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The Story of the Beginning (name changed: False GOD... etc.)





Lobo23
((Please do not be offended if msot of this contredicts your beleifs and if I offend you. Please understand that this is all what I've been told by my resources and are my beleifs, as told to me by my sources. You do not have to beleive if you don't want to. THIS IS ALSO INCOMPLETE AND I WILL DISCUSS THIS WITH MY FRIEND WHEN I GET A CHANCE, SO HE CAN REFRESH MY MEMORY.))

A long time ago, I met a person that is now my friend, who sort of randomly started telling me of the beginning of the universe, when one of the thirteen original beings in another dimension created what we know as God, and two others created his brother who is now known as Raziel. God was sent to a realm that we call Heaven, he was sent for reasons I can't remember, but.. then he made the first angel, Morning Star, and had him create more angels like him. He created more and some of the ones he created were, Micheal, Samuel, Zero, and some other well known angels. after a while heaven was getting crowded, so god sent the angels to make villages away from him, and spread out, and sent Morning Star to watch over them. And made Zero take his place, since a new trend started, and that was stealing, and so god made some rules, and later, more rules that came to be known as the "Ten Commandments". Then the angels started a new trend, and that was to disobey your master, so God said "it is a privaledge to be in my company" and sent the angels who broke the rules far away, and a lot of angels complained that it was unfair that if they sin once that they be sent away, and when Morning Star joined the fight and God found out, he sent Morning Star to the realm known as "Death" Morning Star then swore that he would get revenge for God doing things like that to his own creations, and changed his name to Satan, which is angelic for "Forsaken". But since God didn't take away Morning Star's ability to create, he began creating more angels and taught them to manipulate the realms, and made an army in Death, to rebel against God.
Morning Star then learned how to get into a realm between Heaven and Death, and Zero was sent to stop him, but couldn't. God then took the angel's free wills and their souls broke apart into pure energy, that started to form physical energy, Morning Star found out that this physical energy had rules of it's own, and God couldn't effect it, so he had his army mold the energy around themselves and made the very first physical beings.
Zero figured out how to break apart the physical energy and let their souls leak out. God sent them to a realm where there was nothing but physical energy and said when their souls were broken from their physical energy they would be sent to Death. Zero being under pressure said that God shouldn't be so cruel, and so God said if the physical beings were worthy they could come to heaven. Morning Star rebelled repeatedly and Zero faught back, a few times just barely coming out alive. Since then, Zero made an angel to take his place and was made to be the bodyguard of God. Then Zero found out about Raziel, God's brother, who was banned from heaven for not submitting to God. (Zero finding this out was within the last two years) Zero then spoke with God, saying a few things and then teleporting to earth to hide for a bit. He then decided to go back to heaven and apologize, so he could be in God's service again, and was demoted from Seraphigm rank to Arch-Angel, after being forsaken from heaven. Raziel is in hiding wanting to take over heaven so angels will have free will, and a few others are wanting to take over heaven for the same reasons, except they want a rule that has no ruler.

That is the story of the beginning, as I remember it... It's not very accurate but it's the jist of it. That explains that God is not the original being, nor is he all powerful. If he is, why does he need angel's protection? He banned his brother from heaven so that he couldn't take over... To me it seems a being who just grasped too much power
loyal
is this a joke?
Lobo23
loyal wrote:
is this a joke?

Hell no, it's my entire beleif system... in a nutshell
Aredon
Are there particular scripts or texts you are basing this off of? Or was this simply a formulation from the depths of your imagination? Sounds oddly similar to a movie script, but I also recall a few... texts... with the same storyline.
Lobo23
Aredon wrote:
Are there particular scripts or texts you are basing this off of? Or was this simply a formulation from the depths of your imagination? Sounds oddly similar to a movie script, but I also recall a few... texts... with the same storyline.

My friend who claims to be a forsaken angel has told me all of this, and I've known him for quite a while now and have no reason to doubt it, with all the proof he's shown me, but I can't express my own proof, and my beliefs are not your beliefs, you don't have to believe.

I'm basing all of this on my own experience and what my friend says. Yeah, I know it sounds crazy but you don't have to believe it... Like I keep saying...

I know it's real, but I have absolutely no way to prove it, so I call them my beliefs.
Aredon
Well, the idea sounds dangerously close to stories about a rebell angel who (he and his followers) took daughters of men as their wives and boor giants and etc. (see "lost book" Enoch) Though I would not follow the belief that God cannot effect the physical realm. Just... personal experiance lets call it. Though there is plenty in various beliefs that mentions fallen angels, forsaken angels, angels being jelous of mankind, etc. Zero sounds oddly familiar to Zenros, but unfortunately I am unable to recall where I heard it.
divinitywolf
yeah i really doubt that your friend is a forsaken angel.
I have no problem with what you belive in but you cant just say somethings true. My belief is that anythings possible so the "proof" that you've seen might not be real and i bet if someone asked your friend to prove his theory he wouldn't be able to.

Quote:
This angel is the the legendary author of The Book of the Angel Raziel --"wherein all celestial and earthly knowledge is set down." The Book of the Angel Raziel is reputed to contain the 1,500 keys to the mysteries of the universe. Unfortunately, they are written in a language so arcane and impossible to decifer (without presumably the aid of Raziel himself) that not even the greatest angels of heaven are able to figure it out. Raziel is also ranked as the special patron to the first human.

Raziel, called the angel of mysteries, is the possessor of a staggering amount of information on all matters secret, arcane, and mysterious; his knowledge stems from the fact that he stands at the curtain separating God from the rest of Creation and hears and notes everything that is said around His throne. He supposedly wrote it all down, and because of his pity for the plight of Adam and Eve, gave the book to Adam that he might better understand God. This did not go over well with some of the other angels, and they stole the book from Adam and threw it into the sea. God, instead of punishing Raziel, retrieved the book and returned it to Adam.The book later passed to Enoch, who would become the angel Metatron. He also the author of the tome from which Noah learns to build the ark. This is not to be confused with Raphael, who is the angel to give Raziel's tome to Noah, but did not write it himself.

His head is surrounded by a glowing yellow aura. He wears a robe of gray material that seems to swirl as if made of liquid. Raziel appears quite tall and has large sky-blue wings. He is the ruler of the planet Neptune.

Raziel is one of the cherubim, the guardian of originality and the realm of pure ideas. He is knowledgeable in several mystical arts and can explain the truth behind many occult truths in the universe. One of the most interesting things Raziel can give you is an understanding of the energy currents in the magickal universe and how to manipulate them to various ends.


This is a different story to yours lobo and just proves that so many different stories and so many interpretations exist.
I belive that theres no point in finding out what created us. Ignorance is as much a blessing as a curse. Really its just human nature to be curious so i say its about time we got on with our lives and focused on the present and future instead of the past and satisfying curiousity.
Lobo23
Aredon wrote:
Well, the idea sounds dangerously close to stories about a rebell angel who (he and his followers) took daughters of men as their wives and boor giants and etc. (see "lost book" Enoch) Though I would not follow the belief that God cannot effect the physical realm. Just... personal experiance lets call it. Though there is plenty in various beliefs that mentions fallen angels, forsaken angels, angels being jelous of mankind, etc. Zero sounds oddly familiar to Zenros, but unfortunately I am unable to recall where I heard it.
Well, when God couldn't effect physical energy that was billions of years ago, God, being the first being in these dimensions, would have most likely found a way to effect this world. ((BTW, My friend says God has no shape, or form, and thus looks like whatever you believe him to look like))
There is a legend that an angel gave a human a magical alchemy symbol and taught him how to use it, and it was the most powerful symbol in the known world. The man created an island with that symbol, and when God found out, he ripped the man apart and killed him, and cast the angel to hell, because he said that no man should posess that kind of power. So, all we can do is assume these things, that God CAN effect physical reality now.
Lobo23
divinitywolf wrote:
yeah i really doubt that your friend is a forsaken angel.
I have no problem with what you belive in but you cant just say somethings true. My belief is that anythings possible so the "proof" that you've seen might not be real and i bet if someone asked your friend to prove his theory he wouldn't be able to.

Quote:
This angel is the the legendary author of The Book of the Angel Raziel --"wherein all celestial and earthly knowledge is set down." The Book of the Angel Raziel is reputed to contain the 1,500 keys to the mysteries of the universe. Unfortunately, they are written in a language so arcane and impossible to decifer (without presumably the aid of Raziel himself) that not even the greatest angels of heaven are able to figure it out. Raziel is also ranked as the special patron to the first human.

Raziel, called the angel of mysteries, is the possessor of a staggering amount of information on all matters secret, arcane, and mysterious; his knowledge stems from the fact that he stands at the curtain separating God from the rest of Creation and hears and notes everything that is said around His throne. He supposedly wrote it all down, and because of his pity for the plight of Adam and Eve, gave the book to Adam that he might better understand God. This did not go over well with some of the other angels, and they stole the book from Adam and threw it into the sea. God, instead of punishing Raziel, retrieved the book and returned it to Adam.The book later passed to Enoch, who would become the angel Metatron. He also the author of the tome from which Noah learns to build the ark. This is not to be confused with Raphael, who is the angel to give Raziel's tome to Noah, but did not write it himself.

His head is surrounded by a glowing yellow aura. He wears a robe of gray material that seems to swirl as if made of liquid. Raziel appears quite tall and has large sky-blue wings. He is the ruler of the planet Neptune.

Raziel is one of the cherubim, the guardian of originality and the realm of pure ideas. He is knowledgeable in several mystical arts and can explain the truth behind many occult truths in the universe. One of the most interesting things Raziel can give you is an understanding of the energy currents in the magickal universe and how to manipulate them to various ends.

actually... I'll ask him to prove it on a camera or something, and see what he says. That would be very interesting. Smile
divinitywolf
It would indeed. I'll look forward to it. How old is your friend by the way? and how did you meet him. What were the circumstances etc...?
Lobo23
divinitywolf wrote:
It would indeed. I'll look forward to it. How old is your friend by the way? and how did you meet him. What were the circumstances etc...?

I first met him when he randomly popped up on my yahoo messanger and introduced himself as a forsaken angel and explained some stuff. I remember him then saying "Hold on, I'm going to get a book" and then he said "This book contains records of a journal from an angel long ago" I was asking him about otherkin and things like that, so he quoted the book and it was about an angel watching over humans, he said "They're such savages, they act as though they were animals, and when they come out of something that may kill them, they act more like animals."
He's helped me a lot... I was talking to my girlfriend on the phone once, and she said she was posessed and...tons of other crazy stuff, I asked my friend if she was posessed and he said she's crazy, her soul is perfectly fine. He then gave me a list of commands to say to her and she almost fainted on the phone and got off, the next time I talked with her she was fine Confused I don't know whether it was an act or something, but it was really interesting to me that some jibberish words in a language he said was angelic to her so-called guardian angels made her almost faint... I don't expect you to believe that though..^^;;
Lobo23
divinitywolf wrote:
It would indeed. I'll look forward to it. How old is your friend by the way? and how did you meet him. What were the circumstances etc...?

I first met him when he randomly popped up on my yahoo messanger and introduced himself as a forsaken angel and explained some stuff. I remember him then saying "Hold on, I'm going to get a book" and then he said "This book contains records of a journal from an angel long ago" I was asking him about otherkin and things like that, so he quoted the book and it was about an angel watching over humans, he said "They're such savages, they act as though they were animals, and when they come out of something that may kill them, they act more like animals."
He's helped me a lot... I was talking to my girlfriend on the phone once, and she said she was posessed and...tons of other crazy stuff, I asked my friend if she was posessed and he said she's crazy, her soul is perfectly fine. He then gave me a list of commands to say to her and she almost fainted on the phone and got off, the next time I talked with her she was fine Confused I don't know whether it was an act or something, but it was really interesting to me that some jibberish words in a language he said was angelic to her so-called guardian angels made her almost faint... I don't expect you to believe that though..^^;;
His name is Sam and he's 19 years of age I think.
divinitywolf
i have a very open mind so i take anything as a possibility. This person seems very interesting and you're story also seems interesting. I dont suppose you have his email address or anything because you say he's on your yahoo messenger so would it be possible for me to talk to him?
Lobo23
divinitywolf wrote:
i have a very open mind so i take anything as a possibility. This person seems very interesting and you're story also seems interesting. I dont suppose you have his email address or anything because you say he's on your yahoo messenger so would it be possible for me to talk to him?
I'd ask for your address so he could email you, but then my story would seem incredibly fake I bet XD.. I'll PM you his email once I get his permission.
Aredon
I find it curious that he would be a forsaken angel that can age. I also find it curious that he openly revieled himself to you, where as in nearly every story involving fallen angels, they hate humans.
Quote:
I am man's superior in the creation, I will not reguard him with respect.

Followed by something along the lines of humans being the youngest in creation are more revered by God and therefore they hate us as they were created first.

Another thing you must consider is if he is truely the being he claims to be, he would have little or no desire to reviel it on camera. That would also throw the balance, for the record. Assuming that it is all true, by revieling himself in a public manner he throws the balance, effectively removing the purpose of faith as it would then be evidence. Removing a large chunk of mankind's purpose. On the other hand, perhaps he would want this to happen?

If indeed he is a forsaken angel, or fallen angel as it may be. I would be very carefull in calling him a friend. Let us just say, he may not have your best interest in mind.
Lobo23
Aredon wrote:
I find it curious that he would be a forsaken angel that can age. I also find it curious that he openly revieled himself to you, where as in nearly every story involving fallen angels, they hate humans.
Quote:
I am man's superior in the creation, I will not reguard him with respect.

Followed by something along the lines of humans being the youngest in creation are more revered by God and therefore they hate us as they were created first.

Another thing you must consider is if he is truely the being he claims to be, he would have little or no desire to reviel it on camera. That would also throw the balance, for the record. Assuming that it is all true, by revieling himself in a public manner he throws the balance, effectively removing the purpose of faith as it would then be evidence. Removing a large chunk of mankind's purpose. On the other hand, perhaps he would want this to happen?

He was forsaken for wanting to kill God, and.. revealed himself to me because, come to find out, he claims that the same angel that created him(his soul) is the same angel that created me(my soul), and he says that I'm some type of angel/human hybrid. And he ages because he is in a physical body, no matter what soul you have you're still in a bodily form, and if you're reading this, you're most likely human. Ever hear of Otherkin? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otherkin A lot of people make a lot of fake stories about it quite honestly.

He honestly does hate the most of humanity for the majority of them being complete idiots, really you can't honestly look around without you yourself hating a lot of people though...
Aredon
Here is a pasage from Enoch that I managed to dig up and you might find interesting:
Quote:

6 1 And it came to pass when the children of men had multiplied that in those days were born unto 2 them beautiful and comely daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives from among the children of men 3 and beget us children.' And Semjaza, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not 4 indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations 5 not to abandon this plan but to do this thing.' Then sware they all together and bound themselves 6 by mutual imprecations upon it. And they were in all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of Mount Hermon, and they called it Mount Hermon, because they had sworn 7 and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it. And these are the names of their leaders: Samiazaz, their leader, Arakiba, Rameel, Kokabiel, Tamiel, Ramiel, Danel, Ezeqeel, Baraqijal, 8 Asael, Armaros, Batarel, Ananel, Zaqiel, Samsapeel, Satarel, Turel, Jomjael, Sariel. These are their chiefs of tens.


And in this one it mentions the alchemy you referenced at earlier:
Quote:
7 1 And all the others together with them took unto themselves wives, and each chose for himself one, and they began to go in unto them and to defile themselves with them, and they taught them charms 2 and enchantments, and the cutting of roots, and made them acquainted with plants. And they 3 became pregnant, and they bare great giants, whose height was three thousand ells: Who consumed 4 all the acquisitions of men. And when men could no longer sustain them, the giants turned against 5 them and devoured mankind. And they began to sin against birds, and beasts, and reptiles, and 6 fish, and to devour one another's flesh, and drink the blood. Then the earth laid accusation against the lawless ones.


However, the story your friend paints sounds far more like that painted in the Kabbalah.

Quote:
"God revealed in the future to Adam and Eve in a book given to them in the Garden of Eden by the hand of the angel Raziel (secrets of God) . This book contained sacred knowledge: 72 branches of wisdom that revealed the formation of 670 inscriptions of higher mysteries. In the middle of the book was a secret writing explaining 1500 keys to the universe, which were not revealed even to the holy angels....
"Adam and Eve obtained this book...
"When Adam and Eve transgressed the commandments of the Master regarding the Tree of Knowledge, the book flew away from them. Adam was so distressed, he entered the river Gihon (one of the rivers of the garden) up to his neck and stayed there so that his body became wrinkled and his face haggard...
"God thereupon made a sign to the Archangel Raphael to return the book, which Adam studied for the rest of his life. He left it to his son Seth, and it went through the generations to Abraham. It is still hidden today, somewhere in the world, for those who know how to read it."1

So to me your friend's tale may hold some merit, but only on the grounds that it is very similar to that of other religions. I will not agree that God had any sort of begining, as clearly if the physical world did not exist yet, neither did time.
Lobo23
Aredon wrote:
Here is a pasage from Enoch that I managed to dig up and you might find interesting:
Quote:

6 1 And it came to pass when the children of men had multiplied that in those days were born unto 2 them beautiful and comely daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives from among the children of men 3 and beget us children.' And Semjaza, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not 4 indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations 5 not to abandon this plan but to do this thing.' Then sware they all together and bound themselves 6 by mutual imprecations upon it. And they were in all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of Mount Hermon, and they called it Mount Hermon, because they had sworn 7 and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it. And these are the names of their leaders: Samiazaz, their leader, Arakiba, Rameel, Kokabiel, Tamiel, Ramiel, Danel, Ezeqeel, Baraqijal, 8 Asael, Armaros, Batarel, Ananel, Zaqiel, Samsapeel, Satarel, Turel, Jomjael, Sariel. These are their chiefs of tens.


And in this one it mentions the alchemy you referenced at earlier:
Quote:
7 1 And all the others together with them took unto themselves wives, and each chose for himself one, and they began to go in unto them and to defile themselves with them, and they taught them charms 2 and enchantments, and the cutting of roots, and made them acquainted with plants. And they 3 became pregnant, and they bare great giants, whose height was three thousand ells: Who consumed 4 all the acquisitions of men. And when men could no longer sustain them, the giants turned against 5 them and devoured mankind. And they began to sin against birds, and beasts, and reptiles, and 6 fish, and to devour one another's flesh, and drink the blood. Then the earth laid accusation against the lawless ones.


However, the story your friend paints sounds far more like that painted in the Kabbalah.

Quote:
"God revealed in the future to Adam and Eve in a book given to them in the Garden of Eden by the hand of the angel Raziel (secrets of God) . This book contained sacred knowledge: 72 branches of wisdom that revealed the formation of 670 inscriptions of higher mysteries. In the middle of the book was a secret writing explaining 1500 keys to the universe, which were not revealed even to the holy angels....
"Adam and Eve obtained this book...
"When Adam and Eve transgressed the commandments of the Master regarding the Tree of Knowledge, the book flew away from them. Adam was so distressed, he entered the river Gihon (one of the rivers of the garden) up to his neck and stayed there so that his body became wrinkled and his face haggard...
"God thereupon made a sign to the Archangel Raphael to return the book, which Adam studied for the rest of his life. He left it to his son Seth, and it went through the generations to Abraham. It is still hidden today, somewhere in the world, for those who know how to read it."1

So to me your friend's tale may hold some merit, but only on the grounds that it is very similar to that of other religions. I will not agree that God had any sort of begining, as clearly if the physical world did not exist yet, neither did time.

That is a bit interesting, and a lot of what he says to me explains a lot of things I always wondered about religion. I asked him about Jesus and why he is considered the son of God, and we're supposed to be God's children, so why is Jesus special? And he told me that God made Jesus and most of the bible is the religion closest to the truth, even though all religions hold a little bit of truth. But Jesus was made and sent here to tell the world of God and etc. He said that Jesus is now in heaven and spends most of his time in a church-like building there and answers people's questions. and after I asked he said that Jesus doesn't like the fact that people where the cross to remember him, and he said he would much rather people hang pictures up of him smiling and helping people. ((This was after I made my analogy of saying "If you're father died from being shot would you hang a bullet around your neck?"))

But those quotes are pretty interesting. Is that third book talking about the book of Abraham? because they have internet copies of that on some alchemy websites, and I think I might have a so-called copy of it on my pc.
Aredon
Aye, but for us to hang pictures of christ up we would need to know what he looked like. Just because some paintings claim to portrey Jesus doesn't mean they do.
Lobo23
Aredon wrote:
Aye, but for us to hang pictures of christ up we would need to know what he looked like. Just because some paintings claim to portrey Jesus doesn't mean they do.

stick figures Mr. Green (lmao)
I had this discussion with my mom and she suggested we replace the cross with the fish symbol because Jesus fed all those people with fish and such
divinitywolf
lol. So have you got permission from him yet because i'd really like his email address or if he has msn.
Are you sure that he himself isn't an otherkin and hasn't somehow tricked you into beliving him?
I'd be very interested seeing the angel journal.
hmmmm so many unexplained mysteries in life, maybe they can be explained after all.
Aredon
Quote:
stick figures Mr. Green (lmao)
I had this discussion with my mom and she suggested we replace the cross with the fish symbol because Jesus fed all those people with fish and such

The fish symbol is better I supose but a better symbol would be the complete symbol ("tails" on both ends). Which came about while the christians were being persecuted for their beliefs. So you would walk up to someone you thought was christian and draw an arch in the sand, if they drew in a reversed arch of what you drew, then you would go off to talk about christ. If not I imagine you would walk away.
Indi
Aredon wrote:
Quote:
stick figures Mr. Green (lmao)
I had this discussion with my mom and she suggested we replace the cross with the fish symbol because Jesus fed all those people with fish and such

The fish symbol is better I supose but a better symbol would be the complete symbol ("tails" on both ends). Which came about while the christians were being persecuted for their beliefs. So you would walk up to someone you thought was christian and draw an arch in the sand, if they drew in a reversed arch of what you drew, then you would go off to talk about christ. If not I imagine you would walk away.

Like this?
divinitywolf
well now we have been told that the person who told lobo this story wasn't truthful. He didnt mean any harm by it and it wasn't his fault yet this story isn't true and the person isn't a forsaken angel.
Aredon
No Indi, not even close.

The one on the left, horozontaly oriented is what I am talking about.
Quote:
The vesica piscis is a symbol made from two circles of the same radius, intersecting in such a way that the center of each circle lies on the circumference of the other. The name literally means the bladder of the fish in Latin. In the Christian tradition, is is a reference to Christ, as in ichthys. It is called a mandorla ("almond") in India and known in the early Mesopotamia African and Asian civilizations.




In reguards to the false tale, not suprising, how did you find this out?

(if the person was truthfull and their story got out, what is the best way to cover it up? Say you were making it up, people think you are crazy, move on with life)
rshanthakumar
Whatever be the truth of that story, the topic is interesting.

A number of religions and preachers have given their view of the 'beginning'. Here is one from one of the well known religious personalities. It goes this way:

"God was all that was there when it started. What was he like? He was a speck as well as a limitless extent. You may not be able to imagine how this is possible. But unfortunately that is how he was. Then that speck broke up and expanded into the limitless extent. God grew like a tree from the seed.

Everything sprouted from the seed called God. Planets, stars, nebulas, the universe. All sprouted from that one speck God. He is present in everything. More and more branches came out of Him like the tree that gives out branches. More beings came out of Him. Plants and animals in some places.

It is all part of God. And everything expanded into God. God who was a speck keeps growing within himself. There are many specks like this in the expanding GOD and they are all growing the same way.

We are all part of that mighty great God! We all obey his laws whether we like it or not. We live the way He desires whether we desire or not".

This is not a quote. I have taken the idea from Osho and expanded it here in my own words. you will not find Osho's equivalent quote anywhere of course. I have expanded some two or three sentences he made in one of his speeches. He asked one more question at the end of that speech.

"After the tree has grown, can any body show me the seed please? So is God. If somebody where to ask me show me God, sorry man! IT is merged with everyone of us. After giving birth to us, IT is one with us."
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