I pay my homage to the last Hindu nation on the earth. It was declared secular (means what?) by a Hindu. Girijaprasad Koirala.
Good they took a step ahead towards getting more liberal and democratic (?)nation. A democracy that is expected to give them peace and prosperity.
Why bother about religion when u are gonna peace and prosperity. See India they became secular and got both(?). If temples are destroyed who cares? Islamic terrorists are just freedom fighter and will understand if we talk properly to them.
Now the Christian missionaries will enter Nepal in the disguise of charitable trusts and humanatorian and will slowly poison the society with their anti hindi agenda. Let us watch thge fun
i hate people who say in my count only hindu people or muslim or christan people saty one only there live what wrong if other religion people live there life nothing goona bother us
| mustaq wrote: |
| i hate people who say in my count only hindu people or muslim or christan people saty one only there live what wrong if other religion people live there life nothing goona bother us |
Come again? Did anyone understand this post?
Well, secularity is important in government (and this is coming from a religious person). You must, in times, slightly suppress religion to keep uniform peace within a nation. Notice how the middle eastern governments are Islamic governments, and notice where all the trouble, turmoil, and chaos is - in the middle east.well who is behind the trouble ?? can you answer for this
WEll... itz good they made it secular ... now it is like india. See! I frankly speaking do not believe in god ! so there is no point in classifying people into religions cauzing unnecissary conflicts 
Good Step! | akshar wrote: |
Now the Christian missionaries will enter Nepal in the disguise of charitable trusts and humanatorian and will slowly poison the society with their anti hindi agenda. Let us watch thge fun |
I like the way you put it! Sadly that is the sorry state of affairs and we can't do anything .....
Last edited by mayur on Mon Jun 26, 2006 6:12 pm; edited 1 time in totalChristian missionaries will probably move in, but not to spread anti-Hindu propaganda, but to spread the word of the Lord.
| Soulfire wrote: |
| Christian missionaries will probably move in, but not to spread anti-Hindu propaganda, but to spread the word of the Lord. |
let's not get into a religious debate here, but we all sure know wat goes on!
I've been to conversions and have heard wat they say...Ya it really does not matter if it one country is a secular state or not. As long as there is peace security for the people. Religion is important but if it can lead to peace and better life for the people then its ok to be a secular state.
| Soulfire wrote: |
Well, secularity is important in government (and this is coming from a religious person). You must, in times, slightly suppress religion to keep uniform peace within a nation. Notice how the middle eastern governments are Islamic governments, and notice where all the trouble, turmoil, and chaos is - in the middle east. |
I live in the Middleeast and although not all problems there are because of religious governments, I do agree with you that we could have been living in a much better state if religion was separated from the government. Secularity is very important and can even protect the religion itself.Religious countries like in the middle east are highly discriminating they dont give much respect to the ppl of their religion forget others. Where women are forced to wear Burkha against their wil etc. etc.
Nepal though hindu nation was not so discriminatiing. Though nepal is majority a hindu we should remember that it is a country suffering from poverty and lack of other basic neccesities like medicine education etc.
Hindus are minority in world rich countries from middle east now pour in lotz of money to start conversions thus Nepal failing to protect the interest of the majority in their country.
Christian Missionaries who will start schools and hospitals and finally try to break the nation into parts the way day do it in India especially NOrth Easten States.
| akshar wrote: |
See India they became secular and got both(?). If temples are destroyed who cares? Islamic terrorists are just freedom fighter and will understand if we talk properly to them.
|
Its really fasinating when you talk of destroying temples and fail to mention the Babri Mosque. Rings a bell?
| akshar wrote: |
Christian Missionaries who will start schools and hospitals and finally try to break the nation into parts the way day do it in India especially NOrth Easten States. |
You better not talk of the North East if you don't live here. Its a much, much better place than the rest of the nation and all that you see on the news, f-it. Ain't all true.It's fascinating and not a little hilarious that most of such people as Akshar talk of women in Arab countries being 'forced' to wear the burukha. It's a very successful disinformation campaign by the western media. Who actually says they are forced? Do the Saudi women say it? No, CNN and BBC say it. If these women want to be more covered up than the ****** in the US, it doesn't mean they are oppressed. They don't have to be half naked all the time to be liberal women. They don't have to dress like Americans.
Did any of you stop to notice the rallies and protests in France recently by Muslim women against the French order that no women can wear a head covering? Of course not. It's not what you want to see. And it was shown what; a few short clips on the news? When the videos of the 'oppressed' women 'forced' to wear burukha is shown daily.
Would women 'forced' to wear it rally demanding for their right to wear it? Please... use your own brain and think for yourself for a change instead of just repeating the chantings of nations that are hell bent on involving themsleves in countries that do not concern them, all for their own selfish needs.
And you all think secularism is going to bring peace and prosperity to Nepal? I have been in Nepal. There is no religious tension there. Their problems are not related to religion. Their problems are political. The Maoists are after making their own Communist state. As far as I know, Communism isn't a religion.
The King took over the affairs of state saying that the Parliment had proved incapable of stopping this Maoist movement. Till then the Parliment had been doing all they can to catch and destroy the Maoists. So the King came and dismantled the inefficient useless Parliment and took power. So what did the Parliment members do? They went and joined hands with the Maoists to jointly bring the King down.
Is this the action of people who want good for their Nation or people who just wanted to be in Power through hook or crook?
jipmerite - who are you trying to kid around?
if I have this right, you're trying to say that if women didn't like the burkha - they'd say something against it.....RIGHT?
WRONG.
Why? Because in order to protest, a citizen must have the fundamental right of FREEDOM OF SPEECH - which unfortunately, is only a concept in this Wahabbi State.
Infact under Saudi Arabian Law ( I stress that this is law - not my own interpretation of the Law - but the actual postulates ):
| Quote: |
| A woman's testimony does not carry the same weight as that of a man. In a Shari'a court, the testimony of one man equals that of two women |
| Quote: |
| Female parties to court proceedings such as divorce and family law cases generally must deputize male relatives to speak on their behalf. In the absence of two witnesses, or four witnesses in the case of adultery, confessions before a judge almost always were required for criminal conviction--a situation that has led prosecuting authorities to coerce confessions from suspects by threats and abuse |
| Quote: |
| Hindus are considered polytheists by Islamic law, which is used as a justification for greater discrimination in calculating accidental death or injury compensation. According to the country's "Hanbali" interpretation of Sharia (Islamic law), once fault is determined by a court, a Muslim male receives 100 percent of the amount of compensation determined, a male Jew or Christian received 50 percent, and all others (including Hindus) received 1/16 of the amount a male Muslim receives. Women receive 50 percent of what males receive in each of these categories. |
This particular piece above pisses me off tremendously.You know why? Because I see people like you on these forums all the time stating how Islam doesn't justify the killing of non-muslims, just because they're not muslim.And yet you speak nothing of the intolerance, the discrimination, the humiliation - that Islam subjects non-muslims to.
Sure you may not go on all out and start killing non-muslims all at once - but you do something far worse - you subject non-muslims cruelty and injustice - and that is far worse - it is easier to fight a war and die on the field than to spend your entire life in the shadows for who you are - to be beaten down by people who claim themselves to be "holier than thou", it is easier to die fast and painlessly than slow and painfully - and thats what this is to non-muslims and to women - a slow everyday torture.
Don't talk about justice to me - you make me sick.
Don't talk about injustice - you make me laugh.
| Quote: |
| women are prohibited from marrying non-Muslims; men may marry Christians and Jews, as well as Muslims. Marriages between Sunni and Shi'a citizens were discouraged, and any such marriages generally were made formal through ceremonies in Bahrain. |
| Quote: |
| Citizen men have the freedom to travel within the country and abroad; however, the Government restricted these rights for women based on its interpretation of Islamic Law. All women in the country were prohibited from driving and were dependent upon males for any transportation. Likewise, they must obtain written permission from a male relative or guardian before the authorities allowed them to travel abroad (see Section 5). |
Do you need more confirmation on discrimination against women?
You know, here's something funny.How come you complain against discrimination and the lack of Freedom Of Religious Practice across America, Europe, India and Russia and yet turn a blind Eye to when it comes to Muslim nations? How come you are all allowed to be the MOST INTOLERANT NATIONS ON THE FACE OF THE PLANET and yet you WHINE about religious freedon when it comes to other places?
What you really want is Religious Freedom as long as it only ONE WAY right? As long as it favors Islam....
| Quote: |
"Freedom of religion does not exist," the U.S. State Department's 1997 Human Rights Report on Saudi Arabia states. "Islam is the official religion, and all citizens must be Muslims. The government prohibits the public practice of other religions." "It is absurd to impose on an individual or a society rights that are alien to its beliefs or principles," Crown Prince Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz declared at the U.N. Third Millennium summit in New York City, New York on 6 September. |
Yes, thats right People, ALL PEOPLE MUST BE MUSLIM. If tomorrow, the United States declared that all citizens must be Christian, or India declared all Hindu - you'd be up on your feet,gesticulating wildly, protesting.
Hypocrites.
Thats the word.
Hypocrites.
| Quote: |
| Until March 1, 2004, the official Saudi Arabian government website stated that Jews were forbidden from entering the country. |
So much for tolerance.
For more information on Women's and Human Rights Abuse in One Of The most intolerant nations on Earth please visit the Human Rights Watch At:
http://hrw.org/backgrounder/mena/saudi/
CLEAN UP YOUR OWN BACKYARD BEFORE YOU STEP IN MINE.
Other Hypocrites Include: Malaysia [truly asia) , Indonesia. Oh, and you were stupid enough to mention that you had been to Nepal.
A lot of us have - as tourists.
When you made a stupid remark like that - that Nepal is a nation free from religious turmoil you proved your lack of considerable knowledge of this region.
I suggest you look up Maoists, the Chinese influence in Nepal, and the Islamic propoganda and assistance received by the Nepal Military from Pakistan.
Google it or something.
P.S.I've been to Nepal as well.Apparently longer than you.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The Religious (In)Tolerance Of Malaysia (Yes, indeed THAT country that everyone loves to go on vacation to )
Forgive the Cut And Paste routine, but I couldn't find a word of this that wasn't important:
| Quote: |
Conversion from Islam
Muslims who wish to convert from Islam face severe obstacles. For Muslims, particularly ethnic Malays, the right to leave the Islamic faith and adhere to another religion is a controversial question, and in practice it is very difficult for Muslims to change religions. The legal process of conversion is unclear; in practice it is very difficult for Muslims to change their religion legally.
In 1999 the High Court ruled that secular courts have no jurisdiction to hear applications by Muslims to change religions. According to the ruling, the religious conversion of Muslims lies solely within the jurisdiction of Islamic courts.
The issue of Muslim apostasy is very sensitive. In 1998 after a controversial incident of attempted conversion, the Government stated that apostates (i.e., Muslims who wish to leave or have left Islam for another religion) would not face government punishment so long as they did not defame Islam after their conversion. However, whether the very act of conversion was an "insult to Islam" was not clarified at the time. The Government opposes what it considers deviant interpretations of Islam, maintaining that the "deviant" groups’ extreme views endanger national security. In 2005 international media attention focused on the Sky Kingdom sect whose founder Ayah Pin claimed to be God, and whose members - mostly Malays - were accordingly charged with religious "deviancy" and "humiliating Islam."
In the past, the Government imposed restrictions on certain Islamic groups, primarily the small number of Shi'a. The Government continues to monitor the activities of the Shi'a minority.
In April 2000, the state of Perlis passed a Shari’a law subjecting Islamic "deviants" and apostates to 1 year of "rehabilitation" (under the Constitution, religion, including Shari’a law, is a state matter). Leaders of the opposition Islamic party, PAS, have stated that the penalty for apostasy should be death.
[edit]
Loss of right to marry
Azlina Jailani was a Muslim who converted to Christianity adopting the name Lina Joy. She was denied the right to register her marriage with the Registrar of Marriages. She is currently going through the secular courts to seek a declaration that she is free to practise the faith of her choice, and have the word 'Islam' dropped from her identity card. Her legal case is based on the freedom of religion clause in the constitution.
[edit]
Torture by police
Joshua Jamaluddin was incarcerated under the Internal Security Act for converting to Christianity. He later detailed his torture during his incarceration. Now he is an activist for allowing greater religious freedom in Malaysia.
[edit]
Illegal imprisonment by family members
Aishah was captured and imprisoned by her own family members for wanting to convert before marrying her boyfriend(This fact is still doubted and maybe wrong). Eventually she escaped and has since left the country.
[edit]
Loss of right to work
Hilmi Mohd. Noor in his book "Circumcised Heart" describes his experiences during his detention resulting from religious persecution by the Malaysian authorities. Concurrently, there was lobbying by some Muslims in his company to get his job terminated.
[edit]
Christian proselytization
Proselytizing of Muslims by members of other religions is not technically prohibited by federal law. It is however prohibited in most states and can lead to lengthy jail sentences and many strokes of the rotan (whipping). Most Christian and a few other religious groups in Malaysia put a standard disclaimer on literature and advertisements stating "For non-Muslims only".
In 2002 the government banned the Bible in Malay (Al Kitab) and in Iban (bap Kudus). The Kudus uses the term "Allah Taala" for God. The ban has since been rescinded. The then Home Minister Abdullah Badawi claimed it was the work of an overzealous bureaucrat and he had then repealed the ban personally.
Some states have laws that prohibit the use of Malay-language religious terms such as usage of the term "Allah" for God by Christians, but the authorities do not enforce them actively.
Distribution of other materials such as books or tapes translated into Bahasa Melayu (local Malay) or Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian Malay) are also discouraged. However, Malay-language Christian materials are available. Prior to the banning of the Bup Kudus in 2002, the distribution of Malay-language Christian materials faced few restrictions in East Malaysia.
In recent years, visas for foreign clergy no longer are restricted, and most visas were approved during the period covered by this report. Beginning in March 2000, representative non-Muslims were invited to sit on the immigration committee that approves such visa requests.
[edit]
Places of worship
The government generally respects non-Muslims' right of worship; however, state governments carefully control the building of non-Muslim places of worship and the allocation of land for non-Muslim cemeteries. Approvals for such permits sometimes are granted very slowly. After a violent conflict in Penang between Hindus and Muslims in March 1998, the government announced a nationwide review of unlicensed Hindu temples and shrines. However, implementation was not vigorous and the program was not a subject of public debate. Recently, in April 2006, local authorities have demolished several Hindu temples, to make way for developmental projects. Their excuse was that these temples were unlicensed and squatting on government land. One of these temples was 107 years old. In one instance, the authorities destroyed the idols and buried them on site.
The new pre-planned capital of Malaysia, Putrajaya, features a grand mosque as a prominent feature of the planned community. No land has been gazetted for places of worship for any other faith.
The Catholic Society of Shah Alam - Shah Alam is the capital city of Selangor state - had been lobbying the state government for a permit to build a church in that city for 10 years. It was not until recently that permit was finally granted. The church opened its doors on 10 September 2005.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Status_of_religious_freedom_in_Malaysia |
You talk of Babri Masjid, what about this - how come this is never on CNN, how come no one speaks up about this :
| Quote: |
Recently, in April 2006, local authorities have demolished several Hindu temples, to make way for developmental projects. Their excuse was that these temples were unlicensed and squatting on government land. One of these temples was 107 years old. In one instance, the authorities destroyed the idols and buried them on site.
|
Anyone seen the Malaysian Tourism Ad with the Jingle - " Malaaaaysiaaaa Truly Asiaaaa".
Maybe the next time I go there, they can have a live temple demolition - I always loved those building demolitions they show on TV. Also:
| jipmerite wrote: |
| If these women want to be more covered up than the ***** in the US, it doesn't mean they are oppressed. They don't have to be half naked all the time to be liberal women. They don't have to dress like Americans. |
You claim that Saudi Arabia is a safe haven for women because of the burkha.nothing could be further from the truth.
The truth is that behind closed doors, Saudia Arbia is a hot bed of Prostitution, and even more worse - because women and men are forced to suppress their sexuality and sexual needs - incest - or sex withan immediate family member is common.A fact also seen in Iran
| Quote: |
| In mid-1997 hundreds of Indonesian women, most under twenty years old, were in prostitution in Saudi Arabia. (Mien Sugandhi, Minister for Women’s Affairs in Indonesia reports, "Hundreds of RI’s Women Believed To Work As Prostitutes in Saudi Arabia," Kompas, 7 February 1997) |
And here's a new form of Halaal Prostitution:
http://egyptianperson.blogspot.com/2005/06/halaal-prostitution-in-saudi-arabia.html
So jipmerite, the next time you call an entire nation's women ****** who don't wear enough, take a look at your own backyard - its more perverted and sick then you can imagine. 
Wow, how many points did you get for all those posts? saudi is a shit country , please who dont know about it dont speak ,
woman have no rights there and even non-muslims are treated badly ,
human rights abuse is very common there ,
i feel bad for nepal though , cuz it was the only hindu country in the world ,
they never treated other religions badly ,they are very open , i dont know what the nepal PM thought of when he knows more then 90% of the people in the country are hindus ,
| jipmerite wrote: |
Did any of you stop to notice the rallies and protests in France recently by Muslim women against the French order that no women can wear a head covering? Of course not. It's not what you want to see. And it was shown what; a few short clips on the news? When the videos of the 'oppressed' women 'forced' to wear burukha is shown daily.
Would women 'forced' to wear it rally demanding for their right to wear it? Please... use your own brain and think for yourself for a change instead of just repeating the chantings of nations that are hell bent on involving themsleves in countries that do not concern them, all for their own selfish needs.
|
Hm, bravo, jipmerite.
That said, people always want what they can't have. I suspect there is a large portion of the saudi (and islamic in general) women who do not with to wear the burukha... | jipmerite wrote: |
| Wow, how many points did you get for all those posts? |
Wow, how long did it take for you to think of a retort?
How about answering any of that, justify any of it if you can.
Guess they don't teach you that at Jipmer do they?
I don't post here for the points ( though I could sure use them ).I've posted a lot...but I'm negative on the points.i am in total favour of the counter arguments jipmerite please answer to the counter arguments.
| akshar wrote: |
I pay my homage to the last Hindu nation on the earth. It was declared secular (means what?) by a Hindu. Girijaprasad Koirala.
Good they took a step ahead towards getting more liberal and democratic (?)nation. A democracy that is expected to give them peace and prosperity.
Why bother about religion when u are gonna peace and prosperity. See India they became secular and got both(?). If temples are destroyed who cares? Islamic terrorists are just freedom fighter and will understand if we talk properly to them.
Now the Christian missionaries will enter Nepal in the disguise of charitable trusts and humanatorian and will slowly poison the society with their anti hindi agenda. Let us watch thge fun |
Why do you PAY HOMAGE?
what good did Nepal being a ' Hindu ' nation do except appease a few priests and hindu nationalists?
Did Hinduism bring peace to Nepal?
Did Hinduism somehow change the fact that Nepal was but a Sham of a Democracy?
With white pride do you say that you pay Homage to the last Hindu country?
If missionaries help the starving poor of a country by buying out their religion, I don't see how you can complain.
A man must first feed himself, make sure that his children aren't starving before he kneels to prayer.
The way Christian missionaries convert 3rd world populations is sick, but I don't see how you can complain.I'd rather save someone from starvation buy buying over his beliefs than to just sit around claiming how great hinduism is and watch with indifference as the poor starve around me.THIS IS NOT TO HURT ANY ONE BUT THERE FEW PEOPLE WHOdont care about any thing , in my country there some christian assoscation are there where there give money or home or peace of land for the person who conver t to christain our goverment watched thoses steps for a longtime and there brought a law anti-religion migration , this law been more than 3 years .
if a man chooses to sell his soul, or anything else...should be left to him.
it is not for the government to decide which you choose to tread, and the reasons (or lack of them) why you do...
| i_am_mine wrote: |
if a man chooses to sell his soul, or anything else...should be left to him.
it is not for the government to decide which you choose to tread, and the reasons (or lack of them) why you do... |
may be goverment may think people gain more money (contracter)who do this join and make innocent people fall in there trap this become business for them al the agency who took forward to our country all them are closed back to there own country | i_am_mine wrote: |
if a man chooses to sell his soul, or anything else...should be left to him.
it is not for the government to decide which you choose to tread, and the reasons (or lack of them) why you do...
_________________ |
excuse the english.i was in a hurry.
edit:
if a man chooses to sell his soul, or anything else...it should be left to him.
according to religion(any,all...) a man must pay for what he does wrong (burn in hell,etc,etc) therefore that implies that he must first be allowed to make the wrong choices.if a man's life was controlled by the government then the whole idea of redemption,judgment day, the pearly gates would go to the bin.now that wouldn't be very good business for jesus or allah now would it.
it is not for the government to decide which path you choose to tread, and the reasons (or lack of them) why you do...secularity is a good thing.it is very necassary for the development of free thought.
