FRIHOSTFORUMSSEARCHFAQTOSBLOGSCOMPETITIONS
You are invited to Log in or Register a free Frihost Account!


About soul, body, ghost. What do you think about this?





bartdou
-----About body, brain, soul----
We human being, each individual consists of its body and soul, body consists of legs, arms, head, etc. In fact body and soul are two things, they look as one. When they work together(actually they always do so,seldom, hardly seperate), we are normal. The body is substance which could be saw, toughed, while the soul exists perhaps in the form of magnetic field, that's our minds' resource, but the mind should be showed out via something, the something is the body, just like we don't know the
information taken by the electromagnetic wave, but via the monitor, phone such things we can know. When a body forms in the womb, the biologic electricity in it generates its own magnetic field----the soul, they match much well. The soul need a body to exists, or it will easily be destroied(for example by the thunder) and disappear.

We can compare individual to a computer, body is the hardware: brain is CPU,memory, digestive system is the power, etc. the soul is the software running in it. Like Mac OS can not used in the computer----exactly hardware here----designed for the Microsoft Windows operating system, one soul is usually can not be transplant to another body, they don't match, the body will repulse the soul. Of course everything is not absolute, something illogical occurs occasionally. Have you ever saw or heard such phenomenon: a normal man suddenly behaves abnormally, he acts and says just like another certain man who died not long before, and they live not far away from each other before he died? Yeah, in my ipinion, this is because the dead man's soul lost its body, but it doesn't want so or it still has something to tell the live men whom he knows, it must find a body. Or incubus, when you sleep, you----exactly your soul----wake suddenly, you want to move but your body is not under your control, you want to scream but you can not even open your mouth, you struggle and struggle and finally you recover normal, and the whole you wake, you can not fall asleep in a short time. And this in my opinion is, some soul, it exists without a body for a long time, it belongs to the few souls which have enough power to exist long enough without bodies, it
consequently is able to occupy a normal body which has its own soul, often this is temporary. The ghosts maybe are such kind souls, they try to find a human body, when they can not, they find some other ¡°bodies¡±, we don't know what these bodies are, and they combine, they become so-called ghosts, but this kind of combine is not stable enough, perhaps this is why ghosts fear the thunder----even though combined with such bodies, they still may be destroied.

Maybe you have the similar opinion with me, or you may say that's ridiculous, but one point is sure that I'm not superstitious, I conclude this by deeply and scientifically thinking.
As a result, the brain or head transplant is entirely feasible, essentially it's same as finger/stomach/liver/kidney transplant, the key should be the soul/memory transplant.
Rico
In my opinion the human being consists of a body (the corporal part), the soul (your mind) and the spirit (the organ with which we experience the super natural). Most of what I believe about this subject I learnt from reading The Spiritual Man by Watchman Nee.
woundedhealer
I don't believe our spirits (souls) are magnetic energy. That doesn't make sense to me.
Ghosts (or spirits) don't need to go around looking for a body. They can exist well enough as they are. These spirits are in an energy form which cannot be destroyed.

Our spirit is able to leave our body for short times. This is often called astral travel. Shaman are well known for doing this, and for entering other realms at this time. Some people can do this through meditation.

Quote:
Have you ever saw or heard such phenomenon: a normal man suddenly behaves abnormally, he acts and says just like another certain man who died not long before, and they live not far away from each other before he died? Yeah, in my ipinion, this is because the dead man's soul lost its body, but it doesn't want so or it still has something to tell the live men whom he knows, it must find a body.


Spirits don't need someone elses body to pass a message to somebody. I sometimes get messages from people who have recently passed on. They want me to pass a message on to a loved one. Usually they visit their loved ones in spirit to try and deliver their message themselves. Ask anyone who has lost someone close, and they will tell you they sensed the persons presence, or something happened, like a familiar scent.
swapnalokam
I agree with you wounded healer.. I completely agree with you..
woundedhealer
swapnalokam wrote:
I agree with you wounded healer.. I completely agree with you..

Thanks for that. I could also add that I completely agree with you swapnalokam Very Happy
bartdou
woundedhealer wrote:
Quote:
Have you ever saw or heard such phenomenon: a normal man suddenly behaves abnormally, he acts and says just like another certain man who died not long before, and they live not far away from each other before he died? Yeah, in my ipinion, this is because the dead man's soul lost its body, but it doesn't want so or it still has something to tell the live men whom he knows, it must find a body.


Spirits don't need someone elses body to pass a message to somebody. I sometimes get messages from people who have recently passed on. They want me to pass a message on to a loved one. Usually they visit their loved ones in spirit to try and deliver their message themselves. Ask anyone who has lost someone close, and they will tell you they sensed the persons presence, or something happened, like a familiar scent.


But that phenomenon does exist! why? the spirite just do that for fun? perhaps they usually tell the live ones via dream, but i still think they will feel better if they have a body to combine with, like an adult has a husband or a wife.
Quote:
These spirits are in an energy form which cannot be destroyed.

you know, magnetic field if one of the enerny forms,
Quote:
That doesn't make sense to me.

many thing don't make sense to us, but they do exist. they exist not depending on whether we can sense them.
woundedhealer
Quote:

But that phenomenon does exist! why? the spirite just do that for fun? perhaps they usually tell the live ones via dream, but i still think they will feel better if they have a body to combine with, like an adult has a husband or a wife.

Spirits are energy. They do not need a body. They are nothing like an adult wanting a partner. When we pass on we discard our body, it is no longer needed. A spirit can go where it wants, why should it feel the need to gvie up that freedom and be lumbered with a body? They may take over a body in films, but that is just fiction.

I have known of psychic mediums allowing a spirit to join with them but they do not join with a person unless they have permission. The only reason for allowing this is because the medium wants to allow the spirit to comunicate. They don't go floating around looking for a body to inhabit.
kiawa77
I don't dispute that spirits are energy, and I don't think they wander around looking for bodies. I subscribe to the theory that all souls at some point meet "somewhere" to decide what they want to work on in the coming life. Then, once they get their impending life's blueprint ready, they come to the world to be born as an infant.

Two things though....

1. What is the reason for so many infant deaths?

2. How do you explain demonic possession?
woundedhealer
.
Quote:
1. What is the reason for so many infant deaths?

There is no one reason. Many medical conditions can cause an infant to die. Infant deaths are very high in some third world countries because of conditions there like the following: They don't all understand about hygiene, the mother is malnorished and not able to produce enough milk, there is not enough food to go round. Unfortunately in some countries they have more babies than they can cope with because of the high mortality rate, thus increasing the mortality rate. Western medical staff are now trying to educate some of these people so that they learn that if they have fewer children they will be able to care for them better which will decrease the mortality rate.

Quote:
2. How do you explain demonic possession?

I don't believe in demonic possession. I believe people who claim to be possessed have got a mental illness. Maybe one day someonewill convince me there are demons and demonic possession,but until that day, I'll carry on with my present beliefs
kiawa77
I don't mean why babies physically die.... obviously disease, accidents, murder, whatever takes its toll. I mean more along the lines like "Why do good people die?"

If one subscribes to the belief that we choose the main points of our lives in order to learn something and ascend to a higher level, why then would one choose to die only a short time after being born? What lesson does that provide? I mean all this spiritually of course, and only if you believe that certain line of thinking.

I just threw demonic possession in there for the hell of it (no pun intended). I'm not quite sure I believe in it either, although some accounts of exorcisms written by Roman bishops themselves are quite compelling...
Bikerman
bartdou wrote:

-----About body, brain, soul----
We human being, each individual consists of its body and soul, body consists of legs, arms, head, etc. In fact body and soul are two things, they look as one. When they work together(actually they always do so,seldom, hardly seperate), we are normal. The body is substance which could be saw, toughed, while the soul exists perhaps in the form of magnetic field, that's our minds' resource, but the mind should be showed out via something, the something is the body, just like we don't know the
information taken by the electromagnetic wave, but via the monitor, phone such things we can know. When a body forms in the womb, the biologic electricity in it generates its own magnetic field----the soul, they match much well. The soul need a body to exists, or it will easily be destroyed(for example by the thunder) and disappear.

This starts with an assumption rather than an objective standpoint and so any conclusions or logical development of the point is itself subject to the same assumption. That is problem 1.
Next problem : the Soul cannot be a magnetic field, since EM is understood by physics and measurable. No such measurements have been possible so no such quantity is present. The rest of this is, I'm afraid, baloney. EM fields can exist independantly of mass and vica-versa, but the electrically produced magnetic field would be dependant upon the maintance of the electric current and would, therefore, cease to exist when the electrical signals in the body ceased at death - even if one accepts the very dodgy science and reasoning behind the posit.
Quote:

We can compare individual to a computer, body is the hardware: brain is CPU,memory, digestive system is the power, etc. the soul is the software running in it. Like Mac OS can not used in the computer----exactly hardware here----designed for the Microsoft Windows operating system, one soul is usually can not be transplant to another body, they don't match, the body will repulse the soul. Of course everything is not absolute, something illogical occurs occasionally. Have you ever saw or heard such phenomenon: a normal man suddenly behaves abnormally, he acts and says just like another certain man who died not long before, and they live not far away from each other before he died? Yeah, in my ipinion, this is because the dead man's soul lost its body, but it doesn't want so or it still has something to tell the live men whom he knows, it must find a body. Or incubus, when you sleep, you----exactly your soul----wake suddenly, you want to move but your body is not under your control, you want to scream but you can not even open your mouth, you struggle and struggle and finally you recover normal, and the whole you wake, you can not fall asleep in a short time. And this in my opinion is, some soul, it exists without a body for a long time, it belongs to the few souls which have enough power to exist long enough without bodies, it
consequently is able to occupy a normal body which has its own soul, often this is temporary. The ghosts maybe are such kind souls, they try to find a human body, when they can not, they find some other ¡°bodies¡±, we don't know what these bodies are, and they combine, they become so-called ghosts, but this kind of combine is not stable enough, perhaps this is why ghosts fear the thunder----even though combined with such bodies, they still may be destroyed.

No no a thousand times no.
If the brain is the processor and associated gear, the operating system and software (soul) would directly and explicitly control the brain just as software is interpreted/compiled and then fed to the processor as a series of machine instructions. There would have to be a fundamental 'knowledge' of the brain built into the soul, in the same way that an O/S would be designed to run with a specific processor. This would mean that the soul and brain were linked to each other in subtle ways which would not allow separation.

Rather than Mac vs PC, think instead of PC1 with ATI graphics card, Conexant Modem, 19 inch flatscreen plasma, Dual Layer DVD writer and Terattec EWS 10 channel digital sound card.
PC2 has a Matrox graphics card, 3COM modem, 15 inch CRT monitor, CD writer and onboard 5:1 sound.

Stick the software from PC1 onto PC2 and you have a mess. You would need a category of part software and part firmware to mediate between the logical functions of the software and the physical entities within the system. That would correspond to a set of drivers which are, strictly speaking, software but are also often stored in firmware, so they would either be part of the soul or part of the brain, or possibly a combination of the two. Since one presumes the soul is not divisible then this would make the soul only suitable for a body/brain configuration very similar to the one it is currently driving. The sould could not, therefore, translocate to another body since the drivers would not work with that hardware.

I'm guilty of reducto ad absurdum here but the whole metaphor is fundamentally flakey. The metaphor is strained to breaking point almost before it begins and quickly collapses when given some proper thought.

How does software exist in isolation from the hardware ? It must be on some sort of backing storage, but the backing storage is the brain or body, since it is hardware/storage and so the soul would not be able to exist in isolation just as a software package cannot exist in isolation as pure code - it has to be stored on some form of media - magnetic or otherwise, just as the soul would have to be stored at death before the field dissipated. This would, again, make the body/brain/soul indivisible and inter-dependant.
Quote:

Maybe you have the similar opinion with me, or you may say that's ridiculous, but one point is sure that I'm not superstitious, I conclude this by deeply and scientifically thinking.
As a result, the brain or head transplant is entirely feasible, essentially it's same as finger/stomach/liver/kidney transplant, the key should be the soul/memory transplant.


Sorry - I'm in the ridiculous camp myself. You now seem to be equating the soul to memory. That is a false step since a program is not the same as the medium which carries it and a soul, in this metaphor, would not be memory, it would be the code stored in memory - the genetic and experiential instruction set built up by a particular individual which makes that person unique.

One final problem, of course, is that the human brain and the things it stores cannot easily be compared to a computer program and memory/storage since the brain would be more analogous to ROM, PROM or EEPROM in the way it stores data rather than dynamic RAM which would depend on refresh and constant power to maintain. It seems to me that the brain consists of physical pathways which are somehow organised to represent thoughts, concepts, memory rather than being a blank 'chip' onto which you could load a program.

Finally, without wishing to offend, I must say is that this is definitely NOT deep scientific thinking old son.....there is little science, not much depth and no abundance of thinking involved in this particular metaphor, I'm sorry to say.....
Keep trying though...practice makes competent in time.....

Regards
Chris
woundedhealer
kiawa77 wrote:
I don't mean why babies physically die.... obviously disease, accidents, murder, whatever takes its toll. I mean more along the lines like "Why do good people die?"


If you believe that we have lessons to learn, then surely a person who you class as being good, will learn their lessons faster than someone who you class as being bad.
Quote:

If one subscribes to the belief that we choose the main points of our lives in order to learn something and ascend to a higher level, why then would one choose to die only a short time after being born? What lesson does that provide? I mean all this spiritually of course, and only if you believe that certain line of thinking.

Do we really make that decision? Could it not be that babies die because of circumstances?
As for dying young, we don't know what lessons even a baby has learned in their short life. It could even be that their early death is not for their benefit, but for the benefit of their parents. That may sound weird, but if you subscribe to the belief that we reincarnate with the same group of people in our lives each time, then it makes sense. Take my own situation. I am disabled so I need the assistance of others. Those around me may need to learn lessons like patience, compassion and willing to help others.
Related topics
geist
Love is Love
My list of musics
Most the return card that praises
how many of the four cardinal virtues do you practice?
Whats your views on alcohol?
Sex Before Marriage
Buddhism
Death?
Lucid Dreaming
Is there such thing as a soul mate?
why do christians make prophet jesus as a god?
What will happen after we die? Afterlife?
A question to atheists
Reply to topic    Frihost Forum Index -> Lifestyle and News -> Philosophy and Religion

FRIHOST HOME | FAQ | TOS | ABOUT US | CONTACT US | SITE MAP
© 2005-2011 Frihost, forums powered by phpBB.