Why did man create the Devil ?
There is a 'man create god' thread - and my first thought was that the first creation must be the devil...
But this really collapse so say? The obvious meaning of the 'devil' creation must be to use it as a 'power toy'. And secondly the escape sentence 'the devil made me do it!!!!!' 
when was the first apperance? the bible? Fallen angel? Still an angel so say? Well, it's an interesting question.
A quick answer would be - I think it is likely that concepts of a 'Devil' or 'Demon' precede the concept of a benign deity. That is to say I think the Devil comes before God.
In pre-history people worshipped forces they did not understand. I think it is extremely likely that the first objects of reverence or worship were those likely to be malign - fear is a powerful incentive to religious worship.
Here is an on-line version of "The History of the Devil & the idea of Evil" by Paul Carus (Written in 1900). The only reason i can think of, is to blame all man's wrong doings on,after all you couldn't go blaming god could you.
In the world around us there is good and evil, no doubt about that. To believe there is a God who is good, then the evil must be driven by something...someone.
There is the morning and the night, the white and the black, the opposit... for this there is the devil... god vs devil...
P.S. Excuse my bad English, I'm Italian...
We didn't create the devil, that was what God did. If you are speaking metaphorically, then we did it to explain away the "bad" things we do. Ergo the phrase "the devil made me do it". "Great care we must take." Jedi Master Yoda.
| Quote: |
One of the most cunning of Iblis’s wiles is to make those who follow him deny himself. Since at this time those whose minds have been tainted by materialist philosophy in particular have been hesitant in these self-evident matters, we shall say one or two things in the face of this stratagem of Satan’s. They are as follows:
There are self-evidently corporeal evil spirits who perform Satan’s functions. So too it is certain to the same degree that there are evil spirits without bodies from the jinns. If they were clothed in physical bodies, they would be the same as those evil human beings. Also, if those evil spirits in human form were able to leave aside their bodies, they would be those jinn-satans. Even, it is as a consequence of this terrible relationship that one false school pronounced: “After they have died, excessively evil spirits in human form become devils.”
It is well-known that when something of high quality is corrupted it becomes more corrupted than something of less quality. For example, if yoghurt and milk go bad they may still be eaten, but if oil goes bad it becomes inedible, and even like poison. Similarly, if the most noble, indeed the highest of creatures, man, is corrupted, he becomes more so than a corrupted animal. Like vermin who enjoy the stink of putrifying matter and snakes who take pleasure at biting and poisoning, they take pride and pleasure at the evils and corrupt morality of the swamp of misguidance, being gratified at the harms and crimes of the darkness of evil-doing; quite simply they take on the nature of Satan. Yes, a decisive indication of the existence of devils from the jinn, is the existence of human satans.
Secondly: All the hundreds of decisive evidences proving the existence of angels and spirit beings in the Twenty-Ninth Word prove also the existence of evils spirits. We refer this aspect to that Word.
Thirdly: The existence of the angels, who are like the representatives and supervisors of the laws of the good matters in the universe, are established and agreed upon by all the religions. So too, the existence of evil and satanic spirits, who are the representatives and ushers of evil matters and the means of the laws of such matters, is required by wisdom and reality, and is certain. Indeed, in evil matters, a conscious screen is more necessary. For as is stated at the beginning of the Twenty-Second Word, since everyone cannot see the true good of everything, the All-Glorious Creator has made apparent intermediaries as a screen in respect of apparent evils and defects, so that objections should not be levelled at Him, nor His mercy be accused, nor his wisdom criticized or unjustly complained about, and so that objections, criticisms, and complaints should be directed at the screen, and not turned to the Generous Creator, the Absolutely Wise One. Just as He has made illness a screen to the appointed hour of death in order to save Azra’il from the complaints of His servants who die, so too He has made Azra’il a screen to the seizing of the spirits of the dying so that the complaints at that situation, which is fancied to be lacking in compassion, should not be directed to Almighty God. And even more certainly, dominical wisdom demanded the existence of Satan, so that objections and criticisms in the face of evils and bad things should not be directed to the All-Glorious Creator.
Fourthly: As man is a small world, the microcosm, so is the world a large human being, the macroanthropos. Small man is an index and summary of the macroanthropos. The large originals of the samples in man will necessarily be found in the macroanthropos. For example, the existence of man’s faculty of memory is a certain indication of the existence of the Preserved Tablet in the world. So too everyone has experienced in himself the inner faculty situated in a corner of the heart which is the means to diabolical suggestions and temptations and a satanic tongue which speaks through the promptings of the imagination and the corrupted power of imagination, which becomes like a small Satan and acts contrary to its owner’s will and opposed to his desires—these are certain evidences to the existence of great satans in the world. And since the inner faculty which is the means to diabolical suggestions and the power of imagination are an ear and a tongue, they infer the existence of an external evil individual who blows on the one and makes the other speak.
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http://www.risale-inur.com.tr/rnk/eng/flashes/13th_flash.htmlSimply put: scare tactics. Heaven might not have been enticing enough as it is to pull in the masses. but if the alternative is burning for all eternity then people suddenly want to be good Christians.
It's really simple. Man created the devil to scare people in order to do good. It's the same as the boogieman who will take you away when you're bad. Belief is a system primarily based on fear. You need something bad to fear, there you have it: The devil is born.
(Btw. did you know that in a certain part of the bible the devil is simply described as god himself who is punishing people who do not believe his ways?)
man did not create the devil, his original name was lucifer the angel on the right hand throne of god, he rebelled against god wanting omnipotency and took alot of angels with him,(demons) and now you hear of exorcisimn, true but i really have never seen an excorcismn
| cody4camp wrote: |
| man did not create the devil, his original name was lucifer the angel on the right hand throne of god, he rebelled against god wanting omnipotency and took alot of angels with him,(demons) and now you hear of exorcisimn. |
So god actually created the devil. See, point is, if you (as myself) do not believe in a god then the question will keep, why did man create the devil as man also created god.The devil used to be an angel, until he defied God.
| HalfBloodPrince wrote: |
| The devil used to be an angel, until he defied God. |
Like I said: If you believe man created god then man must also have created the devil and that is the question here, not who the devil is, everyone can read that in the bible for themselves if they want to. And what you say is not entirely true. When you look in the bible the devil is also described as the "merciful" lord himself persueing and punishing those who do not believe in him. | Coen wrote: |
| And what you say is not entirely true. When you look in the bible the devil is also described as the "merciful" lord himself persueing and punishing those who do not believe in him. |
what tha-...what bible are you reading?The Devil was one of the angels until he defied God and didn't bow to Adam.
| coeus wrote: |
| Coen wrote: | | And what you say is not entirely true. When you look in the bible the devil is also described as the "merciful" lord himself persueing and punishing those who do not believe in him. |
what tha-...what bible are you reading? |
The same bible as you are. In Holland there is a man called Maarten 't Hart. He was raised christian but he stopped believing and wrote several books regarding it. I could look up the part in the bible where it is being said if you'd like. | Coen wrote: |
| The same bible as you are. In Holland there is a man called Maarten 't Hart. He was raised christian but he stopped believing and wrote several books regarding it. I could look up the part in the bible where it is being said if you'd like. |
Please do.Man needed God to take the place of parents, I guess. I mean to know that there is someone watching over us who can make all the wrongs right. Someone immortal, everlasting.
The Devil? I guess to put the blame for all the wrongs!
I think that for the first Gods the separation good/evil was not so clear.
The Gods had a domain (like wind, sun, plants...) and they were managing everything in their own domain. Sometimes they were happy, sometimes their were angry so there were good and bad consequences. (Gods were more like humans but more powerfull)
Then man decided to change that and split the responsibilities.
To move from a vertical organisation (psecialized by "product") to an horizontal organisation with only 2 guys one for all the good and one for all the bad.
As any organisational change it doesn't make more sense than before but it reduces the number of resources.
Created by religion, which is the opium of the people.
Devil was once among the angels. He was made of fire. God once asked his angels to bow to humans. All angels did but one refused. He said he was made of fire and humans are below his standrads. He disobeyed God and became Devil.
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| spinout wrote: |
Why did man create the Devil ?
There is a 'man create god' thread - and my first thought was that the first creation must be the devil...
But this really collapse so say? The obvious meaning of the 'devil' creation must be to use it as a 'power toy'. And secondly the escape sentence 'the devil made me do it!!!!!'
when was the first appearance? the bible? Fallen angel? Still an angel so say? |
The devil goes far back before the Bible. The religion of Zoraster for example has a devil in it. The devil himself is agreed by the Abrahamic religions to be some form of a demon (or whatever technical name you want to use), but they differ in how he became a demon. Islam says satan was a Jinn, while Christianity says he was an angel. I have not researched satan's origins in christianity, but i suspect the idea of "fallen angel" is yet another addition to christianity, after Jesus.
Islam however does not say that all temptations come from the devil. Some come from the self. You can tempt yourself to do something. This is where Jihad comes in (inner struggle).
Muslims do not use evil as an excuse for any sinful actions, as it is their own fault for choosing to performing the action anyway.
On a more atheistic and scientific approach, one could put forward the hypothesis that temptation is an altering of hormones. E.g. more specific hormones might make you more aggressive.
may Allah bless you.A lot of religions have "evil" gods or creatures. Norsemen had Loki ancient egyptians had Set and christians have the Devil.
The devil was created to represent all evil things that happened. Erupting vulcanoes floods etc.
It was more or less to create a balance. Like ying yang.
The way I see it, the devil, or any kind of evil deity, was created to fulfil a need for an excuse.
Humans have long had "evil" acts of violence that are looked upon as terrible, and as such are cast aside by their society. It extends all throughout history, in every civilization. Thus, humans have long sought the reason for these awful deeds, and more often than not the idea of an evil entity seems to come into play.
Its difficult to pinpoint the place in human emotions, thoughts, or other means of self that causes them to do the things they do, let them be "good" or "evil." A murderer, for example, is considered "evil." When we can't discern the reason for wanting to do things that are poor examples of human behavior, we tend to want to blame them on an outside souce. As many have quoted, "the devil made me do it."
Its much easier to find some kind of scapegoat for behavior you wouldn't want to answer for. And what better one than the devil?
'The way I see it, the devil, or any kind of evil deity, was created to fulfil a need for an excuse.
Humans have long had "evil" acts of violence that are looked upon as terrible, and as such are cast aside by their society. It extends all throughout history, in every civilization. Thus, humans have long sought the reason for these awful deeds, and more often than not the idea of an evil entity seems to come into play.
Its difficult to pinpoint the place in human emotions, thoughts, or other means of self that causes them to do the things they do, let them be "good" or "evil." A murderer, for example, is considered "evil." When we can't discern the reason for wanting to do things that are poor examples of human behavior, we tend to want to blame them on an outside souce. As many have quoted, "the devil made me do it."
Its much easier to find some kind of scapegoat for behavior you wouldn't want to answer for. And what better one than the devil?'
in fact, in ancient times in the middle east, communities would cleanse their souls by putting all their sins onto the goat, and sending it off into the desert to die of dehydration.
Its funny, tho, that the devil was the best friend of God until he pissed God off. lol.
@videoguy - please use quote tags to enclose stuff which you wish to quote. ie use the word quote in square brackets at the start and /quote in square brackets at the end. It makes it much more readable.....
The reason is more or less the same as the creation of a god.
The people could be controlled. You could define what was bad and what was good and force people to do these things. Might and greed.Wohoo!
the first reference to the devil i think is with the apple and eve but what i call strange is that the fallen angel lucifer is later referred to as the devil...
How can that be when the devil is already down when lucifer plots against god and gives people on earth a brain and a mind of our own. THEN lucifer is cast down with the words ( "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!")
Lucifer was cast down because he tried to enlighten people to make up their own mind so they could chose to follow him instead of god.
enlighten people... so more then eve alone i supose, thats why i believe that Satan and Lucifer are 2 different people but that got mixed up by people who never read the bible or who just listen to people that tell them that lucifer and Satan are alike.
anyway why did the church made hell ?
because they need to bring fear amongst the lowest people ( in those days people were really afraid of hell so they gave a lot of money to the church just to make their path safe to go to heaven )
Why did the church made Lucifer?
Because they need to put an example, THIS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU IF YOU OPPOSE GODS WILL
Why did the church made Satan?
Because they need to make something abstract as 'EVIL' into something concrete as 'the devil' so people understrand it better.
| Poetsunited wrote: |
| the first reference to the devil i think is with the apple and eve but what i call strange is that the fallen angel lucifer is later referred to as the devil... |
There is no reference to the Devil, Satan or Lucifer in Genesis. Eve is tempted by the serpent.
| Genesis 3;1 wrote: |
| Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made |
There is no suggestion that the serpent is Satan. That suggestion is made much later in the Book of Revelations - the 'maddest' book of the New Testament. If you believe Revelations then you believe the serpent was the Devil/Satan, but Genesis does not make that claim. Personally I think Revelations is the work of a very disturbed mind, nothing more. | Quote: |
Now it is such a bizarrely impossible coincidence that anything so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as a final and clinching proof of the nonexistence of God. The arguement goes something like this:
"I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."
"But," say Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway, isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED."
"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't though of that" and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.
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- Douglas in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.
Seems about right 
| Poetsunited wrote: |
Why did the church made Lucifer?
Because they need to put an example, THIS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU IF YOU OPPOSE GODS WILL. |
How strange that I'm still alive then?Because everything has its good and bad side… And just like there are good and bad people, it is logical that there will be something opposite of goodness that God represents – and that’s devil.
The brain of man is arctic, that a timber-toe by lightness perceives "black" and "white", "good" and "evil". Following the simple way of persons necessarily will create itself similarity of gods and devils.
I'm not familiar with this dialect. Is it basic gibberish with double-dutch pronunciation?
And a touch of irrelevant statements. (Just kidding, please try not to get offended 
)
I can't agree that the God should be good according to everything I've read. Punishing homosexuality with death and valueing women as lesser beings doesn't seem to be very much in the manner of someone good. I think its because man thought if there is a ultimate good thing called 'GOD', there should be a ultimate bad thing. So it can be compared with the good thing. Just think if we all did not know anything about what is bad in this world then we will not even know what is good too.
Take anything you will find this relation. If there is rule for everyone who follows it is Good and who doesn't is Bad. Likewise men created two things which has no proof of existence that is God and Devil.
Its simply GOOD Vs BAD.
So men created Devil just to compare with God and show that how good is the God.
It is just a simplistic and primitive separation of the world in 2 parts, like we teach children about good and bad and that they will get a reward for good actions and be punished for bad actions.
When you grow up you understand that nothing is 100% bad or good (even if it looks so) but that would be considered dangerous to teach children.
Religion do the same tining and of course cannot admit that something has to be imperfect: could you imagine an imperfect god !
| spinout wrote: |
| Why did man create the Devil? |
So women would have something kinky to dress up in when role playing...
You know, with the tight, red, spandex suit along with the tail and the horns. 
Oh yeah, that's what I like!!!
But seriously (kind of), I think someone already mentioned what I was really going to say. Basically, people like to put labels on things. Not sure why, but it's human nature. I find myself doing it without even noticing sometimes.
Here the distinction is between Good and Naughty...wait, I mean evil. Good and Evil.
Fortunately (or unfortunately), the world is not this black and white.Well basically deities were invented to explain things otherwise unexplainable, and furthermore, I guess, to have somekind of influence (e.g. through prayers, sacrifice etc.) on those things. These ultimately positive chraracteristica, were difficult to combine with all the bad things happening - for example a bad harvest, even though the praying had been done. Therefore a counterpart was necessary - that be the devil or whatever..
Well, that's my humble view...
