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Incredible fact against the free speech in the net





Da Rossa
I got astonished today while listening to radio news. The Brazilian elections are coming up (oct 3) and the candidates are on a frenzy. Here in Brazil there is a state at the North region, called Amapá, where one of our former presidents came from. He's currently running for a place in the Senate.
Recently a woman (civilian, mortal civilian), journalist (I'll call her Maria in here), put a caricature of him in her blog, a photograph took from a wall. I don't know how, the candidate, named José Sarney, pleaded a 'response right' in the electoral court. Surprisingly, it was sustained by the judge. Maria got notified by the TRE (Tribunal Regional Eleitoral, or Regional Electoral Tribunal), and complied to remove the photo and the user comments from her blog. Hours later, the Content Provider, UOL (On-Line Universe, one of the biggest in Brazil), that hosted the blog, shut in down, without warnings or further explanations.



In the following day, Maria's sister, let's call her Gina in here, who also had a well-visited blog, wrote an article making references to this and built a list of ~100 other blogs of the same type, that talk about politicians and candidates. None of them were shut. Gina's blog was also shut down, not much after her sister's had been so.

Questions:
1 - What did you think about the TRE's decision to remove the post and the user comments from the blog?
2 - And about UOL, the host, that suddenly shut the entire blog down?
3 - What normally happens in your country (please specify yours, with state in case of US) if a candidate went to the judge to ask something like this?
4 - Is it a sign that the privacy and free speech in the internet is threatened?

Thanks for attention.
LukeakaDanish
Hehe...as long as we have loads of countries where "they" dont have any power (russia, africa, etc) the net will remain free...

My main thought is that the service provider for the blog where crap - they shouldnt have allowed the shutting down of the site as its clearly not legally justifiable.
Nameless
The service provider for the blog probably had the legal power to shut it down anyway (you know, hidden away in the fine print somewhere that nobody actually reads). Taking legal action to remove somebody's opinions though, IMHO, is wrong. Confused

And freedom of speach, along with all our other freedoms, are slowly being reduced by the legendary 'them'. Rolling Eyes
paulbarter
that all sounds pretty creepy to me - that the government would even care about someone's blog is something. Its probably not a good sign for the country, however, being able to blog about absolutely anything is not a good idea either. The trouble with the internet is that there is little control over what goes up. usually no-one even proof reads it. just because you can see something, doesnt mean you should. We need to respect peoples rights on the net just as in any other area of life. You cant put up posters in main road defacing someone. Just because it is easy to do and somewhere in cyberspace, doesn't make it right.
Da Rossa
Nameless wrote:
The service provider for the blog probably had the legal power to shut it down anyway (you know, hidden away in the fine print somewhere that nobody actually reads). Taking legal action to remove somebody's opinions though, IMHO, is wrong. Confused

And freedom of speach, along with all our other freedoms, are slowly being reduced by the legendary 'them'. Rolling Eyes


I think it hadn't the legal power to do it, but it just rules the blogs it provides, so I think that the "juridical department" ordered the removal to prevent harassment from the candidate.

Quote:
We need to respect peoples rights on the net just as in any other area of life. You cant put up posters in main road defacing someone. Just because it is easy to do and somewhere in cyberspace, doesn't make it right.


The poster was not, in my view, DEFACING the man. It was a caricature, in my concept, caricatures themselves are not offensive, unless the picture contains something else, or the character is handing something or doing something. That painting on the wall was a mean of expression the local population found against him. The painting was there, but the blog had been harassed.
Soulfire
I have a question for you all:

Question Do our personal freedoms (speech, for example) still apply to the internet?

Remember, the internet is a worldwide network, and the world clearly doesn't agree about things (again, such as freedom of speech). Just look at China's attempt to censor Google.
Da Rossa
Soulfire wrote:
I have a question for you all:

Question Do our personal freedoms (speech, for example) still apply to the internet?

Remember, the internet is a worldwide network, and the world clearly doesn't agree about things (again, such as freedom of speech). Just look at China's attempt to censor Google.


This is not the question here. The fact is about Brazil, a (very) democratic country, and generally people talk sproudly even about things that aren't really necessary, for example: the "celebrity" gossip. A 'respect' tv channel elects someone at their criteria and make him/her a celebrity overnight.
But this fact about former president Sarney is hilarious; with no priors at all. And this is all about Brazil, so things that apply here in Brasília should apply also to Macapá, AP. So, our personal freedoms do apply to the net, as the (former) host was Brazilian too. Now, journalist Alcinéa moved to blogger, from Google, located at the US, a democratic country too.
paul_indo
Don't be so suprised.

I grew up in one of the world freeist democracies. I saw the world through eyes that had never seen real injustice or abuse of power. Most of my life i believed that fairness and human decency prevail.

GET REAL

I woke up eventualy.
I moved to Indonesia which was ruled by a dictator, then became a democracy, but then seemed to be ruled by all the ex-dictators buddies.
police protect the rich and extort money from the poor.
Courts sell their verdict to the highest bidder.
New members of parliment rush to build new houses and buy new luxury cars on the money they embezel from their departments and the bribes they collect.
Public servants extort bribes from the public they are suposed to serve.

The world is not a fair place. Most of the people in democracies do not have half the freedom they believe they have.
The world is changing, and not for the better.
Conspiracy theories? Maybe.
Look for yourself, the ongoing push for a real enquiry into 911, the lies told to justify the invasion of Iraq, these are the major stories, but look at the daily interference in the lives of people to maintain the staus quo for multinational companies and ensure their dominance of the worlds economy. Look at the profiteering of the worlds drug manufacturers, enabled by government regulation in the developed world.

No, this world is not a fair place.
Da Rossa
Finally I found someone that agrees that the 9/11 was a big lie plotted by the US government. Mut this is not the point. Regarding to the freedom speech, Brazil is fairly good. The dictatorial period ended 21 years ago and many things have changed, undoubtely. My concern is about the lack of knowledge of the judge in Amapá.
tyrant
9/11 = regardless at how you look at it, was a disaster, that could happen and is happening everywhere else, more often in a smaller scale.

I'm no fan of the US, but you have to look at it from a larger scale, as quoted
"with great power comes great responsibility", unfortunately today, "with great power, so must come abuse and idocacy"...

enough of digressing, free speech is ony applicable when you say good things about the the people in power. Anything other then compliments and flattery = against the code of free speech. So now you know the definition of free speech Very Happy
Da Rossa
tyrant wrote:
9/11 = regardless at how you look at it, was a disaster, that could happen and is happening everywhere else, more often in a smaller scale.

I'm no fan of the US, but you have to look at it from a larger scale, as quoted
"with great power comes great responsibility", unfortunately today, "with great power, so must come abuse and idocacy"...

enough of digressing, free speech is ony applicable when you say good things about the the people in power. Anything other then compliments and flattery = against the code of free speech. So now you know the definition of free speech Very Happy


Brazil, besides if you're talking about Brasilia former Governor Joaquim Roriz, a.k.a. The Thief, you're likely to spread the word, if you do it properly via internet. The media in here, in a good part, is compromised also. Some other politicians manage to buy quickly all the copies of a certain edition of a magazine that discloses some facts about their lives.
2 problems here:
1 - Most of the people, which belong to the group that will decide the upcoming elections, are funtionally illiterate, so they're very easily manipulated.
2 - The wise people that have a position to defend cannot do it directly at the newspapers as they're compromised, they often write books but it's not part of Brazilians' hobbies to ready like the Russians, so they have to do via internet, in blogs for example, what do not have good credibility, and very few people read.
nopaniers
Sounds like she should have hosted her blog on an offshore server. Wink
Da Rossa
nopaniers wrote:
Sounds like she should have hosted her blog on an offshore server. Wink


She's @ Blogger now: http://alcineacavalcante.blogspot.com/

And, believe me, Sarney also tried to shut down her Google hosted blog! ROFL!! Razz
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