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subs or dubs






Which do you prefer?
Dus
20%
 20%  [ 10 ]
Subs
79%
 79%  [ 39 ]
Total Votes : 49

xframe
Which do you prefer watching subs or dubs and why?

Personally it depends on weather or not I've already seen the anime subbed.

I watched NGE subbed then tried watching it dubbed and it seemed to take alot out of the characters. Many of the voice actors in dubs do not fit their character in my opinion for example Tiffany Grant playing Asuka. She made Asuka sound oooolld.

If I first see an anime with dubs before seeing it with subs i can handle it...but not the other way around.
juliox
I do prefer Sub 100% bc the feeling is still there with the real character sounds,the original speech that mk you to watch or like more the anime, that why i prefer SUBs Razz
urbanbuddha
I voted subs, but only because it is my belief that I should watch the original they way it was produced in its home country.

Before we see post pertaining to "I like subs because they are Japanese and that they are superior to the english dubs" should stop and think about the localization of Japanese animation. It is pretty much a given that some, not all, American licenses will butcher up a Japanese series for an North American audience. It is only because the American companies believe that the general population will not completely understand the history or backdrop to the cultural references without any consultation to a source, either the internet or a book.

This goes without saying that Japanese subs is always superior than the english dubs. If you think about the opposite, the Japanese appropiating an American franchise; the current one, to my knowledge, is the Power Puff Girls... well you can see how that one is so messed up.

As well there there are some good english dubs out there.

In conclusion, don't break what isn't broken =)
Binary
In most cases , Subs.

Example : Hajim no ippo's Dubs are horrible...
Naruto= Horrible...
And if i have to listen to Resident evil's 1 dubs ever again, i'll kill myself...

But... There are some nice dubs.. Like trigun.. Trigun was good..
Aiz
Subs.

I agree that not only the subbing themselves, the American versions altered the series to suit the American taste.

Take sailor moon for example (I know I know, humor me, it's the first one that popped into my mind) there was a site that dedicated to the changes made to the series in the american version o.o Although in most cases it doesn't matter, but sometimes you might miss something important to the story because of it.

and subbing, not just anime, games too, because frankly, American voice acting sucked. the first one that came to mind is Valkyrie profile, god the voice acting *dies*
Binary
Yeah, its amazing how something can be so perfect, and then crappy dubs ruin it.
Scaramanga
Aiz wrote:
Subs.

I agree that not only the subbing themselves, the American versions altered the series to suit the American taste.

Take sailor moon for example (I know I know, humor me, it's the first one that popped into my mind) there was a site that dedicated to the changes made to the series in the american version o.o Although in most cases it doesn't matter, but sometimes you might miss something important to the story because of it.

I think people are confusing badly cut broadcast anime for dubs in their entirety. Those shows that are aired on TV usually are cut at the behest of the networks (and has nothing to do with the studios or voice actors.) So please don't confuse the two.

Now I don't argue that there are some bad American dubs, but then again, I would posit that there are some pretty horrible Japanese dubs/voice acting as well (yes, the Japanese DUB their cartoons too.) Admittedly the industry for voice actors in Japan is bigger and more lucrative than it is in the West, which is why I think we have a much smaller stable of actors to choose from (and why they, on occasion, tend to be awful.)

And the first person who brings up Naruto as an example of a bad dub will get punched in the bladder/ovaries. I've watched it on CN, and the voices pretty much fit their 2-dimentsional characters.

EDIT: Oh and for the record, I didn't vote one way or the other. There should've been a "BOTH" option, as I have no real preference, and have been known to watch shows dubbed and subtitled (sometimes the same show in both formats!)
Binary
[quote="Scaramanga"]
Aiz wrote:



And the first person who brings up Naruto as an example of a bad dub will get punched in the bladder/ovaries. I've watched it on CN, and the voices pretty much fit their 2-dimentsional characters.




I already brought up the Naruto dubs..
They're not that great...
And they translated a meaningless phrase "dattebayo" to "Belive it"
So now he runs around saying "BELIVE IT" every other sentence..


Good subs = DBZ ( So the series wasn't the best, The dubs where great...)
Trigun (amazing..)
Samarui Champoo
Theres more, but I'm way to lazy to think about them..
jenus
perhaps here is a big time confusion bc the subd that i watch from Naruto said dattebayo and not what you are saying is bc i download from the main page where i guess in japan they sub the anime and there is not such as weird thing as BELIEVE IT lol man that suck, so there are
Scaramanga
Binary wrote:
Scaramanga wrote:
And the first person who brings up Naruto as an example of a bad dub will get punched in the bladder/ovaries. I've watched it on CN, and the voices pretty much fit their 2-dimentsional characters.

I already brought up the Naruto dubs..
They're not that great...
And they translated a meaningless phrase "dattebayo" to "Belive it"
So now he runs around saying "BELIVE IT" every other sentence..

Uhhhm, there's a reason he says that. Because, as you pointed out Dattebayo doesn't mean anything (well it sort of does, it's the verb da with -ttebayo at the end, which is means to give the speaker a brusque, uncultured sound.) Since he says SOMETHING there, the dubbers HAVE to have him say something, and since leaving Dattebayo in wouldn't make much sense to most American viewers, they dubbed in "Believe it!" to match the lip flaps.

And I don't see what's wrong with the dubs, the voices pretty much fit the Naruto characters: Naruto is brash and outgoing, Sasuke sounds like an angsty teen, and Sakura sounds like an unimportant girl. I mean it's not like Naruto has a deep and meaningful story.


Binary wrote:
Good subs = DBZ ( So the series wasn't the best, The dubs where great...)

The dub was great? What, they sat around the studio going "Huuuurgggghhhnnnfffff" for three hours.

Binary wrote:
Trigun (amazing..)

Johnny Yong Bosch is overrated IMO, but he does a better job than Crispin Freeman most of the time.

Also, for some good dubs, check out the shows that Bang Zoom! (formerly Animaze) does; they're usually top notch.
Obake
scaramanga wrote:
binary wrote:

Good subs = DBZ ( So the series wasn't the best, The dubs where great...),


The dub was great? What, they sat around the studio going "Huuuurgggghhhnnnfffff" for three hours.


Yeah, but it was a "Huuuurgggghhhnnnfffff" with heart and soul, right? Razz

It’s funny how opinions differ so much even thought the poll tells us we’re all on the same side (saving Scaramanga’s presence).

I came down on the sub side because that’s what I’ll automatically reach for if given the choice, but Scaramanga’s right—there are cases of appalling Japanese dubs too, and equally there are English-language dubs I really appreciate. I’ve yet to watch Evangelion in anything other than the dub, for example, and I’ll switch quite happily between the two with Howl’s Moving Castle.

Part of the reason I prefer subs has little to do with whether I think the one cast is likely to be better or ‘truer’ to the anime than the other—it comes down to having had the benefit of several years of Japanese classes, and being curious about how much of the original script I’m actually able to follow. There have been times when I’ve cringed just as much at what I feel to be a bad translating decision as I would at a bad piece of American voice-acting.

And sometimes either one can be appreciated for different reasons. In Fruits Basket, I far prefer the sub, but a close friend of mine prefers the dub—and all based on the voice acting for the same character, Tohru. In my opinion the American voice actor makes her come across as insincere and rather vapid, but my friend feels that the Japanese voice actor turns her into too much of a 'cute Japanese girl' cliche—shy, retiring, naive, constantly putting others before herself. So we both appreciate the anime, and we both appreciate the character, but for very different reasons, based on our sub/dub preference for that particular series.
Wanderer
I like the Full Metal Alchemist dub better than watching it subbed because of the jokes in the enlgish version were funnier. It really depends on the anime. some are good dubbed and some are bad. It depends on who the american station is targeting. Like the One Piece dub they were trying to get kids to watch it. While the things on Adult Swim are less censored because it targets an older audience.
Scaramanga
Obake wrote:
It’s funny how opinions differ so much even thought the poll tells us we’re all on the same side (saving Scaramanga’s presence).

Hey, I just abstained, because I'd vote for both, given a choice, as I think both can have their merits.

Obake wrote:
I came down on the sub side because that’s what I’ll automatically reach for if given the choice, but Scaramanga’s right—there are cases of appalling Japanese dubs too, and equally there are English-language dubs I really appreciate. I’ve yet to watch Evangelion in anything other than the dub, for example, and I’ll switch quite happily between the two with Howl’s Moving Castle.

See I will generally watch the sub first, and see how complicated a show is, but with a show where I want to just catch cool visuals, I'll switch to dubs so that I can just enjoy that aspect without the subtitles detracting from that. Also, with Eva, I've found it's actually good to watch it in dubs AND subs (and with a show like Eva, more than likely you're going to be watching it more than a few times.)

Obake wrote:
And sometimes either one can be appreciated for different reasons. In Fruits Basket, I far prefer the sub, but a close friend of mine prefers the dub—and all based on the voice acting for the same character, Tohru. In my opinion the American voice actor makes her come across as insincere and rather vapid, but my friend feels that the Japanese voice actor turns her into too much of a 'cute Japanese girl' cliche—shy, retiring, naive, constantly putting others before herself.

Well your friend is odd, because isn't that description of Tohru pretty much accurate? Of course I haven't listened to the dub yet of Fruba, so I may be biased.

Also, what tends to be one of my bigger problems with picking one or the other, is that with the amount of anime DVDs I own, I find it hard to make the time to listen to BOTH the sub and dub. So I generally have to pick one or the other, and rarely do I get around to watching the series the other way.
Kurosaki_Ichigo-San
Definetly subs, I can't stand those bad dubs where the mouths are moving yet words are comin out but it's not even moving at the right speed XD.
Seithex
Subs, no contest. They make an anime more like an anime. Sometimes Dubs are good and sometimes there not. Naruto dubs are horrible, the annoying voices and multiple edits. Some like Samurai Champloo wre actually good VA's and had almost no editting at all.
xframe
Seithex wrote:
Subs, no contest. They make an anime more like an anime. Sometimes Dubs are good and sometimes there not. Naruto dubs are horrible, the annoying voices and multiple edits. Some like Samurai Champloo wre actually good VA's and had almost no editting at all.


haha the words Naruto and dub do not mix at all. I lisented to 30 seconds of Naruto dubbed and immediatly stopped watching.
Obake
scaramanga wrote:
Hey, I just abstained, because I'd vote for both, given a choice, as I think both can have their merits.


^^; That’s kind of what I meant. Everyone else seems to be going ‘subs, totally’ but giving different reasons for why (American voice acting changes character interpretations, American-dubbed shows—on TV at least—tend to get horribly chopped up, etc.). You’re the only person to have actually taken a different, more moderate approach to the original question. Although I do note that we’ve had a couple of votes for dubs now. Where are you, dubbers?

I’m expecting that Eva subbed is excellent as well, when I get to watching it that way (currently I’m going through the DVDS in the dub for nostalgic purposes—I originally watched the series on good old VHS, where dub was the only choice we had).

I actually find that I’m beginning to develop a greater appreciation for American dubs the longer I linger in anime fandom. Partly that’s going to be because American voice actors are starting to get the hang of things by now, and partly because certain productions (I’m thinking of Miyazaki films in particular, here) are starting to have enough—dare I say mainstream?—pull to get well-known talents on the cast. Howl’s Moving Castle is an example of this. Jean Simmons and Lauren Bacall are wonderful in their respective roles as Grandma Sophie and the Witch of the Waste. And as one of the gentlemen behind the film’s American production points out in an interview, Christian Bale pulls off a neat trick with Howl—making a character trope that’s popular in Japan (slightly effeminate, but nonetheless powerful, male lead), but still relatively unfamiliar in America/the ‘West’, accessible for that audience. That’s especially not bad considering the most recent film role he’d be known for is the rather (troubled) masculine role of the Batman in Batman Begins.

Another part of it is that, the more anime I watch, the more I begin to recognise clichés in Japanese voice acting as well. It doesn’t necessarily make me enjoy a show any less, but I’m beginning to recognise that what once seemed to be original ways of voice-acting are actually just accepted patterns in Japan that happen to differ from what I’d known before.

To get back to the Tohru example, both voice actors invoke certain stereotypes—in the Japanese dub she really is a bit of the clichéd Ideal Cute Japanese Schoolgirl, and the American voice actor turns her into another character type that I personally prefer less.

To be fair to my friend, she does recognise what Tohru’s character is meant to be—it’s that she has problems with that particular Japanese trope, where the idea of a ‘good girl’ is someone who is extremely submissive and selfless with a nigh-superhuman level of empathy. The American dub version apparently differs just enough for it to be more acceptable. (And if that’s my friend’s take on it, then all I can say is that she’s far less prejudiced in her interpretation of the American dub than I am, since certain aspects of my interpretation are partly based on elements of the dub that have little to do with the actor’s ability—her strong valley-girl accent, for example).

scaramanga wrote:
Also, what tends to be one of my bigger problems with picking one or the other, is that with the amount of anime DVDs I own, I find it hard to make the time to listen to BOTH the sub and dub. So I generally have to pick one or the other, and rarely do I get around to watching the series the other way.


Very Happy My anime collection is cute and tiny, because I relied heavily on our very nice local video rental store for my anime fix until I left high school several years ago (and I’ve been seriously out of pocket for most of the time since. Yeah, poor uni student here. Livin’ the cliché.) The upshot of this was that for a while I didn’t get the chance to watch subs at all, until DVD releases (and therefore, choice) became the norm. When subs did become widely available I automatically went for those because, back then, the Japanese voice-acting seemed so much better (I hadn’t learned to spot those other clichés yet), and I wanted to see how much of the Japanese I could recognise—and how much I could pick up—from watching the subs.

In general, though, I'll buy a DVD with the intention of watching the sub, then get curious and play a few minutes of the dub. If the dub is any good in those few minutes, it might get watched later; if not, I forget that it's even there.
ashen
I like Sub! This is better than Dub, because we can hear the original voice of the characters. It's very effective for anime.
Untill now I just have found a few good and pro local dubber, that was several years ago.
Cthulhuman
While I find myself wanting to watch dubs, I find my lethargy getting in the way and only watching them if I have to but if it has both I'll watch the dubed version.
Scaramanga
Obake wrote:

(A whole bunch of really good stuff)

Wow, for that well thought-out and reasoned reply, you not only have my respect, but a little something else as well. In a debate where opinions and tempers often flare, that's a rarity. Kudos.
CMA
Subs. I always go for the original versions, because dubs in different languages are often filled with problems such as loss of lip-synching, and more annoyingly, when jokes and puns are lost due to translations.
For instance, I liked Azumanga Daioh. It was a damn test to my brain's resistance, but I managed to watch it all in one go without imploding. And I might even do it again. Rolling Eyes Now, for those who watched Azumanga already, you know that the series is filled with puns and jokes only someone familiar with the Japanese culture would understand. I haven't watched the Azumanga english-dub, but I can guess most jokes were cut out and/or changed with others that might end up not being so funny. In cases like these, I'd rather stick with the original than ruining a good series.

Dubs are often worse than the originals, but I'm not saying that there aren't acceptable ones.
Nintendo
xframe wrote:
I watched NGE subbed then tried watching it dubbed and it seemed to take alot out of the characters. Many of the voice actors in dubs do not fit their character in my opinion for example Tiffany Grant playing Asuka. She made Asuka sound oooolld.

If I first see an anime with dubs before seeing it with subs i can handle it...but not the other way around.


EXACTLY. having the voices dubbed really messes up with the characters. Their emotions and even how they say things just doesnt convey to how they were originally supposed to be. Love hina and naruto especially really pee me off with the dubbed voices. Naruto sounds like an electric toothbrush, and kitsune with this really annoying texas accent!!
Scaramanga
CMA wrote:
Subs. I always go for the original versions, because dubs in different languages are often filled with problems such as loss of lip-synching, and more annoyingly, when jokes and puns are lost due to translations.
For instance, I liked Azumanga Daioh. It was a damn test to my brain's resistance, but I managed to watch it all in one go without imploding. And I might even do it again. Rolling Eyes Now, for those who watched Azumanga already, you know that the series is filled with puns and jokes only someone familiar with the Japanese culture would understand. I haven't watched the Azumanga english-dub, but I can guess most jokes were cut out and/or changed with others that might end up not being so funny. In cases like these, I'd rather stick with the original than ruining a good series.

I'm curious, are you Japanese? Because I don't understand how you'd get most of the obscure cultural references anyway (without help from liner-notes, which admittedly, most companies are nice enough to include these days.) I have no problem with them localizing the humour. And saying that the jokes are funnier in the original Japanese is kind of baseless unless again, you yourself are Japanese. And who's to say the original Japanese jokes weren't bad too? And you know, I'd say the average viewer doesn't CARE about obscure Japanese humour or cultural references.

I'm not saying you're wrong or anything, just providing an alternate point of view.
crimson_aria
I prefer subs. I just like the way I hear how their voices sound in real version (in japanese). And if you can understand the language, you'll see how they translated it.
eku53ru
I've always chosen English subs/Japanese audio over English dubs, but that's because I haven't found many dubs that I've liked. I've seen only a few of the series I've watched with subtitles dubbed, though, since I normally don't have enough time to view both. I flip between the languages for fun when I rewatch a series, and if the dub's done a good job there, I'll give the English track a chance.

There are some dubs where I'll take the time to rewatch the whole series, but there are others where I'll turn off the television once I hear something that my brain registers as an abomination (which varies with each series).

What normally jars me the most is transitioning between the two; regardless of which one I watch first, the other track sounds foreign/ugly/weird/etc. to me until I get used to it five episodes later. XD
sugar-poo
I prefer Subs. Because It is a faster way to trasnlate and it won't bother you about the voice ^^
nadk
I personally like it subbed, cause everything i saw it dubbed they never get the voice right. i've seen soo many in sub that it doesnt bother me at all. also its eayer to find subbed anime then dubbed. so subbed all they way for me Very Happy
jkelly888
I prefer SUbs because it preserves the originality of the anime. by originality, i mean the original voices and everything. When an american company does a dub, they usually pick the absolute worst voice actors for the characters and the anime souns horrible.
clip
subs. I really like to watch a movie hearing the original voices. Though dubs are really helpful for you can concentrate much on the animation, since you won't be reading the text below the movie you're watching Smile
Raijenki
urbanbuddha wrote:
I voted subs, but only because it is my belief that I should watch the original they way it was produced in its home country.

Before we see post pertaining to "I like subs because they are Japanese and that they are superior to the english dubs" should stop and think about the localization of Japanese animation. It is pretty much a given that some, not all, American licenses will butcher up a Japanese series for an North American audience. It is only because the American companies believe that the general population will not completely understand the history or backdrop to the cultural references without any consultation to a source, either the internet or a book.

This goes without saying that Japanese subs is always superior than the english dubs. If you think about the opposite, the Japanese appropiating an American franchise; the current one, to my knowledge, is the Power Puff Girls... well you can see how that one is so messed up.

As well there there are some good english dubs out there.

In conclusion, don't break what isn't broken =)

Agree =)
I hate take the dubbed because it always gets censured by the trash of 4Kids...
If you want see, the Pocket Monsters (knowed as Pokémon), had 3 Openings in the Advance Generation Series... 4Kids just made one using some scenes of each one...
Oh, don't forget about the fights, blood, etc... Father Bush don't likes it...
ambifire
Definitely subs, since the original "flavor" of the show is getting diluted every time we go down the heirarchy. In manga, which many anime series are based on, simply b/c somebody who thinks up the idea isn't going to go through all the trouble to make an anime which needs a full production team unless if they were an employee at a big company (like square enix....GO FMA!). In manga, it's normally everything goes, no censorship, no rules, hence stuff appearing like in the show naruto, neji's seal looks like a swastika. after it goes into anime, when the series gains enough popularity, they tune it down alot to fit ratings. this way, alot of the old flavor gets lost. if you take this tuned down version and you add bad voice acting, toned down graphics, and the MPAA (motion pictures association of america), you get the disaster which is called Dubbed One Piece. some series look good even after dubbing, such as Fullmetal Alchemist (how can fma possibly look bad i dont know), and Samurai Champloo. I have mixed feelings about inuyasha. On one hand, the dubs look kinda stupid, and the other hand, it pretty much captures the spirit of the original anime so..... i'm not sure whether to love or hate it.
Zenrei
I concurr with my fellow Fans. Dubs just ruin the whole aspect of anime in its entirety. So many reasons why.

In japanese there are so many honorifics that translating into a simpler language such as english, even by a top of the line professional, diminshes the complexity of emotions and meanings behind the speech. that, acompanied with the censorship that western civilisation imposes on youngsters is even more disturbing. tone of voice, inflection, speed. these things cant be replicated. I speak and understna da fair amount of japanese. and Listening to Naruto in japanese is worth it. if you tune into a cartoon channel and you try to make ends meet with their products you feel sad, not only is the plot softened, but the momentum of it is affected aswell, the emotion behind the voice is lost, the dinamical speed is monotonized, the tone of Vocie, wich actualy makes the character work is destroyed. Dubs are for people that jsut want the story not the experience. Subs are for people that dont nesesarily know japanese but like to experience the phenomenon on its entirety. i say Burn all dub products, lets have a bonfire and sing around it ^.^


Ja ne Razz
Pathogen246
Subs, definately.
Hardrive
Subs are the best!!! you can hear the original voices and sounds.

bye
NewGuyinTown
English dubs wouldn't be so bad if they had some great voice actors.

I watch some Inuyasha episodes, and I thought the english dub was pretty good.

English dub for Fullmetal Alchemist was good.
shwetanshu
prefer subs.. in dubbing they translate everything to Hindi... in HP series, in india alytherin is spoken as Naagshakti
mrlego9
i went with dubs cus im not that quick of a read and usaly miss some of the subing. ive tried watching subs after i watch the dub and the way the chrs change is confsing to meh(exp Spike from enligsh to jap).

But after reading all this im guna probly switch my mind.
filet
I prefer subs than dubs,with subs the voice expressions are much real and its not just reading the scripts' lines which i hate it!!!!!
filet
Zenrei wrote:
I concurr with my fellow Fans. Dubs just ruin the whole aspect of anime in its entirety. So many reasons why.

In japanese there are so many honorifics that translating into a simpler language such as english, even by a top of the line professional, diminshes the complexity of emotions and meanings behind the speech. that, acompanied with the censorship that western civilisation imposes on youngsters is even more disturbing. tone of voice, inflection, speed. these things cant be replicated. I speak and understna da fair amount of japanese. and Listening to Naruto in japanese is worth it. if you tune into a cartoon channel and you try to make ends meet with their products you feel sad, not only is the plot softened, but the momentum of it is affected aswell, the emotion behind the voice is lost, the dinamical speed is monotonized, the tone of Vocie, wich actualy makes the character work is destroyed. Dubs are for people that jsut want the story not the experience. Subs are for people that dont nesesarily know japanese but like to experience the phenomenon on its entirety. i say Burn all dub products, lets have a bonfire and sing around it ^.^


Ja ne Razz


very well said...especially in the expression of emotion, with dubs somehow you cant get across the emotion that are delivered from the movie/drama/anime you watching
trimbaard
Okk nederlanders hier
jasmine
I prefer the subs. The voices are more apt to the visuals and well... you feel more of the workings and plot behind the creation of the show compared to a dubbed one. Well, at least thats the way it is for me. Very Happy
Rebzie
yeah quite alot of Salior moon has been changed in the dubbed version I've never actually seen the original version but i've read about wha has been changed. The main changed they did was making salior uranius straight when she was a lesbian in the original series the also made her girlfriend her cousin aswell.

Aiz wrote:
Subs.

I agree that not only the subbing themselves, the American versions altered the series to suit the American taste.

Take sailor moon for example (I know I know, humor me, it's the first one that popped into my mind) there was a site that dedicated to the changes made to the series in the american version o.o Although in most cases it doesn't matter, but sometimes you might miss something important to the story because of it.

and subbing, not just anime, games too, because frankly, American voice acting sucked. the first one that came to mind is Valkyrie profile, god the voice acting *dies*
yy1124
I will go for subs...
I like the characters sound "original"
Scaramanga
Rebzie wrote:
yeah quite alot of Salior moon has been changed in the dubbed version I've never actually seen the original version but i've read about wha has been changed. The main changed they did was making salior uranius straight when she was a lesbian in the original series the also made her girlfriend her cousin aswell.

Aiz wrote:
Subs.

I agree that not only the subbing themselves, the American versions altered the series to suit the American taste.

Take sailor moon for example (I know I know, humor me, it's the first one that popped into my mind) there was a site that dedicated to the changes made to the series in the american version o.o Although in most cases it doesn't matter, but sometimes you might miss something important to the story because of it.

and subbing, not just anime, games too, because frankly, American voice acting sucked. the first one that came to mind is Valkyrie profile, god the voice acting *dies*

NONE of this has anything to do with dubbing! What you are talking about is editing, and is completely unrelated. I wish people would stop saying that this is what makes dubs bad.

Also, for all you people that say you like subs because you like anime in its original language, do anyone of you actually understand Japanese fluently? Because if not, I don't think ANY of you is qualified to say the original Japanese seiyuu are better than the American VAs. And if you CAN understand and read Japanese, go to 2ch and discover that the Japanese bitch as much about their seiyuu as you guys do about dubs. Good grief people.
yy1124
eventhough you don't understand japanese, but the tone, the voice itself (original japanese version) is a crucial part in presenting the personalities of the characters. Japanese do this well, I believe they emphasize alot in selecting people to voice for the characters. You don't have to understand japanese to know how the character felt, they sound "excited" when they are excited...the difference is obvious if yoou got a crap dubs...

furthermore, japanese + sub is a great help in learning japanese if you ask me...my sis understand japanese now, by watching animation only....
jasmine
And for some reason, most dubs make use of the really 'small' voice as if micmicking the small but adorable voices of the Japanese voice actors. But they come out really hi-pitch weird and annoying! XD
Scaramanga
yy1124 wrote:
eventhough you don't understand japanese, but the tone, the voice itself (original japanese version) is a crucial part in presenting the personalities of the characters. Japanese do this well, I believe they emphasize alot in selecting people to voice for the characters. You don't have to understand japanese to know how the character felt, they sound "excited" when they are excited...the difference is obvious if yoou got a crap dubs...

Well "crap" dubs is a bit subjective, isn't it? I think Keanu Reeves is a terrible actor, but I know people who think he's the best thing since sliced bread. Also, this "emotion" you're talking about in anime; I can only think of a FEW anime where emotion is a vital part of the story (and NO kids, Naruto and Bleach ain't it!) Here's the bottom line though, even though being a seiyuu is much more highly regarded in Japan than it is in the West, it's still not the same thing as being a professional actor, otherwise all those VAs would be out there acting in big budget movies (or at the very least in Disney/Pixar/Dreamworks movies.)

yy1124 wrote:
furthermore, japanese + sub is a great help in learning japanese if you ask me...my sis understand japanese now, by watching animation only....

Ahahaha, NO. Understanding some Japanese phrases because they appear in anime is not the same thing as learning Japanese (dame dame!) Also, learning Japanese from anime is liable to have you learn things incorrectly (especially if there are characters with a Kansai-ben or Tohoku-ben.) Also, bear in mind there is still a lot of distinction of genders in language in Japanese, and it's very easy to accidentally use a male form when you should be using female and vice versa. I'm not saying it can't be handy or fun if you're already taking advance Japanese classes, but don't learn Japanese from anime.
Asgardsfall
I'm Dubs ... but then I watch all my anime on DVD so can rewatch with Subs if I feel like it.
I find Subs text is more mechanical and less conversational than Dubs, plus (and no offense intended) the constant growling sound of the male Japanese actors really gets on my nerves.
mtoni
subs ftw...

I agree.. DBZ have good dubs, but the rest.......
The dubs sounds so emotionless at the emotional times and so full of emotion when theres no need for that.

I think that you should listen to the original and not to someones 'translation'....

thank god that they dont dub show in my country (holland)
yy1124
Quote:

Well "crap" dubs is a bit subjective, isn't it? I think Keanu Reeves is a terrible actor, but I know people who think he's the best thing since sliced bread. Also, this "emotion" you're talking about in anime; I can only think of a FEW anime where emotion is a vital part of the story (and NO kids, Naruto and Bleach ain't it!) Here's the bottom line though, even though being a seiyuu is much more highly regarded in Japan than it is in the West, it's still not the same thing as being a professional actor, otherwise all those VAs would be out there acting in big budget movies (or at the very least in Disney/Pixar/Dreamworks movies.)


Hehe....
Actually I don't care whether the seiyuu is a good actors or not..it doesn't matter to me. "Crap" dubs is subjective, this I agree, but I've never came accross a dub with the original qualities. As for " FEW anime where emotion is a vital part of the story", I, for one treat this as a vital part of the anime (not the story). Maybe is just me ^^".

[quote=]
Ahahaha, NO. Understanding some Japanese phrases because they appear in anime is not the same thing as learning Japanese (dame dame!) Also, learning Japanese from anime is liable to have you learn things incorrectly (especially if there are characters with a Kansai-ben or Tohoku-ben.) Also, bear in mind there is still a lot of distinction of genders in language in Japanese, and it's very easy to accidentally use a male form when you should be using female and vice versa. I'm not saying it can't be handy or fun if you're already taking advance Japanese classes, but don't learn Japanese from anime.[/quote]

Ofcause not...I said it "helps", but I do understand you can't learn Japanese by watching anime only...I agree that you will need more proper training in order to learn japanese sufficiently...
Xellos
you guys saying it's bad without consider the language barrier.
just because you watch it sub doesn't mean you understand it the
way the director intended. they didn't made it for people to read.
they made it for people who are fluent with the language. if you're
going to watch a comedy anime. would it make sense to watch it
in your language or something you have to read to understand?

sure you could say oh i know "ja ne, okage-sama de, genki de su"
but who are you trying to prove me or yourself?

not even i know the depth of your reasoning.
but, i'm sure that the you i undersyand this.
i just said what i though because it's the truth.
Boles Roor
Rolling Eyes Yeah, like that makes sense... I think you get the wrong idea, as subs are subtitled in English, not in Romanized Japanese. Laughing

And even if you ment that, why can't something that is subbed be funny? Either you're a slow reader, or you just don't get the humour.
Scaramanga
Boles Roor wrote:
Rolling Eyes Yeah, like that makes sense... I think you get the wrong idea, as subs are subtitled in English, not in Romanized Japanese. Laughing

Uhhh I think his point was towards people saying that they could learn Japanese from watching subs (because what they're saying IS translated, not because it's romaji.)

Boles Roor wrote:
And even if you ment that, why can't something that is subbed be funny? Either you're a slow reader, or you just don't get the humour.

You know, not everyone can read lightning fast, especially with fast-paced series' like Kodocha or Excel Saga. Also, I would posit that the humour in a LOT of anime is VERY cultural, so I would expect that NO, not a lot of Westerners WOULD "GET" the humour. I'd wager the majority of non-Japanese speaking people who watch Shin-chan, don't get 75% of the cultural references (or don't get why they're funny.) As just about any Japanese person will tell you, sometimes, you just have to BE Japanese to understand Japanese humour.

And for the record, subs also have the disadvantage in that I can't watch them while doing something else, because I CONSTANTLY have to be looking at the screen to read what's going on. You know, sometimes I just wanna pop Azumanga Daioh in the DVD player while I'm doing something else.
kou9992
I prefer subs, but usually I am too lazy to read so I watch the dubbed version anyways.
chrisu
I prefer subs, but here in Finland there are some dubs that are made very good. Some times they are sligthly better than the original.

I've watched some anime with only subs and it is a bit harder to follow the storyline when you have to read all the time. Its a bit easier to listen to what they are saying and watching what are happening.

But series and movies where they speak english is very educational to try to understand what they are saying and not read the subs or watch a dubbed one.
rileyvace
Subbed. By far.

Look what they've done with Naruto.
Kakashi sounds bored. Sasuke sounds 30 years old and Naruto sounds like a delinquent from a juvenile detention center!!

Midori no Hibi - Seiji sound slike a playboy.

What i hate more is when 4kids get their horrible little mitts on anime.
So far they have ruined:

One Piece
Shaman King
. Lots more but im bored of typing ¬_¬
Shin
Of course subs! dubs is pants.. agree that subs can be distracting sometimes. but nothing worse than seeing people mouth opens, nothing comes out, yet voice suddenly appears when the mouth shuts.. Very Happy
SGbilder
There is no question... subs rules! if you have ever seen and compared a movie with original language and the same one dubbed to another language it isnt the same movie anymore... even tho you understand both languages. take croutching tiger hidden dragon for example... seeing it dubbed to english was a horrible experience... i just couldnt get past the lipsynching and many of the nuances of the conversation is lost.
Machan
Neither. Learn to understand Japanese people!
reddishblue
Scaramanga wrote:
yy1124 wrote:
furthermore, japanese + sub is a great help in learning japanese if you ask me...my sis understand japanese now, by watching animation only....

Ahahaha, NO. Understanding some Japanese phrases because they appear in anime is not the same thing as learning Japanese (dame dame!) Also, learning Japanese from anime is liable to have you learn things incorrectly (especially if there are characters with a Kansai-ben or Tohoku-ben.) Also, bear in mind there is still a lot of distinction of genders in language in Japanese, and it's very easy to accidentally use a male form when you should be using female and vice versa. I'm not saying it can't be handy or fun if you're already taking advance Japanese classes, but don't learn Japanese from anime.

Yeah well I learn Japanese at school and non-dubbed anime helps me learn a japanese tone and speed when I speak it so it does help to teach you Japanese.
Asgardsfall
Hahah ... you puritans make me laugh. Why cant something be good without pain and suffering.

I watch an obscene amount of Anime and quite frankly find the text of subs boring and unimaginative. I dont speak Japanese and couldnt care less if a grunt was supposed to be joy or surprise or some other emotion.

In comedy I find far less jokes in the subs and I would far rather be feasting my eyes on the Animation than frantically watching little yellow letters.

By far the worst dub I have noticed would be Bubblegum Crisis 2040, some of the lines and song translations in there are bonejarringly shocking, but still ... it doesnt stop me liking the series.

For me immersion is the key for maximum enjoyment, not some puritanical snobbish theoretical notion that its so much better because this is how its meant to be .. despite the fact you dont understand a word.
This is much the same argument used by Audiophiles who claim they can only listen to music through certain types of speakers or certain sample rates, because the signals normally only heard by dogs, are not clear enough .... I say who cares as long as its a good song or a good story!
reddishblue
Asgardsfall wrote:
Hahah ... you puritans make me laugh. Why cant something be good without pain and suffering.

I watch an obscene amount of Anime and quite frankly find the text of subs boring and unimaginative. I dont speak Japanese and couldnt care less if a grunt was supposed to be joy or surprise or some other emotion.

In comedy I find far less jokes in the subs and I would far rather be feasting my eyes on the Animation than frantically watching little yellow letters.

By far the worst dub I have noticed would be Bubblegum Crisis 2040, some of the lines and song translations in there are bonejarringly shocking, but still ... it doesnt stop me liking the series.

For me immersion is the key for maximum enjoyment, not some puritanical snobbish theoretical notion that its so much better because this is how its meant to be .. despite the fact you dont understand a word.
This is much the same argument used by Audiophiles who claim they can only listen to music through certain types of speakers or certain sample rates, because the signals normally only heard by dogs, are not clear enough .... I say who cares as long as its a good song or a good story!

I bet you spent your entire day leaning over looking at a theosorus trying to find the best way to call us a gang of fools, may you tell me which dubbing company it is that you like because I have only seen fiends like 4Kids that replace the joy of Anime (the voices the sound the fact its truelly japanese) and turn it into a pile of americanised junk, I am willing to bet that you cannot tell the difference between the word cat 'Neko' and the word water 'Misu' so you would never know what the characters are trying to say so i guess the japanese is of no value to you.
But I like many other anime fans ador watching it the way it should be watched, with japanese speach and the bare subtitles telling us what they are saying.
This has been my two cents.

Reddish Blue
Asgardsfall
reddish blue wrote:
I bet you spent your entire day leaning over looking at a theosorus trying to find the best way to call us a gang of fools

Actually I wasn't calling anyone a fool, I was angling for "Elitist". Aliteration, adjectives and analogy (ed- oops! .. i'm doing it again) tend to flow pretty naturally when I am expressing my opinion, and not holding back.

I see you are located in Australia so you are likely to be watching the same releases as me. I have never really cared who the Dubbing Company was however to answer your question I have done a bit of research. Many of my titles appear to be done by either ADV or Animaze..Inc.

I see your argument against 4Kids is justified ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4Kids wrote:
In order to show anime properties 4Kids acquires to its targeted demographics, 4Kids typically cuts out or edits content. Reasonings vary from Federal Communications Commission regulations and Broadcast Standards and Practices (BS&P) policies of television networks to "localizing" content for local consumption.[4] [5] These edits often result in backlash within the anime fanbase

From this I think the backlash in this thread against Dubs is misdirected. I absolutely agree the actual anime itself should not be re-edited to change the story, and that those responsible for this travasty should lined up against the wall and shot. The most glaring example of the damage that can be done by reediting would be be Battle of the Planets and its original form Gatchaman. But fortunately Dubs have come a long long way since the likes of BoTP and Robotech.

reddish blue wrote:
the japanese is of no value to you

You are right ... I dont speak Japanese so the Japanese is of no value to me ... this however is my whole point. Of all the subs I have read (and yes I do read them occasionally, I have always found, if something reads "Cat" it is said "Cat" in the Dub, or more likely says "the cute Cat" or something adds a little more without changing context.
As always I am open to being corrected ... if you could point me toward some particularly bad examples of recent productions (ie last 8 years or so) I will make a point of examining them in more depth to see if I soften my opinion.
reddishblue
I am aware that my responce is not neccesary and as I usaully only watch subs I do not know very much about dubs but a good example is Pokemon, edited so much that watching it as an 8 year old I did not even know it was Japanese, no Kanjii anywhere, no mentions of Japanese culture at all, really no one knew back then, or at least the people I spoke to, I have also seen Digimon which was completly void of all of which I mentioned above.
I think Anime should be seen as being Japanese anyway, not edited to be as American as Futurama of Bugs Bunny.

Reddish Blue
roninmedia
I have to go with subs.

Yes, there are very high quality dubs, but more often than not, the dubs aren't that great.

I would rather go with the circumstance that gives me a higher chance of quality.
Asgardsfall
Can you please point out a Dub where the Subs are significantly better, for an Anime which is NOT aimed at Kids under 10 ... ie Pokemon, Digimon, YuGiOh, Sailor Moon.... I hate these Dubbed or Subbed.

I am always open minded and am quite prepared to sit and watch a quality series a couple of times for comparison purposes.
1) Japanese sountrack, English Subs then
2) English Subs English Soundtrack.

How about some examples of bad Dubs from some quality post 2000 series that has been fully released? Something I either have, or can get my hands on. Something to illustrate the point that the Typed English Translation is far superior and truer to the original Anime than the Spoken English Translation.
reddishblue
Hmmm I haven't watched dubbed Anime in a year, Im looking back at all the oldies Laughing however I dont think that Naruto was well dubbed, very screwed up, please dont ask me to provide an example, it was a long time ago and I dont have it anymore.
Studio Madcrow
Generally I prefer subtitles to re-dubbing. Part of that comes from the fact that I'm mainly a watcher of live action films and I can't stand them at all when dubbed. The other part of the equation is that the quality of voice acting in Japan is FAR superior to the state of the profession in the US. Even if nothing is cut from the original version, the English version simply will never sound as good as the Japanese version because nobody in the US dubbing industry SOUNDS as good as their Japanese counterparts do.
Tatsumaru
Subs. Like the first poster stated: if I first see an anime with dubs, before seeing it with subs, I can handle it... but not the other way around.

But in general I'd just like to watch subs, it feels better to watch.
Scaramanga
Studio Madcrow wrote:
Even if nothing is cut from the original version, the English version simply will never sound as good as the Japanese version because nobody in the US dubbing industry SOUNDS as good as their Japanese counterparts do.

Bolded for contention. Yeah, those are pretty broad, sweeping statements there, that I doubt you can even back up. I've heard plenty of dubs that were FAR superior to the original Japanese. And saying that the English version will NEVER sound as good because NOBODY in the US can sound as good as a Japanese VA is at best, just plain ridiculous, and profoundly spurious at worst.
Studio Madcrow
Scaramanga wrote:
Studio Madcrow wrote:
Even if nothing is cut from the original version, the English version simply will never sound as good as the Japanese version because nobody in the US dubbing industry SOUNDS as good as their Japanese counterparts do.

Bolded for contention. Yeah, those are pretty broad, sweeping statements there, that I doubt you can even back up. I've heard plenty of dubs that were FAR superior to the original Japanese. And saying that the English version will NEVER sound as good because NOBODY in the US can sound as good as a Japanese VA is at best, just plain ridiculous, and profoundly spurious at worst.


Such as? I've simply never heard English dub voices that are as good as the Japanese voices. Sometimes (and only in the case of big-budget feature re-dubs from Disney's Ghibli releases) the English versions are actually almost as good-sounding as the original, but in many cases that butcher the script/add dialog and do other problematic things.
ddukki
I'd rather have subs. Not only does it sound better, being in its native tongue, but you also learn a bit of their language. I have a habit of saying "NANDESUKA?!" every time someone asks me to do something.
Scaramanga
Studio Madcrow wrote:
Scaramanga wrote:
Studio Madcrow wrote:
Even if nothing is cut from the original version, the English version simply will never sound as good as the Japanese version because nobody in the US dubbing industry SOUNDS as good as their Japanese counterparts do.

Bolded for contention. Yeah, those are pretty broad, sweeping statements there, that I doubt you can even back up. I've heard plenty of dubs that were FAR superior to the original Japanese. And saying that the English version will NEVER sound as good because NOBODY in the US can sound as good as a Japanese VA is at best, just plain ridiculous, and profoundly spurious at worst.

Such as? I've simply never heard English dub voices that are as good as the Japanese voices. Sometimes (and only in the case of big-budget feature re-dubs from Disney's Ghibli releases) the English versions are actually almost as good-sounding as the original, but in many cases that butcher the script/add dialog and do other problematic things.

El-Hazard, You're Under Arrest (OVA), Gasaraki and Cowboy Bebop are generally considered to be superior to the original Japanese Seiyuu in most respects, by the majority of fans (I'm not talking about just your 3 friends here, that like anime.) In fact, You're Under Arrest was SO well liked by the Japanese director, that he had his entire cast watch the American dub before they started recording the TV series.

Also, a lot of what your talking about is highly subjective. But to put words like 'NEVER' and 'NOBODY' in your argument is pretty fallacious. Especially since I'm pretty sure you haven't seen every lick of anime ever dubbed (or anime in the future.) My point was you shouldn't be making blanket statements like that, because they certainly don't further your argument.
DailyFall
Well, if you ask me, i prefer subs, because most of the time the english dubs arent as great as the original


but if you ask me: do you prefer japanese voices or spanish(mexican) dubs?

i would answer Mexican without a doubt, the Mexican dub industry is one of the best around here, sometimes the dub work in here is waay better than the original(i.e.: the simpsons mexican dubs are better than the original voices) in part because the mexican dubbers put a lot of effort and only change what is needed in the series(unlike the english dubs, that changed Mr. Satan to Hercule in DBZ, in Mexico they let the name Mr Satan and no one complained even when there is a lot of religious people here)


but also, the mexican subs suck, so

english dubs or english subs? english subs
spanish dubs or spanish dubs? spanish dubs
m-productions
subed for the wiN! it seems so fake when its dubed, and plus if you get somthing dubed to english somtimes your stuck with quotes like
"BELIEVE IT" dear god, that stuff just ant right.
joxer
Hi, the Czech Republic needs YOU!!
The Pokemon Series suddenly stopped when the 4th Season had finished.
We're looking for the English subtitles of 5th, 6th, 7th, and so on...
Please send it to joxicek(at)post.cz
Thanks!!!!
telescream
subs, definatly.
dubs tend to come with a super-weird voice.
like fruit's basket?! when i first heard that i thought that it was a fandub!
>.<
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