superdome are being moved to the Astrodome in Houston, and FEMA is working to provide tents and shelter. In addition, the Departments of Housing and Urban Development, Agriculture, and Health and Human Services (HHS) are working with local communities to provide help to those who have been displaced from their homes.

* This Morning, Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman Announced That The Strategic Petroleum Reserve Will Be Used To Help Fulfill Demand For Oil. Refineries that are short on supplies of crude oil will have access to supplies from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve to help avert a disruption in the supply of gasoline to drivers and businesses across the country.

* The Energy Department Is Working To Restore Electricity To Affected Areas. The Energy Department has deployed personnel and is working with local power companies, local authorities, and state authorities to help get electricity functioning. The Energy Department is also taking steps to ensure the repair and continuity of oil and gas pipelines that may have been affected by power outages.

* EPA Has Issued Fuel Waivers To Expedite Relief and Recovery. EPA has issued temporary waivers to make additional supplies of gasoline and diesel fuel available in those areas of the country with shortages of specific fuel blends required under the Clean Air Act.

* The Department Of Defense Is Moving Military Resources Into The Gulf States To Aid In Rescue And Recovery. Eight Navy ships have moved into the area with water, food, medicine, hospital facilities, berthing, and more. DOD has responded to all FEMA requests and is providing logistical help, including helicopters, activation of air stations in strategic areas, and strategic lift support.

* The United States Coast Guard Is Conducting Search And Rescue. The Coast Guard has rescued and assisted thousands of people in the affected areas, and its efforts will continue until all those at risk are safe.

* Health And Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt Has Declared A Public Health Emergency, Which Facilitates Provision Of Medical Services In The Affected Region. HHS has delivered requested medical supplies to Louisiana, including basic first aid materials, blankets and patient clothing, suture kits, sterile gloves, stethoscopes, blood pressure measuring kits, and portable oxygen tanks. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is working to address the risk of disease caused by Hurricane Katrina. HHS has placed 415 Public Health Service Officers on stand-by for deployment to support medical response in the affected states. HHS and CDC are working with local officials to identify hospital facilities, distribute medical supplies, and execute a public health plan to control disease and other risks to public health.


From whitehouse.gov if you'd care to take off your blinders and look it up.

Billy, thanks for 'playing' with xalophus while I was away. Nice job. Very Happy Poor xalophus is tripping over himself right now. I quit reading his post after only a few minutes. He likes putting words in people's mouth, doesn't he? He also completely disregards facts in order to 'debate'.
S3nd K3ys
Billy, is this the pict you were talking about? There's got to be 300 to 500 busses there!



It is 100% Mayor Schoolbus's fault for not allowing them to be used because he didn't want 'non-union' drivers to drive them.

Then, AFTER the storm, THIS is what that turd had to say...

Quote:
"I need reinforcements. I need troops, man. I need 500 buses, man and we are talking - one of the briefings we were talking about public school bus drivers and come down here and bus people. I'm like you gotta be kidding me. This is a national disaster. Get every doggawn Greyhound busline in the country and get their asses moving to New Orleans. That's them thinking small, man and this a major, major, MAJOR deal. And I can't emphasize it enough, man. This is crazy..."


That poor bastard is blaming everyone but the person most responsible, HIMSELF.
xalophus
S3nd K3ys wrote:
Poor xalophus is tripping over himself right now.

You've come down to this now, haven't you ?
As I said before, I do not think it's right to get insulted by any taunts that you throw at me personally.
I'll feel free to ignore your opinions in this regard.
And if you are trying to pull me into mud-slinging by provoking me, you'll be most disappointed.
I'm not going to stoop so low and start talking like you do.

Quote:
He likes putting words in people's mouth, doesn't he?
When and where ? Please.
Quote:
He also completely disregards facts in order to 'debate'
When, where and which "facts" ? Please.

S3nd K3ys wrote:
Wow, xalophus... perhaps you didn't get the memo?

Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency for Louisiana
By VOA News
28 August 2005

Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency
Sunday, August 28, 2005



Available from MANY sources.

I wrote:
Did you say Bush declared state of emergency on 28th ?

I also wrote:
2. Closed mindedness, Stubbornness and Denial.
3. Selective receptiveness towards facts.


But again, that's because you didn't even read my post !
what else can be expected ?
S3nd K3ys wrote:
I quit reading his post after only a few minutes
So you are here to sing your song, as loud as possible, without listening to what others have to say ?
You call that debate ?

The dictionary doesn't.

S3nd K3ys wrote:
it sure got quiet in here didn't it?
You want to know why it was quiet ? Why yours was the only voice you could hear ?
It's because you turn a deaf ear towards others, unless they agree with you.



Quote:
The President Is Directing Federal Agencies Throughout The Government To Do All In Their Power To Assist The Victims Of Hurricane Katrina. The top priority is to save and sustain lives. Today, President Bush convened a Cabinet-level task force on Hurricane Katrina response and recovery. Residents of the Gulf Coast states affected by the hurricane have lost loved ones, lost homes, and been displaced from their communities, and they will have the full support of the Federal government.

* The President Has Given The Department Of Homeland Security (DHS) Authority To Coordinate The Response. The President announced that Secretary of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff will chair the interagency task force while Michael Brown, DHS Undersecretary for Emergency Preparedness and Response, is serving as the Administration's lead on the ground.

This is how close to the ground, the "Administration's lead on the ground" was -
Quote:
"There's still time to take action now, but you must be prepared and take shelter and other emergency precautions immediately" - Michael Brown, Director, FEMA
Quote:
"I was impressed with the evacuation, once it was ordered it was very smooth" - Michael Brown, Director, FEMA
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4216508.stm
Not to forget -
Quote:
"Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job" - President Bush, Sept 2nd
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/09/20050902-2.html
I'll come back to Department of Homeland security later.

Quote:
The President Has Called On All Americans To Support The Relief And Rescue Efforts Through Charitable Contributions And Aid. Americans who wish to contribute can do so by contacting charities that are assisting with hurricane relief. For example, citizens can call the Red Cross at 1-800-HELP-NOW (1-800-435-7669) or make an online contribution to the Disaster Relief Fund at www.redcross.org.

Charity ? donations to red cross ?
what for ? They are not allowed to do their job.
Quote:
"The Homeland Security Department has requested and continues to request that the American Red Cross not come back into New Orleans" - Renita Hosler, Spokeswoman, Red Cross
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05246/565143.stm


Quote:
On Tuesday, Secretary Of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff Activated The National Response Plan To Ensure That Help Gets To Those Most In Need. The National Response Plan (NRP) fully mobilizes the resources of the entire federal government to support response and recovery efforts for state and local authorities - particularly in the event of a catastrophic incident. Secretary Chertoff has declared the devastation caused by Hurricane Katrina an incident of national significance - the first-ever use of this designation.[/

* FEMA Is Moving Resources And Supplies Into The Hardest Hit Areas As Quickly As Possible. To date, the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) has deployed more than 50 Disaster Medical Assistance Teams, more than 25 Urban Search and Rescue task forces, eight swift water rescue teams, and two Incident Support Teams. FEMA is also working to deliver water, ice, meals, medical supplies, generators, tents, and tarps. There are currently more than 1,700 trucks which have been mobilized to move these supplies into position.

* The Federal Government Is Working To Help Relocate Those Displaced By The Hurricane. Those in New Orleans who were taking shelter in the Superdome are being moved to the Astrodome in Houston, and FEMA is working to provide tents and shelter. In addition, the Departments of Housing and Urban Development, Agriculture, and Health and Human Services (HHS) are working with local communities to provide help to those who have been displaced from their homes.

* The Department Of Defense Is Moving Military Resources Into The Gulf States To Aid In Rescue And Recovery. Eight Navy ships have moved into the area with water, food, medicine, hospital facilities, berthing, and more. DOD has responded to all FEMA requests and is providing logistical help, including helicopters, activation of air stations in strategic areas, and strategic lift support.

They were sending aid 48 hours later !?
Even then it did not arrive in time. (they took more than 72 hours)
And did not do their job well.
Quote:
For 72 hours this police department and the fire department and handful of citizens were alone rescuing people. We have people who died while the National Guard sat and played cards.
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20050903/ts_alt_afp/usweatherpolice_050903215815

Quote:
The United States Coast Guard Is Conducting Search And Rescue. The Coast Guard has rescued and assisted thousands of people in the affected areas, and its efforts will continue until all those at risk are safe.

* Health And Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt Has Declared A Public Health Emergency, Which Facilitates Provision Of Medical Services In The Affected Region. HHS has delivered requested medical supplies to Louisiana, including basic first aid materials, blankets and patient clothing, suture kits, sterile gloves, stethoscopes, blood pressure measuring kits, and portable oxygen tanks. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is working to address the risk of disease caused by Hurricane Katrina. HHS has placed 415 Public Health Service Officers on stand-by for deployment to support medical response in the affected states. HHS and CDC are working with local officials to identify hospital facilities, distribute medical supplies, and execute a public health plan to control disease and other risks to public health.

Coast guard and HHS are perhaps the only saving grace in the whole episode.
But when people are stranded for almost a week without any help, it's not exactly "swift" by any standards.

Quote:
FEMA And The Army Corps of Engineers Are Working With Louisiana Officials To Repair The Breaches In The Levees To Stop The Flooding In New Orleans.

Quote:
Army engineers and contractors have now sealed one of the three levee gaps left by Katrina
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4214504.stm
This is dated 5th Sept.
7 days after the levees were breached.
The Engineers are working at frantic pace, yes. And I'm serious when I say that.
But if only the predictions were taken seriously. Many lives could have been saved.


Quote:
The President Has Called For The Coordination Of All Parties Involved In The Response And Relief Efforts. Federal, state, and local governments are working side-by-side to deliver relief to the areas physically damaged by Hurricane Katrina and to communities across the South that will be affected in the aftermath of the storm. Efforts and resources are focused on saving lives, sustaining lives, and supporting long-term recovery.
Unfortunately, what the President called for never happened. There was an obvious lack of coordination.

I'll not be commenting on the plans for actions which are not directly related to ground based rescue work. The debate was never about ensuring adequate oil supplies or sustaining businesses.
I was talking about people who were dying.


Still think that the rescue operations were fast ?
Quote:
Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said troops had secured the city and that full relief operations were under way.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4213932.stm
This is dated 4th Sept.
6 days after the hurricane landfall.
If it takes 6 days for full relief operations to get under way, who can call that fast action ?

S3nd K3ys wrote:
From whitehouse.gov if you'd care to take off your blinders and look it up.
In case you didn't know, whitehouse.gov is the federal government's site.
Please do not expect to find anything but the governments "achievements" there.
Nothing but what the federal government tells you.

You cite your source of information as the whitehouse (also Jack Kelly), and you are asking me to take off my "blinders" ??
Amazing !



I'd like to know your opinions on -
- The president's public denial of prior knowledge of the extent of threat
- The "heck of a job" done by the federal agencies
- The refusal and active blocking of aide by the federal agencies
- The "pass the buck" blame game !

And, I'm afraid, you're going to have to read my posts to do that.

I ask for you to stop shouting for a moment, and answer my posts. (especially the one just before this)
By not reading and responding to them, and by unilaterally shouting your propaganda, You're only making it clear that you don't have any answer to those charges.
You can only shout the same thing, in huge fonts, but you do not have enough substance to counter any of that.

Countering the opposing sides' arguments is an indispensable part of any debate.
I don't see you doing that.
Your only repeatedly shouting your side.
Your best bet is to compel the moderators to lock this thread, alleast that way the shallowness of your talk and the lack of substance in it will not be further exposed.
For a person who once demanded proof, you sure ran out of proof fast.


But Wait...Even President Bush could not counter these charges.
Quote:
"Katrina exposed serious problems in our response capability at all levels of government" - President Bush
Quote:
"And to the extent that the federal government didn't fully do its job right, I take responsibility. I want to know what went right and what went wrong" - President Bush
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/katrina_washington
He accepted the federal agencies' mistakes.
And yet you, my friend, are not ready to accept it !!!


S3nd K3ys wrote:
Billy, thanks for 'playing' with xalophus while I was away. Nice job. Very Happy
It amuses me that you use such language.

In case you don't realise it, You are not acting like a mature person.

I wrote:
1. Personal attacks and flaming.
2. Closed mindedness, Stubbornness and Denial.
3. Selective receptiveness towards facts.
4. Dubbing anything that they don't like as Lie and fabrication.
5. Collectively making fun of people with opinions different from theirs.
6. A whole lot of agreement and back-patting amongst themselves.
7. Bliss.
Rolling Eyes
S3nd K3ys
I'm only going to give you aother minute of my time, as it's not worth it to me to argue with someone blatently disregarding FACTS.



xalophus wrote:

Quote:
He likes putting words in people's mouth, doesn't he?
When and where ? Please.


Your very first sentance.

Quote:
To say that the best possible preparations


Quote:
Quote:
He also completely disregards facts in order to 'debate'
When, where and which "facts" ? Please....


FACTS. (Not from whitehouse.gov, BTW)

Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency for Louisiana
By VOA News
28 August 2005



President Bush has declared a state of emergency for the Gulf Coast state of Louisiana, as it braces for the expected onslaught of Hurricane Katrina, set to make landfall on Monday.

Saturday's emergency declaration authorizes federal officials to coordinate all disaster relief efforts and provide appropriate assistance in several Louisiana parishes.


Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency
Sunday, August 28, 2005



Not to mention:

State and local officials BLOCKED relief efforts. FACT

Mayor Schoolbus BLOCKED Amtrak and several others that offered to help evacuate people. FACT

Many times LESS people died than first claimed by the bushy haters. FACT

Have a nice day. Very Happy
S3nd K3ys
Here is the story about the young man that decided not to wait on Mayor Schoolbus to get the buses moving out of New Orleans, or for the Feds to come get him.

ScienceDaily

Quote:
Borrowed bus takes victims to Houston

HOUSTON, Sept. 1 (UPI) -- The first New Orleans refugees to reach Houston's Astrodome overnight were stuffed into a commandeered school bus.

Some of the passengers were among those leaving the New Orleans Superdome and others were picked up along the way, the Houston Chronicle said Thursday.

Jabbar Gibson, 20, said police in New Orleans, ravaged by Hurricane Katrina, told him to take the bus.

Gibson said he picked up stranded people, some of them infants, along the way. Some of those on board had been in the Superdome among those who were supposed to be evacuated to Houston on more than 400 buses Wednesday and Thursday but could not wait.

...

Copyright 2005 by United Press International. All Rights Reserved.


It is all on the local government, not the Feds. How many people could they have moved out of town in 3 days with these?



The more I think about it, the more I have to question; was this a National Disaster? No, it was a disaster that affected 4 states. All of which had ample time to prepare their citizens for it, and make plans for evacuations. The federal government initiated states of disaster before the storm made landfall, to make the aid available to those who would inevitably need it.

Credit a lousy mayor (of N.O.) and Governor (of LA) for the lack of efficient initial response. If they had asked ahead of time, the federal response could have happened sooner.

I feel bad for those who lost life or property due to the storm, but not for anyone who was given three days notice to get the heck out of Dodge but decided to stay and weather the storm only to complain about a lack of help after the fact. Those that could not get out, should have been helped out (the fact that a hospital was not evacuated is abhorrent), and there was ample time and seemingly resource for this. This should have been coordinated on a local or state level, not a federal one. The city of N.O. has one of the most ineffective municipal governments in the country, but THAT'S NOT THE FED's PROBLEM TO RESOLVE.
xalophus
S3nd K3ys wrote:
Your very first sentance.

Quote:
To say that the best possible preparations

And I put these words into whose mouth exactly ?
I merely said that the best possible preparations were not in place despite the known threat posed by a hurricane and despite the knowledge of a CAT3+ hurricane inbound.
And that is a FACT.

S3nd K3ys wrote:
FACTS. (Not from whitehouse.gov, BTW)

Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency for Louisiana
By VOA News
28 August 2005



President Bush has declared a state of emergency for the Gulf Coast state of Louisiana, as it braces for the expected onslaught of Hurricane Katrina, set to make landfall on Monday.

Saturday's emergency declaration authorizes federal officials to coordinate all disaster relief efforts and provide appropriate assistance in several Louisiana parishes.


Quote:
Bush Declares State of Emergency
Sunday, August 28, 2005


If you only read what I've written, you'd know that I accepted this fact.
I wrote:
Did you say Bush declared state of emergency on 28th ?



S3nd K3ys wrote:
State and local officials BLOCKED relief efforts. FACT

Mayor Schoolbus BLOCKED Amtrak and several others that offered to help evacuate people. FACT
So did FEMA.
I've posted proof before, read my previous posts.

YET, I never denied the failure of state government
I wrote:
Wasn't this disaster clearly beyond the capabilities of the state and local government ?
doesn't the responsibility then rest with the federal goverment ?



S3nd K3ys wrote:
Many times LESS people died than first claimed by the bushy haters. FACT
Quote:
On Sunday, U.S. Health and Human Services Secretary Michael Leavitt said it was evident that thousands died.
http://www.voanews.com/english/2005-09-04-voa21.cfm
The feds didn't arrive until 72 hours later, please don't take all the credit for the relatively lower death toll.

and YET, upto this point, I never said anything about the death toll, whatsoever.


You seemed to have turned a deaf ear towards it, but I'll once again ask you to respond to and counter my previous posts, before you start making further personal attacks against me.
OR atleast accept that you have got nothing to counter them with.

I wrote:
I'd like to know your opinions on -
- The president's public denial of prior knowledge of the extent of threat
- The "heck of a job" done by the federal agencies
- The refusal and active blocking of aide by the federal agencies
- The "pass the buck" blame game !



S3nd K3ys wrote:
I'm only going to give you aother minute of my time, as it's not worth it to me to argue with someone blatently disregarding FACTS.

Giving up already ?
I'm pretty sure you wouldn't give up if you had any thing more to say, any thing to prove your point, any thing to back you up apart from insults and personal attacks.
That's ok...I never actually expected you to face and accept it like a good forum citizen.
Your debates, it seems, are over as soon as someone opines differently from you, as soon as somebody interrupts or questions the dissemination of your doctrine.


By the way, you don't think it's worth your time to argue with someone whom you charge with disregarding facts ?
You know what actually amounts to "blatently disregarding FACTS." ?
Quote:
"And to the extent that the federal government didn't fully do its job right, I take responsibility. I want to know what went right and what went wrong" - President Bush
S3nd K3ys wrote:
It is all on the local government, not the Feds




S3nd K3ys wrote:
Have a nice day. Very Happy
You too. Very Happy
Billy Hill
Quote:
It is all on the local government, not the Feds. How many people could they have moved out of town in 3 days with these?


Most of it, IMO, is lower government's fault. But you must include FEMA, which IS a Federal entity, and which did fail.
S3nd K3ys
Billy Hill wrote:
Quote:
It is all on the local government, not the Feds. How many people could they have moved out of town in 3 days with these?


Most of it, IMO, is lower government's fault. But you must include FEMA, which IS a Federal entity, and which did fail.


Agreed. Most of my statements concerning the feds were in reference to the Pres, but you're right... FEMA is a federal agency and has some serious issues.

It's those dolts that simply lay the blame on the pres without any real knowledge of what's really going on, or, for that matter, what the 'chain of command' is.

Some here would have you believe it's the Pres's job to be in the trenches doing the dirty work, and that, if there's any kind of 'situation', that he should NOT go on with his day to day things.

Kind of like when he takes a 5 week vacation, some turds want to make it seem like he's not doing anything during that period, or that the Dems never take vacations or play golf etc.
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