What or Who Created God? Any ideas?

This thread is to be purly read from the perspective that God DOSE exist in the way Christians belive. etc etc

so Who of What created God......

even out of the context of "time" there still has to be a start even if theyrs not end....

is there a Being higher than God....., or what......

What are some other ideas out there...... remember this is based on the fact that God DOSE exist as God in the way Christians belive. etc etc Razz

I know there is no exact way for us to know...., but ideas are always good

Many Christens ague that God exists out side of time but that argument dose not hold water.
For anything to happen, time is required, for me to pus a key, time is requires. For God to make something, time is required for with out time in some form, nothing can happen.
One could argue that God exists out side of linear time, but he would still have to exist in some form of time.

So your saying God is the universe?

Who created God? Man.

Sort of like if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around does it make a sound? If man didn't exist, would there be God?

Let's say that God DOES exist. Hm... Maybe a union of force in the Universe?

It has been "implied" that our universe was created out of the "Big Bang" theory....could not some cataclysmic event create a god? At the very least it's something to think about....great topic.

PS...for all you "old-timers", yes I am back Smile

In my religion, God just come up, it's the source of everything, like the core, nothing makes it, but it makes everything Very Happy

No need to be proofen, because good is somthing that we can't imagine.

@livilou

If one has faith, then that concept is not difficult to fathom at all...as Soulfire so eloquently pointed out, God IS the alpha and the omega.

What I have trouble conceptualizing is the concept of infinity.

God created time so he was here before time

I like to think of God as he has allways existed, as a consience of pure energy , no beginning no end, rather than think there was once nothing ,because I get to the point where I realise nothing is just the absence of something...there must have been an energy of some form for there to be energy now , I think contemplating a point of nothinginess is beyond the human (well this ones anyway) mind

Measurement of time may not exist if there is no one to experience it but I gurantee you long before human life passage of time still occured, stars still went Nova.. etc Razz

We created a way to measure time we did not create time and we are not critical to times existence.

Rhysige........... I agree , but we are going off topic here! , how do you relate time to the creation of God ?

Its not really about time and the creation of God, its about God and time, If God created time, than God could not have created time cause you need times for things to happen.
Some say God exists out side of time but God has to exist in some form of time or God can't do anything.

I believe that god has always existed, but as mentioned above , many peoplehave trouble understanding the concept of infinity. It is quite baffling because you can say god has been here forever, but there is still what was before forever that caused god to exist.

Time did not pre-exist the creation of the universe, because time is an emergent property of the universe. You might have trouble imagining those things, but as a Christian or not, you should not imagine that time is some type of fixed always there background. It's not.

I believe general relativity and don't believe in time without matter and space. Do you think that matter and space had to pre-exist the universe as well? I think you are falling into the common trap of saying that the way you are familiar with is the only way that things can be.

The humans created God, they needed and need something to explain things they can't explain. That's why God is. Or God is an immense power.
We can only guess.

Check my signature: All men by nature desire knowledge.
It's just that humans always will look for knowledge. That's our nature.

THE GOD´s Father!!!

So its Marlom Brando in 1973!!!

This is probably starting the chicken and egg theory, you can practically do this forever.

Hmmm... I'm thinking we're getting the whole matter wrong. God is not a source of creation, God is creation in itself, it had always been since creation was not. First understand there is no time or space factor for God. God is simply all there is. Neither created nor destroyed...

God wasn't created, He just is. God can never be destroyed.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth…I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. (Gen. 1:1, Rev. 22:13).

Into the darkness, God spoke light. Generations have lived and died, nations have risen and fallen, yet our all-powerful, all-knowing God endures. Time and time again, man has tried to ignore the presence of God, have deviated from the truth of God's word, and have tried to destroy God's word.

He is still there, and nothing can erase Him.

For whatever reason, we think that we can deny the existence of God. Back in the Old Testament, it was the pagan worshippers. At the beginning of the Roman Empire, Christians were executed for their belief in God and Christ. Those emporers that murdered Christians have long died, but the Lord's church continued to grow.

And what about today? The assault on Christianity (and religion in general) is relentless. With so called ethical issues, atheists, evolutionists, and the like.

But, you can't deny God - this beginning and end.

Every year, the Bible is the top selling book. A couple years ago, it was also recorded as the most translated book. But of course, the media doesn't want you to know. New York Time's best-seller The Davinci Code is what Dan Brown wrote - but the media fails to tell us it's one of the biggest mockeries of God's word. No, they wouldn't tell you that - then Mr. Brown wouldn't make his money.

Know this: One day, Mr. Brown's book will be taken off of bookshelves to make room for newer bestselling books. God's word remains.

All else will fail, but the word of the Lord endureth forever.

Sorry, this was part-rant part-answer. Needed to let out some steam a bit I suppose.

Our imagination.

The way I look at it is that God created time. So really, there was no "before" or "after" until God made it so, which is why God Himself is the beginning (of time, of everything) and the end (of time, and everything).

It makes sense to me, but it's a very fluid concept to grasp.

But if God existed before time, than how could he have created time? With out time in some form, nothing can happen.

Conspirator, that doesn't make sense I don't think. Time is a property of the universe, intimately bound with matter and energy. Whether you think God exists or not, you have to agree that the universe does exist. So if you believe the big bang, space and time can (and did) come into existence.

One question you might like to consider is what does time even mean outside the universe? I would define time as what clocks measure. It seems to me that time outside the universe is pretty much a meaningless concept.

Of course, there are many other models of the universe you can consider: In particular you could argue for one of a variety of models where entropy is recycled and there's no beginning or end...

Personally I am a Christian and have no problem with the big bang model, which fits particularly well with both my religion, and experimental evidence (such as the microwave background and increasing entropy).

who created GOD? there are a lot of answer...
Ancient Wiseman..... maybe

who created this Universe?
if you don't like the answer is "GOD".
then I can tell you, we(mankind) haven't find out and it look like this will take long long time to find the truth. in short time just like we haven't find the cure for AIDS/Ebola. but human always doing research and still in progress,

if you really need the answer right now, "GOD" is the wise answer to let the questioner to stop thinking of this. but if you're still don't like this answer without prove, I afraid you have to make the research yourself just to help us (mankind) reveal the truth.

http://en.fgulen.com/content/view/584/5/

this small article explains the questions very well

i think same writer " mr. gulen " has a video lecture wbout this question.

I think we will never know who created God, it's simple impossible to know. You simply fall into loop when you want to explain that, except philosophers. Smile

"God is dead."
-Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is dead."
-God

god is a creation of humans. When we think back to the early time of history, we find a different "life style" or social philosophy:
The social group, the civilisation was the Alpha in every bodies life. It was normally and accepted to ask first, what you can do for your civilisation/social group than for yourself.
Every human was a little part of a great machinery. It was hard to build up self-consciousness. So it wasn't a wonder, that the simple man or woman needed some explanation for all the things noone could explane and why _they_ have to work, while others let them work.
In a simple society, what would you tell those people, why you doesn't have to work, while they do?
"It is so. It ever was so. It will be so forever." Sounds like our definition of "god", right? And it was the simplest solution. So all in all it was natural that we needed some "greater power" to explain all things, 'cause human beings always want to explain everything! It makes me frightened when I think of that freaky part of human minds.

-Elidorian, doesn't like the imagination of god, to control believers and to put all responsibillity away, but they still say, they believe in "morals"... *shaking in disgust*

Most theologians take on the Aristotelian/Thomistic approach and state that God - as the Creator - was not created and has always existed. The argument basically states that since all things in our apparent world are created based on previous actions and causes, there must be one thing at the "beginning" of time which was the ultimate cause for everything that followed.

Asking "What created God?" with the presumption that there is an external divine figure in the way that Christians believe (as stated in the original post) is, in my opinion, a misunderstanding of what the word "God" entails. I don't mean to claim that we must make that presumption, of course, but if we are to do so as the question instructs, the question is vacuous.

A lot of people in this thread seem to be taking the Nietzschean point of view and stating that humans created God. That's all well and good, but it's not really an answer to the original question. The question was asked with the assumption of God in the Christian sense, and Nietzsche's conception of what constitutes a god is very different from the Christian notion. I don't take issue with Nietzsche's claims, I'm just pointing out that they're quite irrelevant to answering the question as it was asked.

I think that one problem that usually comes up in this kind of discussion is apparent in the opening post. People are simply misinformed when it comes to mathematics. Many people have heard something about the impossibility of an infinite regression, and say that this means that everything (including time or God) must have begun to exist at some point. However, time is simply a concept ordering events. If events could not have been occurring for an infinite amount of time already (mathematically impossible), then there did indeed need to be a first event (since events are currently occurring). However, people try to visualize this as something like a point in the middle of a sheet of paper that is the beginning with all events going out to the right. But why is the point in the middle? What is all that to the left? People end up thinking that before that first event there was nothingness. Unfortunately, this ignores the fact that there was no "before that". The concept of a time before the first event is nonsense. That was the beginning, but that does not mean that things began to exist at that point. It is only the beginning under the meaning that there were no events before that, not that that event began (this would be another event, earlier than the first event- which is impossible, of course). It ends up that if there is a first event which did not begin to occur (because that would imply previous events and a time before that event), then that event simply was. The fact is that the universe simply could have been in existence yesterday with no precedent exactly the way it was yesterday (with out memories intact, for instance) and moved on from there. Nothing caused it to be that way; it simply was. If this sounds absurd, try counting to infinity, then tell me that that option is more reasonable. Honestly, the mere existence of anything is absurd, but that is what we are dealing with. Sorry for that tangent. Anyway, this could be applied to God very easily. If God created everything but himself, then he simply was at one point (with no "before that") and acted from that point on. The universe does not need a creator. If God was the universe (the only thing in existence before he created everything else), then he did not need a creator; he simply was.

As a side note, this necessitates that God does not add anything to help explain the existence of the world. It is just as absurd (maybe more so) that a metaphysical, omniscient, omnipotent being would simply be as that the universe in general would simply be.

Sorry if this was confusing.

Thank you for pointing that out, Victoly.

Randy, I agreed with you up to this point:

God is either:

You cannot, cannot , CANNOT, argue or proove God's existence. You can argue with the sciences, history etc, but spirituality is pure belief. And psychologists tell you your beliefs are malleable, depending on your traditions, background, experience etc. And you can add God to your life by attributing those traditions, experiences etc to an act of God.

It doesn't sound absurd - it is absurd. It's not a question of believing one absurd thing or the other. I can give you a much less absurd explanation than assuming absurd things: God exists. Why do you not like this third explanation? It seems to me that this solves your problem.[/quote]

I already addressed that. You did not make an argument at all. All you did was infuse meaningless rhetoric into my ideas. God's existence is irrelevant to the question. God's existence was in fact one of the absurd situations. You miss the point completely. Existence is weird, but existence is, so that is where we start. God does not add anything to help explain existence, because if things can not simply be, then God could not have simply been. The reality is that things can simply be with no precedent (they can not come into existence with no precedent, though), and this is in fact mathematically necessary for existence. It could have been God or something else that originally was, but this entire thread assumes God's existence, so I was specifically arguing for how God could have existed with no precedent. Your post addresses nothing I said or even anything relevant to the topic of this thread. It is completely meaningless.

I personally think God was a creation of the human mind in order for us to believe that there is something greater out there. An image of a higher power is good for human life, it allows us to have something to look forward to and up to, and give us a reason to be better people. I believe that without a God, we would all have nothing to look to after death. So God is a construct of human imagination, and the bible was written by a man who had too much time on his hands.

The bible was written by "saints" of the same generation of Jesus, personal witnesses to the events. It wasn't just a random story, but they were convinced and believed they were right. I think they were misled like gullible innocent children into christian discipline because it had a convincing element of truth in it.

So back to the topic...

The assumption that God exists outside of time does hold water. Just think about God made time, therefore he exists out of it. To him everything happens all at once. You can see this trend, especially in the way the bible is written and the way Jesus acts. Even in the very beginning of the bible, God reffers to himself as US or WE. Suggesting, the father, the son (Jesus), and the holy ghost. So Jesus is there in the beginning, yet he still comes down to earth later.

You probably won't agree with what I say, but this is just another one of those posts where people really don't want a responce. They just want to prove some point and pretend it's like a question.

No one has created God
but He has created everything.

He is unique and is the most
powerful.

The following is from Surah Ikhlas of the holy Quran :

"Say: He is Allah, the One and Only!
Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
He begetteth not nor is He begotten.
And there is none like unto Him."

The above quote describes the God.
In the third line of the above quote
the holy Quran said explicitly that God
God is not created by anyone nor will
he give birth to anyone (ie, God's son).

For someone to say that "God had to have been created" has entirely missed the point that God is God!

It would be correct to say that time has to have a begining in order to exist. For example, if we were to create a time line and mark the point that the universe was created, and then draw the line back in time, for infinity, it would mean that from the from "begining of time" (Which in this case doesn't actually exist) to the start of the universe (or even the day you were born) would be infinitely long! This means that you would never actually be born!

Time itself had to have been created. For this to happen, there has to be something that exists outside of time. Something that our human minds, can't even begin to comprehend. This thing is God who is eternity itself. God exists outside of time and is far greater that we can even begin to imagine.

Nothing created God! God just IS. We can't view God and restrict him in our minds to the limits of time. Unfortunately, time is all we know, and thus we will never even begin to understand any of this. Just know that its very real.

And you know what the cool thing is! This awesome God wants to have a relationship with YOU!

Interesting thread here.

Who am I to be deciding God's origin. Either people believe in God or people do not believe. For those who do not believe in God's existence, why do you even talk about it (this non-existence)? You would be better off talking about air, then about some nothing that mayhave never existed. But if you do believe in God, then the God topic is a valid topic. At least believing in God and accepting that God exists can leads to a more diffenate conclusion (belief or answers [whether correct or not] but satisfying to an indiviual) about the origin of man and the earth instead of running sciencific tests based upon a speculative theory. (i'm not going any deeper into the science of things here.) A belief in God does certainly open up ones mind to more possiblities for "answers" to explore.

You guys are discussing a very fragile and sensitive subject here.. I, personally do not believe in god. No, im not satainst, because i dont worship the devil either. And no, im not atheist. Its hard to explain..

I have stumbled across a good text long ago, and i will share it with you now.
Please note that im not attacking ANY religion with this text. If you feel offended, its ok, keep it for yourself, because NO OFFENSE IS INTENDED.

God created create.

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