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Frozen Wave - Possible?





Afaceinthematrix
http://gr8pic.blogspot.com/2007/02/frozen-wave-antarctica.html

Look at that website. There are pictures that are claimed to be a frozen wave in Antarctica. Supposedly the water was pushing threw thin ice, and the second it came out it immediately froze.

I have difficulty in believing this. Do you think the picture is fake? It seems to me that if the water was coming out it would be moving. How cold would it have to be in order to freeze that amount of water almost instantly before it hits the ground, while it's moving? It seems to me that there would be too much energy to freeze it like that.

Does anyone think this is possible, or know how this is even possible?

Edited: I found a grammar error.
Bikerman
I don't think it's possible - in fact I'm pretty damn sure it's not. I don't know exactly what temp would be needed to instantly freeze a dynamic flow of water in that manner but I'm fairly sure it would be well below anything we would experience on Earth. I'm not even sure that it is possible to do so at any conceivable temp (ie absolute zero or thereabouts)..
Afaceinthematrix
Bikerman wrote:
I don't think it's possible - in fact I'm pretty damn sure it's not. I don't know exactly what temp would be needed to instantly freeze a dynamic flow of water in that manner but I'm fairly sure it would be well below anything we would experience on Earth. I'm not even sure that it is possible to do so at any conceivable temp (ie absolute zero or thereabouts)..


Thanks. My friend and I were discussing this and we both felt that it wasn't real. We tried coming up with a way that it could happen, but nothing seemed realistic. Maybe if the water was already partially frozen and it was pushing threw thin ice, slowing coming out, it could happen, but even that doesn't seem realistic.
Bikerman
I have to admit ignorance on this. I simply don't know what mechanisms could produce the observed effects. I'm sure there are people out there who can suggest possibilities. The only contribution I can make is to say that I find it inconceivable that these pictures are the result of a dynamic flow of water (wave) being 'flash frozen'.
Aww..OK...Here's a hypothesis.
Perhaps the photos are of normal ice which has been 'carved' by wind and/or water to form the wave-like structure we see in the photos..
Bannik
well it could be a melting and freezing effect, where the ice glacier melts and freezes making it look like the way it does.

a slow process but it could work
Gagnar The Unruly
I can imagine that water welling up through a crack in the ice could freeze as deposits. The water flowing over the deposits would then freeze, and as more water ran over the deposits more ice would form. That would require the water under the ice to be under some pressure and I'm not sure how realistic that is.

Another idea I had is that it could be a result of tectonic movement of the ice floe.
Bryan_Bezzle
Global warming? Shocked
Bannik
it was america, they are making a new weapon to freeze all the water in the world so they can sell more ice
Bryan_Bezzle
Bannik wrote:
it was america, they are making a new weapon to freeze all the water in the world so they can sell more ice


hahaha it was Luigi! We have found Luigi's shaved ice mecca!
Bannik
Bryan_Bezzle wrote:
Bannik wrote:
it was america, they are making a new weapon to freeze all the water in the world so they can sell more ice


hahaha it was Luigi! We have found Luigi's shaved ice mecca!



LUIGI the true leader of America

but seriously that ice is awsome, I think if i took a bit my coca cola would taste so much better
InsanePL
maybe it`s possible but only on antarctica cuz of temperature. Wave is in movement so I guss it need -40/50 C or more to froze the wave
powers1983
http://www.snopes.com/photos/natural/antarcticwave.asp

Apparently the formations are indeed real and are indeed from Antartica but are formed by uplifted ice being exposed to the elements. They do look very spectacular however.

David.
Bikerman
Ahh, so this confirms the Gagnar/Bikerman hypothesis.
Quick, let's publish in 'Nature' and take the plaudits Smile
jwellsy
Those are way COOL pictures. Laughing
Gagnar The Unruly
Bikerman wrote:
Ahh, so this confirms the Gagnar/Bikerman hypothesis.
Quick, let's publish in 'Nature' and take the plaudits Smile


Agreed. This will look good on my CV.
redace
The pictures are beautiful, but I suppose that what we can see on them is just some fantastic sculputure made by nature itself and it just looks like frozen wave. In my opinion it is impossible for the Antarctic climate to cause moving water to freeze. But unfortunately I have no rigorous proof of this fact.
Gagnar The Unruly
redace wrote:
The pictures are beautiful, but I suppose that what we can see on them is just some fantastic sculputure made by nature itself and it just looks like frozen wave. In my opinion it is impossible for the Antarctic climate to cause moving water to freeze. But unfortunately I have no rigorous proof of this fact.


powers1983 wrote:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/natural/antarcticwave.asp

Apparently the formations are indeed real and are indeed from Antartica but are formed by uplifted ice being exposed to the elements. They do look very spectacular however.

David.


Seems that we already have our answer.
guitarcrazy087
lol, i think they're probably and obviously computer generated. if they were real wave's they wouldn't be nearly as smooth as that. i think someone who sits at a computer all day playing around with modeling programs is probably making everyone think that he was in Antarctica taking pics of frozen waves. anyway, i have no clue if it's possible or not, but from a glance, they really look computer generated. and btw, if he's in antarctica, why is he out there is sweat pants? i just looked at them full size and they don't look as CG as they did before, but i'm still thinking its a hoax
Lord Klorel
a real wave that got be frozen by instant sounds science-fiction. However like i readed on blog site that it is possible that ice was lifted up and in time the elements of nature have shaped this forms.

The only place where liquid turns in to ice in a blink of an eye is somewhere in siberia where it is -60 a -70 degrees Celsius. Someone did a test, a cup of hot water up in the air and whoosh it turned in to ice pieces.
nisibdv
Watching at the photos in the link you posted, it is obvious for me that the ice formations dont correspond to frozen waves and that the "frozen waves" title has more to do with a descriptive-poetic title for the set of photographies. They are very very beautifull shots, and they are true and not edited with a photoshop or something like that. But they are not actual sea waves. These kind of formations can develop in a moving thick ice sheet scenario and an wind-water-friction erosion effects. There are multiple ways nature can produce that forms.
scotty
I don't think that is a frozen wave, and as already stated to freeze moving water couldn't happen on earth and that's neglecting the fact how did it get through the surface without getting distorted. I think it might be an ice shelf or something that has formed like that over many years.
russell192
Think it's really hard to tell..like spontaneus combustion, it's just rare
With global warming and stuff =S
The climate's just freaky now and then.

Well..the water there should be rather pure so not sure what may have caused it but such a thing could be possible.

Well..let's just appreciate the marvelous picture right now Very Happy
Satori
Wow...the amount of replies that come AFTER the conclusion always amaze me. Shows you how many people just read the first post of a thread and then post their own...Am I in a minority then? Don't other people read the entire thread before they post?
DoctorBeaver
Nah - you're all wrong. I'm responsible for it. I was down in Antarctica, bored, and decided to build a dam out of ice. Laughing
arbab
Lolz Razz I dont think so.How could it possible.But indeed pictures are wonderful. Dude it is impossible in my opinion.
Boffel
Well, I think it perhaps could be a tick ice thats melting or something like that.

But a frozen wave? Nah...

It could happend if it was a big wave that was going from a hot land to a cold land, and freeze there, but im not sure lol

Anyway, its cool.
powers1983
Satori wrote:
Wow...the amount of replies that come AFTER the conclusion always amaze me. Shows you how many people just read the first post of a thread and then post their own...Am I in a minority then? Don't other people read the entire thread before they post?


I think you must be. It's a fascinating insight into the minds of some of the posters though - some people with absolutely no idea what they're talking about will try and form an opinion and present it as fact (computer generated pictures, related to spontaneous combustion etc.). I have no more idea than anyone else as to what temperature is needed to be able to take a moving flow of water and freeze it in midair but common sense would tell me that a mass of water of that size would have too much thermal energy to just freeze like that.

And also, the coldest temperature ever recorded was actually in Antartica (-89 degrees C) although it was a Russian team so that might be where the Siberian mixup came from.

David.
Gagnar The Unruly
I dunno, it just seems like it would have to be pretty cold to do that. My guess is that it probably was some ice or something that just got pushed up by other ice. Maybe it scraped and that's why its so smooth, or maybe it rained Exclamation or something (like it's from Alaska or something and not Antarctica). I'd guess it would have to be pretty cold for water to just freeze like that. Plus its salt water so then it probably would never freeze. It could happen if it was fresh water, though.
ocalhoun
I've heard it is possible to flash freeze water, but it is not possible when the water is moving.
Supposedly, if the water is absolutely still, it can be lowered far below freezing without actually freezing, and then it will flash freeze if it is disturbed or if an electrical current is applied.

Even extreme cold was applied to a wave, the outer portions would freeze a little before the inner portions, which would distort it.
Bikerman
ocalhoun wrote:
I've heard it is possible to flash freeze water, but it is not possible when the water is moving.
Supposedly, if the water is absolutely still, it can be lowered far below freezing without actually freezing, and then it will flash freeze if it is disturbed or if an electrical current is applied.

Even extreme cold was applied to a wave, the outer portions would freeze a little before the inner portions, which would distort it.

Moving water can freeze - consider raindrops turning into sleet/snow. The dynamics are, however, very complicated. Basically you have to remove heat from the surface at a faster rate than the heat required to change water at 0 to ice at 0. It's a very complex problem in hydrodynamics/thermodynamics.

Pure water should freeze at 0 when still. Sea water will freeze at a lower temperature - typically -1.8C - -2C depending on the salinity.
MapleNoob
Bryan_Bezzle wrote:
Global warming? Shocked


Yes, if this is true, it was probably caused by global warming.
Ghost Rider103
If it is true, I highly doubt it was caused by global warming. Global warming is kind of a long process, where the earth first warms, then comes to very freezing temperatures. If we are going into global warming, we are in the warming stage, so this would infact not be global warming.

Very cool pictures though.
loonix
Interesting indeed, there are photos of the niagra falls freezing in the early 1900's

http://www.seanbuckley.ca/blog/2006/08/28/niagara-falls-was-frozen-in-1911/

Regards
aspen
http://www.snopes.com/photos/natural/antarcticwave.asp [url][/url]
TheLolmeister
look at dis http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2238603/Frozen-waves-blue-ice-photographed-Tony-Travouillon.html The ice is blue and why is AMAZING Shocked I think that when there is a lot of ice like this, it all is floating due to less density(its compressed) so when it all comes up it forms a wavelike form. Then as water passes over these it freezes, making them smooth.
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