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Is Barack Obama "The One"?





MaxStirner
Although I am not eligible to vote in the US and am following the primaries only from afar, I have to grudgingly admit that Sen. Obama seems a somewhat refreshing new face in the American political circus ... at least new from my standpoint outside the country, I'm sure as US Senator he has been in the national news.
Although I very generally sympathize with his positions on a number of subjects (although most of these seem identical to Sen. Clinton's), politicians' campaign promises have never failed to disappoint me after the election. What has begun to captivate me a bit is hearing him speak, not only during the current primaries, but on a number political talk shows in 2005-7. He is able to put across concepts and emotions in a way none of the other candidates are able to: Senators Clinton and McCain can certainly not hold a candle to him, Mr. Huckabee at least has his own style which probably appeals to a number of people (especially those who can follow his sports metaphors).
Born in the late 50ies, I missed President Kennedy by a few years, but I do very well recall hearing his brother Bobby as well as the awe-inspiring Dr. King speak. Although not in any way wanting to compare Sen. Obama with any one specific person, I was wondering if he is in any way able to captivate a larger part of the country in a similar way, advocating a "new beginning" or "a change" of direction?
liljp617
Well, so far throughout the primaries, it seems his ability to take hold of people and put a sort of "utopia" type of idea in their head has worked. He is a very good speaker and very intelligent. Hopefully his policy-making is on par with that. I do believe he's very refreshing to see; he's not the typical Washington politician who constantly beats around the bush, never answers questions directly, is out for himself, etc. I think him having not been in DC for very long has helped this. Clinton is -.- She's no different than any recent crappy President. She's a direct replica of Washington...and Washington is terrible.
BigMo420
Obama is not the one. He tries to pass himself off as secretly being Muslim but he is NOT! He should have his tongue cut out for trying to fool my brothers and pretend to serve Alah!
smspno
If I were in the right to vote in the USA, I would certainly put a tick nex to Barack Obama's name! He brings a hope for change into American politics (which is undoubtedly an important issue for every country in the world). Furthermore, his political programme and the entire image appeal to me.
Yes we can! Smile
liljp617
BigMo420 wrote:
Obama is not the one. He tries to pass himself off as secretly being Muslim but he is NOT! He should have his tongue cut out for trying to fool my brothers and pretend to serve Alah!

Actually the only time he's mentioned the word "Muslim" in his campaign is when speaking about Muslim extremists and the few times he's had to clear up the fact that he does not practice Islam and he is not a practicing Muslim. He's stated very clearly he has practiced Christianity for 30 or so years now. And yes, he has Muslim heritage. Drop your bias and propaganda for a few minutes to see reality.
jwellsy
Barack Hussien could easily be the anti-Christ.
liljp617
jwellsy wrote:
Barack Hussien could easily be the anti-Christ.

And here we are again Smile Religion is irrelevant. Christ may not have even existed. You're speaking on a hypothesis.
Klaw 2
BigMo420 wrote:
Obama is not the one. He tries to pass himself off as secretly being Muslim but he is NOT! He should have his tongue cut out for trying to fool my brothers and pretend to serve Alah!


He didn't pass himself as a muslim, he descends from muslims. He is very Christian so whats the point. And passing yourself as a muslim in USA wouldn't be very positive for the amounts of votes he'll get.

So keep the tung cutting part for yourself. It's stupid, bad, evil. Im sorry but you look a extremist to me and I don't like extremist with a whole lot of other people. And you might get banned so better watch your mouth a bit.

jwellsy wrote:
Barack Hussien could easily be the anti-Christ.

PFFF anti-christ why is he an anti-Christ??
matomarx
I think the election campaigns in the US is strange. It's based on the personality of the candidates and not so much on what they actually want to do.

I think that political change must come from the roots by people organizing themselves. The upper class allready does and is much more consious about their interests as a class. The working class already act in line with their interests but often from an individual point of view ( for example stealing from their jobs, talking shit about the boss and so on). To make a real difference however you must organize, like the upper class does. And to do that you must be aware of which class you belong to and what your'e interests are.

Candidates try to find a compromise between classes in order to keep things running as smooth as possible. There are parties that are more to the left and more to the right but the difference is very small. They only have different strategies of keeping the system running. Therefor I think that the election campaign and the candidates is uninteresting, at least as an way of changing society
liljp617
matomarx wrote:
I think the election campaigns in the US is strange. It's based on the personality of the candidates and not so much on what they actually want to do.

I think that political change must come from the roots by people organizing themselves. The upper class allready does and is much more consious about their interests as a class. The working class already act in line with their interests but often from an individual point of view ( for example stealing from their jobs, talking shit about the boss and so on). To make a real difference however you must organize, like the upper class does. And to do that you must be aware of which class you belong to and what your'e interests are.

Candidates try to find a compromise between classes in order to keep things running as smooth as possible. There are parties that are more to the left and more to the right but the difference is very small. They only have different strategies of keeping the system running. Therefor I think that the election campaign and the candidates is uninteresting, at least as an way of changing society

Well, on the democratic side, the policy views between Clinton and Obama is basically identical. So the only thing really to vote on is whether the person appeals to you, how they carry themselves, how intelligent they are, how well they can handle pressure, etc.
Aredon
BigMo420 wrote:
Obama is not the one. He tries to pass himself off as secretly being Muslim but he is NOT! He should have his tongue cut out for trying to fool my brothers and pretend to serve Alah!

Perfect example of someone blindly following propaganda they heard from someone or read on the Internet. Obama is not Muslim and has never claimed to be, not even once. Aside from that he wasn't sworn in on the Koran (as is often told as part of the retarded rumor).
ganz
Honestly if it came down to a vote between Giuliani and Obama, Barrack would get my vote. I've said it before too. Obama's complete lack of experience works to his advantage in my eyes, since I tend to equate every living senator with greed, lobbyists, pandering, hookers, and blow.

I get the feeling that if he tries some program or something that bombs right out of the gate he won't be stuck in the Washington status quo and he'll try to right the wrong, whereas Clinton, Edwards, Giuliani, Romney, among others, would definitely just spin the way it was getting reported so it looked like a great success. Then 20 years down the road and 50 trillion tax dollars later we have to offer up comprehensive legislation to fix or get rid of it. a guy who hasn't been around that bs long enough to know how it works or want any part of it might be immune.

I think with a good cabinet experience doesn't mean much. the job is more about judgement and instincts.

Obama's one of the more liberal candidates in the top tier, which is not exactly lined up with my beliefs, but i get the feeling he's actually a liberal and not just a democrat, or even a politician. it's nice to get somebody who actually believes the shit they say instead of saying what polls tell them they should believe.
liljp617
@above Smile Giuliani is out of the race...a long time ago.
BigMo420
Aredon wrote:
Perfect example of someone blindly following propaganda they heard from someone or read on the Internet.


You know nothing about me. Just as I know nothing about YOU. You have no idea how many of his speaches I have heard in Hawaii, Illinois, and others. You have no idea how many of his books I have read.

YOU HAVE NO IDEA, SO KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT ABOUT ME!

Quote:
Obama is not Muslim and has never claimed to be, not even once.


How many times have you heard him speak? (I mean BEFORE he started running for US President) HOW MANY!!??

Had you gone to even ONE of his public speaking arrangements you would have clearly seen his reaching out to Muslims and him praising Allah.

You do yourself a favor and don't try to claim you KNOW me because you DONT!

Are we clear?
Rolling Eyes
Bikerman
BigMo420 wrote:
You do yourself a favor and don't try to claim you KNOW me because you DONT! Are we clear?
Rolling Eyes

What we do know about you is what you post. Calling for people's tongues to be cut out, for example.
Since it is you that claims Obama is trying, secretly, to pass himself off as a Muslim, then it is up to you to provide evidence for that claim.
BigMo420
Bikerman wrote:
BigMo420 wrote:
You do yourself a favor and don't try to claim you KNOW me because you DONT! Are we clear?
Rolling Eyes

What we do know about you is what you post. Calling for people's tongues to be cut out, for example.
Since it is you that claims Obama is trying, secretly, to pass himself off as a Muslim, then it is up to you to provide evidence for that claim.


Look, the guy said I was "blindly" following someone based on someone else's interpretations of them. That's NOT the case. NOW are we clear? Rolling Eyes
Bikerman
BigMo420 wrote:
Look, the guy said I was "blindly" following someone based on someone else's interpretations of them. That's NOT the case. NOW are we clear? Rolling Eyes
I'm not referring to what someone else said - that is their business.
I'm asking you to justify your claim that Obama is secretly passing himself off as a Muslim...
BigMo420
Bikerman wrote:
BigMo420 wrote:
Look, the guy said I was "blindly" following someone based on someone else's interpretations of them. That's NOT the case. NOW are we clear? Rolling Eyes
I'm not referring to what someone else said - that is their business.
I'm asking you to justify your claim that Obama is secretly passing himself off as a Muslim...


When he speaks in front of Muslims, he tries to make us believe he IS Muslim. It's a lie!
Bikerman
BigMo420 wrote:
Bikerman wrote:
BigMo420 wrote:
Look, the guy said I was "blindly" following someone based on someone else's interpretations of them. That's NOT the case. NOW are we clear? Rolling Eyes
I'm not referring to what someone else said - that is their business.
I'm asking you to justify your claim that Obama is secretly passing himself off as a Muslim...


When he speaks in front of Muslims, he tries to make us believe he IS Muslim. It's a lie!

Have you got a link to any such speech? I presume that, like our politicians here, his public speaches are released to the press prior to the event, so there should be some public record.
mikedonn71
Obamaniacs are a frightening presence on the US political landscape. Fainting and screaming about wanting to commit adultery with the man in front of his weak-willed wife is simply disgraceful behavior, girls. It's like a three ring circus in every town with an evangelistic R-Kelly conducting the choir of crazies.

Don't any of these people know about Charles Manson, Jim Jones and David Koresh? They short circuited the brains of young people in their generations as well, and look what came to pass. Why are people still willing to drink the Kool-Aid ditching common sense and reason?

Obama is a truly frightening figure, because unlike Manson, Koresh and Jim Jones, Obama commands mainstream media adoration that's almost as absurd as the ovations he gets from libido-inflamed teenyboppers.

As a 36 y/o adult, I find the prospect of this guy in the White House frankly disturbing. He's NOT the Second Coming of Christ, kids. Stop it.
liljp617
mikedonn71 wrote:
Obamaniacs are a frightening presence on the US political landscape. Fainting and screaming about wanting to commit adultery with the man in front of his weak-willed wife is simply disgraceful behavior, girls. It's like a three ring circus in every town with an evangelistic R-Kelly conducting the choir of crazies.

Don't any of these people know about Charles Manson, Jim Jones and David Koresh? They short circuited the brains of young people in their generations as well, and look what came to pass. Why are people still willing to drink the Kool-Aid ditching common sense and reason?

Obama is a truly frightening figure, because unlike Manson, Koresh and Jim Jones, Obama commands mainstream media adoration that's almost as absurd as the ovations he gets from libido-inflamed teenyboppers.

As a 36 y/o adult, I find the prospect of this guy in the White House frankly disturbing. He's NOT the Second Coming of Christ, kids. Stop it.

lmao you just compared an intelligent, charismatic, Senate member running for President of the United States to mass murderers who constantly used hard drugs. Think for a minute please Smile

Please enlighten us with sources that show people fainting at his rallies and people screaming about wanting to commit adultery at his rallies. It appears you're nothing more than a right-wing smear Obama clown...

And what exactly is common sense and reasoning? Clinton? McCain? Not really. I've had about enough of the Bush/Clinton dynasty. They've done enough harm to the country, we don't need more when we know it runs in the families. We don't need a 60 year old woman or a 70 year old man. The world isn't the way they view it anymore. We don't need a President who refuses to speak with other countries because "we don't like them." We don't need another President who self-proclaims NAFTA a huge accomplishment of the Clinton Presidency, then goes on to say at a rally that NAFTA is a bad plan and ships jobs out of the country. We don't need a President who has this inherited idea that being in a state of war is good. We don't need a President who is going to FORCE people to buy healthcare, and if they don't purchase it they'll be fined by the government. The list goes on and on. Instead of attacking Obama, perhaps you could point out the fallacies in his campaign and why the other candidates are better. Comparing him to mass murderers and people on death row is completely unnecessary and, frankly, incredibly stupid.
mikedonn71
liljp617:

What do you think about the Farrakhan endorsement of Obama? Is the Nation of Islam a cult?



http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=4337417
mikedonn71
You said:
Quote:
We don't need another President who self-proclaims NAFTA a huge accomplishment of the Clinton Presidency, then goes on to say at a rally that NAFTA is a bad plan and ships jobs out of the country.


Ross Perot also said that NAFTA was a mistake. In 1994, Al Gore and the Democratic Party made a joke out of Perot in the Democrat-friendly media and ended his political career. Patrick Buchanan and others who joined Perot in attacking NAFTA were smeared as anti-Mexican racists.

The Democrats did everything they could to get NAFTA passed and everything they could to destroy the American working class. The labor movement told Clinton to get screwed, and the Republicans won back Congress that November. Union members stayed at home and didn't vote.

Personally I think Perot and Buchanan were correct about NAFTA. Obama picking up on the mistakes of the Democrats and center-right Republicans 14 years after the fact is too little too late.

Democrats are the cause of Democrats losing the votes of rank and file Democrats. We're tired of their shit, my friend. [/quote]
BigMo420
Bikerman wrote:
Have you got a link to any such speech?


No. I didn't take notes and I don't have a 'link'. I was at a speech.

Quote:
What do you think about the Farrakhan endorsement of Obama? Is the Nation of Islam a cult?


Not "all" Muslims support him. Wink
MaxStirner
BigMo420 wrote:
Bikerman wrote:
Have you got a link to any such speech?

No. I didn't take notes and I don't have a 'link'. I was at a speech.
...
Not "all" Muslims support him. Wink


Of course no one usually takes notes at a speech, but perhaps you could let us know where and when this speech was held (as exactly as possible pls, not only "in Oct. near Poughkeepsie") and I'll be glad to do the research. It couldn't have been a clandestine meeting (or were these Muslim Freemasons ?) You seem to not realize that if this is (were) true it would not only be of interest in this forum but very probably would earn you a 1-hour interview with Larry King. Hoping to hear from you soon.
MaxStirner
mikedonn71 wrote:
liljp617:
What do you think about the Farrakhan endorsement of Obama? Is the Nation of Islam a cult?
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=4337417

It is certainly a good, debatable question probably deserving its own thread at this forum. Since I am old enough to recall the times of King, Malcolm X, Farrakhan and the Panthers, I would (with hindsight) probably have to admit that they are, but the contributions of The Nation of Islam regarding racial integration in the US (but not only there) are, in my opinion, meaningful enough counterbalance much of the negative sides attributed to cults. I certainly was more of an admirer of Dr. King, but then again my skin is white and no one burned crosses on my front lawn or lynched members of my family in Georgia or Mississippi.
BigMo420
MaxStirner wrote:
if this is (were) true it would not only be of interest in this forum but very probably would earn you a 1-hour interview with Larry King. Hoping to hear from you soon.


Sarcasm noted.

Of course he did not come out and say he was Muslim. I never said he did. It was very much like what Hillary does when she's in the south; tries to act like a southerner with the accents and all. It's an insult to anyone she tries to mimic.

Please do yourself a favor and go back and re-read my post before commenting errantly again. Thanks.
liljp617
mikedonn71 wrote:
liljp617:

What do you think about the Farrakhan endorsement of Obama? Is the Nation of Islam a cult?



http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=4337417

If you wish to call it that, sure. Although you would have to define the meaning of cult in the way you're using it before I gave a full answer. He didn't ask for their endorsement that I'm aware of. Nor is he even related to Islam outside of the fact that he was born into it and has Muslim heritage (something out of his control)...so it seems kind of irrelevant. They've done their fair share fighting for black rights and desegregation. To me, a cult is a group that does nothing positive...I would say their group has made some odd/wrong comments, but they've contributed positive things to the American society. And I don't really know how this puts him on the level of being compared to mass murderers/people on death row. Or how this relates to your absurd comment that people are fainting at his rallies and rallying to commit adultery. If you can't prove those types of comments (comments obviously meant to smear his image for no reason), then don't mention them.

mikedonn71 wrote:
You said:
Quote:
We don't need another President who self-proclaims NAFTA a huge accomplishment of the Clinton Presidency, then goes on to say at a rally that NAFTA is a bad plan and ships jobs out of the country.


Ross Perot also said that NAFTA was a mistake. In 1994, Al Gore and the Democratic Party made a joke out of Perot in the Democrat-friendly media and ended his political career. Patrick Buchanan and others who joined Perot in attacking NAFTA were smeared as anti-Mexican racists.

The Democrats did everything they could to get NAFTA passed and everything they could to destroy the American working class. The labor movement told Clinton to get screwed, and the Republicans won back Congress that November. Union members stayed at home and didn't vote.

Personally I think Perot and Buchanan were correct about NAFTA. Obama picking up on the mistakes of the Democrats and center-right Republicans 14 years after the fact is too little too late.

Democrats are the cause of Democrats losing the votes of rank and file Democrats. We're tired of their shit, my friend.
[/quote]
That wasn't really the point in that statement. The general point was Clinton is a hypocrite and doesn't know what she stands for anymore than anyone else. She stated in her book that NAFTA was a big success for the Clintons in politics and has voted for it on numerous occasions...then went onto say at one of her recent rallies that she plans to "fix" NAFTA because it is horrendous and shipping jobs out of the country. That's just one of the few reasons I don't want her in charge. I think there's much better out there than Obama, Clinton, or McCain, but I'll take the lesser of the evils. If the only thing you can do to smear Obama is compare him to mass murderers and falsely say people are treating him him some evangelistic leader causing people to faint at his rallies and drop all of their past morality....well, I think he has the upper hand.
MaxStirner
BigMo420 wrote:
Obama is not the one. He tries to pass himself off as secretly being Muslim but he is NOT! He should have his tongue cut out for trying to fool my brothers and pretend to serve Alah!

MaxStirner wrote:
Of course no one usually takes notes at a speech, but perhaps you could let us know where and when this speech was held (as exactly as possible pls, not only "in Oct. near Poughkeepsie") and I'll be glad to do the research. It couldn't have been a clandestine meeting (or were these Muslim Freemasons ?) You seem to not realize that if this is (were) true it would not only be of interest in this forum but very probably would earn you a 1-hour interview with Larry King. Hoping to hear from you soon.

BigMo420 wrote:
...
Of course he did not come out and say he was Muslim. I never said he did. It was very much like what Hillary does when she's in the south; tries to act like a southerner with the accents and all. It's an insult to anyone she tries to mimic.
Please do yourself a favor and go back and re-read my post before commenting errantly again. Thanks.
...

I have reread it and I find no contradiction. You stated that you were present somewhere sometime where Sen. Obama, in a speech he held, attempted to "pass himself off ... secretly being Muslim" and Bikerman and I asked for a source. If you are unable or unwilling to provide one, is perfectly alright, it would simply lend some credence to the statement which (with documentation) would certainly be a scoop (even if he happened to state or imply this in his kindergarden years).
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