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USA invaded Iraq for ... ?






USA invaded Iraq for what?
Safety of the western civilization
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
For crusade proposes
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
Revenge of 9/11
30%
 30%  [ 3 ]
For oil
40%
 40%  [ 4 ]
Big Middle-East Project
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Part of a conquer world project :p
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 10

aceflooder
Why do you think USA enter Iraq?
They lost soldiers...They lost money...

They say for peace what do you think?
palavra
there can be some other reasons but the first one is oil
nopaniers
I think it is because some people in Washington think that US hegemony is good for the world. They do not understand the horrors of war and view it as just another tool of foreign policy.

To quote from Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Libby, Jeb Bush and several other prominent members of the US administration,
Quote:
We aim to make the case and rally support for American global leadership... Does the United States have the resolve to shape a new century favorable to American principles and interests?

They want the US to rule the world for their own (US) interests, and to do this they plan to increase military might
Quote:
Cuts in foreign affairs and defense spending, inattention to the tools of statecraft, and inconstant leadership are making it increasingly difficult to sustain American influence around the world.


Unless they use this military power around the world, they say that American interests and leadership of the world will be challenged.
Quote:
We cannot safely avoid the responsibilities of global leadership or the costs that are associated with its exercise. America has a vital role in maintaining peace and security in Europe, Asia, and the Middle East. If we shirk our responsibilities, we invite challenges to our fundamental interests. The history of the 20th century should have taught us that it is important to shape circumstances before crises emerge, and to meet threats before they become dire. The history of this century should have taught us to embrace the cause of American leadership.

And so I'd say it's pretty clear what's going on. They think that the US should rule the world, and have no problem using war to to promote US interests, which includes the "leadership" of the world, and that's something that the world should embrace. So, as silly as it sounds, these people really do think that the US should rule the world.

These quotes are from http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm

On a personal note, it's a little bit scary that people who think like that can become the leaders in a democracy.
Soulfire
Because (regardless of whether you think it's right or wrong) we want people to live under a democratic, non-tyrannical government. We want people to live in a place where they are free to worship who or what they want (or choose not to worship). We want people to live in a place where they can speak out against the government (much like here) and don't have to worry about being beheaded for it.

Here is the association people are making with the war in Iraq:
War is bad. Bush got us into a war. Bush is bad.

They aren't even looking beyond that. They associate war with bad things, and assume that because we are at war, Bush is bad. Think of "good wars" - American Revolution, for example.

And at the end of the day it doesn't matter why we are in Iraq because the fact is, we're there - and that doesn't look like it will change very soon. Although if you've been keeping up with non-liberal biased media, Iraq has taken control over it's armed forces now. That is clearly a step up. But you wouldn't know that from watching news here in America, you only hear the negative things - car bombings, journalist kidnappings, etc.

The terrorists recognize that the American public doesn't support the war and they are acting upon that weakness and apathy.

If more people supported the efforts in Iraq, terrorists could see that they aren't only up against the Bush administration, but against an entire nation.

Look at WWII - nobody supported war, then Pearl Harbor happened, and everyone supported it. Nobody supported war here, then September 11th happened. I admit, they are different circumstances, but the principle is basic.

THE WORLD WILL NOT CHANGE FOR US, sometimes we must seek the change. Clearly if we continue on our merry way, blindly ignoring the middle east, things will not change - more of our buildings will fall, more of our people will die.

Someone had to have the courage to grab the problems in the middle east by the throat.

And really - why do we sit here and complain about it. The only way the war has affected anyone here is if they have a friend, relative, acquaintance, etc. go to Iraq. Other than that, this war has no affect on us. Stop trying to draw attention to yourselves, and drop the hippie crap. Sometimes apathy, inaction, and many attempts of diplomacy don't make the cut.
Lord Klorel
I believe that the attacks on Iraq are for the terrorist attacks on the USA.

I have recently followed an documentary about the 9/11 attacks and the conclution i have maded was that the Bush government was determined to attack Iraq.

The advisors of the government told them that it was wrong to attack Iraq and that Afghanistan was the main target.

After a long time there was a deal that Afghanistan was the first target and Iraq was the next.

There are also rumours that the entire 9/11 attacks are actually putted in scene by the american government.
There are a lot of facts that may proof the that, but everyone have denieded it.

If this rumours become true, then are Bush and the entire government with all the related departments sitting ducks.
nopaniers
Soulfire wrote:
Because (regardless of whether you think it's right or wrong) we want people to live under a democratic, non-tyrannical government.


Should I point out that the US was among Saddam Hussein's supporters? Maybe I should point out that it was Rumsfeld who was the US envoy to Iraq, and the US who sold Iraq the precursors to its biological weapons. Or I could give you a list of similar tyranical countries which the US supports or has supported. For the use of an airbase in Uzbekistan you were willing to overlook that opposition members to the government were literally boiled alive.

Soulfire wrote:
it doesn't matter why we are in Iraq


Yes. It does matter. In a democracy leaders should be held accountable for what they say. If a leader misleads you then he or she should be held responsible for what they say particularly when what they lead many tens (or even) hundreds of thousands to their deaths.

Soulfire wrote:
But you wouldn't know that from watching news here in America, you only hear the negative things - car bombings, journalist kidnappings, etc.


Well, can I humbly suggest you read some Iraqi blogs. They are much more scathing than the US media, who take a simplistic and hopelessly optimistic point of view.

Here are some recent posts:
Quote:
Residents of Baghdad are systematically being pushed out of the city. Some families are waking up to find a Klashnikov bullet and a letter in an envelope with the words “Leave your area or else.” The culprits behind these attacks and threats are Sadr’s followers- Mahdi Army. It’s general knowledge, although no one dares say it out loud. In the last month we’ve had two different families staying with us in our house, after having to leave their neighborhoods due to death threats and attacks. It’s not just Sunnis- it’s Shia, Arabs, Kurds- most of the middle-class areas are being targeted by militias.

Other areas are being overrun by armed Islamists. The Americans have absolutely no control in these areas. Or maybe they simply don’t want to control the areas because when there’s a clash between Sadr’s militia and another militia in a residential neighborhood, they surround the area and watch things happen.

Since the beginning of July, the men in our area have been patrolling the streets. Some of them patrol the rooftops and others sit quietly by the homemade road blocks we have on the major roads leading into the area. You cannot in any way rely on Americans or the government. You can only hope your family and friends will remain alive- not safe, not secure- just alive. That’s good enough.

http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/

Quote:
A massive wave of sectarian violence engulfed several districts of Baghdad yesterday. The violence was sparked by news reports of sniper attacks against Shi’ite pilgrims heading to the shrine of Imam Musa Al-Kadhim in Kadhimiya to commemorate his death anniversary. When the news had spread, armed members of ‘popular committees’ (militias) accompanying the pilgrims opened fire against residences in some Sunni districts surrounding Kadhimiya. Others took over Sunni mosques in Sulaikh, Dola’I, and Palestine Street, and reprisals were reported from several areas of Baghdad.

For some reason, Western news agencies have completely missed these serious developments, highly reminiscient of the confessional violence that followed the Samarra shrine attack, but both the Iraqi Al-Sharqiya and Baghdad satellite channels aired video footage of the clashes. The events were corroborated by dozens of eyewitness accounts.

http://healingiraq.blogspot.com/

There's lots of really interesting blogs coming out of Iraq at the moment. It's much more personal (and sadly it's more distressing) than cold news coverage. You can find a lot of them listed here:
http://iraqblogcount.blogspot.com/
It's back after being hacked shortly after the Qana massacre.

Quote:
then September 11th happened. I admit, they are different circumstances, but the principle is basic.


In another thread you said that there was no connection between 9/11 and Iraq.

Quote:
And really - why do we sit here and complain about it. The only way the war has affected anyone here is if they have a friend, relative, acquaintance, etc. go to Iraq.


We care not because of selfish reasons, but because we don't like to see other people suffer. I can't believe you know so few people in the army. I know many, but that's beside the point. Caring is what Christ called us to do - to love our brother's as ourselves. Here's part of a poem written last Friday:

Quote:
On Fridays we watched the evening news
and reflected.
War after war,
we expected
better days…

On Fridays today, under the sun,
they slaughter women,
and rape children.

On Fridays today, mosques turn into infernos,
and the rubber of the flip-flops burn the nostrils
of the bodies on the charred marble floors...

On Fridays now, the streets are quiet.
The silence bites at the ears of travelers,
who move in the shadows unseen,
praying to reach home whole...

On Fridays now, people drink dark coffee.
From one memorial to its neighbor,
the bitter taste becomes the custom.

On Fridays now, people fear the evening news.
War after war…,
they wonder if they have seen the worst…
yet…

http://thewordsthatcomeout.blogspot.com/

Is that really what you wanted? War has not solved any problem. It's made things worse, and now we have to deal with that for the coming few years and decades.
Soulfire
Quote:
Should I point out that the US was among Saddam Hussein's supporters? Maybe I should point out that it was Rumsfeld who was the US envoy to Iraq, and the US who sold Iraq the precursors to its biological weapons. Or I could give you a list of similar tyranical countries which the US supports or has supported. For the use of an airbase in Uzbekistan you were willing to overlook that opposition members to the government were literally boiled alive.

Notice that "was" is a keyword in your post. We supported Saddam when we thought he was doing right, then changed when we realized what was going on.

I think you're jumping to conclusions a bit here with the "precursors to its biological weapons" and "were literally boiled alive." But that's only my opinion.

Quote:
Yes. It does matter. In a democracy leaders should be held accountable for what they say. If a leader misleads you then he or she should be held responsible for what they say particularly when what they lead many tens (or even) hundreds of thousands to their deaths.

How were we mislead?

Quote:
We care not because of selfish reasons, but because we don't like to see other people suffer. I can't believe you know so few people in the army. I know many, but that's beside the point. Caring is what Christ called us to do - to love our brother's as ourselves. Here's part of a poem written last Friday:

A noble claim, but alas, wrong. If you don't like to see people suffer, then why was the world (including the US at the time) content with Saddam killing and torturing his people?

I don't support us going in, but the fact of the matter is that we are there now. If we pull out, Iraq will collapse on itself and all of our previous accomplishments will be undone - we are working, albeit slow, but we're working. (Note that it would go faster if we had some support for our efforts, but whatever, we'll keep doing the dirty work that nobody else wants to do).
carlokes
THEY WANT THE OIL !!

nuff said.
nopaniers
Quote:
We supported Saddam when we thought he was doing right, then changed when we realized what was going on.


You thought that massacring Kurds was "doing right"? The US was supporting him then and turned a blind eye.

Look at your "allies". They aren't democracies, they are countries who cooperate with you on military and trade. It doesn't matter to you what sort of government they have. Saudi Arabia is the most repressive country in the region, Pakistan is a military dictatorship, Egypt isn't democratic, Kuwait is an emirate, as is the UAE, Jordan (who I respect) is a kingdom. In Central Asia you're supporting undemocratic ex-Soviet regimes for the use of their airstrips. You just supported the bombing of the Lebanon.

Quote:
I think you're jumping to conclusions a bit here with the "precursors to its biological weapons" and "were literally boiled alive." But that's only my opinion.


That precursors were sold to Iraq is detailed in the US's own Senate Banking Committee report of 1994. Also important are their investigations in 1992. Feel free to read it for yourself.
Quote:
A 1994 investigation by the Senate Banking Committee turned up dozens of biological agents shipped to Iraq during the mid-'80s under license from the Commerce Department, including various strains of anthrax, subsequently identified by the Pentagon as a key component of the Iraqi biological warfare program. The Commerce Department also approved the export of insecticides to Iraq, despite widespread suspicions that they were being used for chemical warfare.


That Uzbekistan oppostition members were boiled alive is known because the British embassy obtained an autopsy of their corpses. See for example:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,963497,00.html
Or for some disturbingly graphic pictures (please do not click here unless you are over 18 and are prepared):
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article3943.htm

Quote:
How were we mislead?


You were told that there Iraq had a nuclear program, and WMD. Also, AlQaeda and 9/11 were constantly associated with Iraq by your politicians even though there was no such connection.

Quote:
A noble claim, but alas, wrong. If you don't like to see people suffer, then why was the world (including the US at the time) content with Saddam killing and torturing his people?


If you are concerned about these things then perhaps you would consider joining Amnesty International? I can tell you why the US was content with it was a cynical attitude that supporting Iraq was a better way to spread US power:
Former US ambassador to Iraq wrote:
We were concerned that Iraq should not lose the war with Iran, because that would have threatened Saudi Arabia and the Gulf.

So the US was prepared to overlook Saddam's abuses for power. Like always they were acting in their own interest - that of spreading US power - and not the interests of the Kurds.

Quote:
Note that it would go faster if we had some support for our efforts, but whatever, we'll keep doing the dirty work that nobody else wants to do.


Well that is a little funny isn't it? I am from a country, Australia, who sent troops, and I'm living in a country, Britain, who controls the south of Iraq. Funny how we get ignored.

You insulted your allies when they warned you exactly what would happen when you invaded. They were absolutely right to say that they weren't convinced about your claims about WMD and connection to terrorism. Your leaders said they didn't need the support of "Old Europe", and you blew off my country, Australia, when we as your friends asked you to get security council approval. You ignored the democratic wishes of the vast majority of the world... Bush said very loudly in his SOTU address that you didn't need their approval to start his war, and now you're complaining you're in a mess and there's no-one there to help you.
palavra
Soulfire wrote:
[Notice that "was" is a keyword in your post. We supported Saddam when we thought he was doing right, then changed when we realized what was going on.

.



you supported saddam when you thought he was useful for your benefits.

like you did in Chile.

you didn't care when he killed hundred of kurdish people.

and if you believe what you are talking either you are so naive or you think we are stupid.
HoboPelican
No new topics on the Middle East, please.

All of this can be said in the the Middle East


-Locked-
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