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Racial Equality





LA Ridge
Do you think that the races get along better now than in the past?

We have this immigration crap hitting hard over here in Arizona. I think we should knock the damn borders down and work it out, I have always thought that. My biggest fear is that this immigration nonesense is creating friction between the races that didn't really exist here before. I'm a white guy and I have been noticing that the Hispanic people are looking at me differently now. I think that BLOWS! Maybe it's just me and my issues and they are not looking at me any differently.

So what is that answer? Higher fences, more security, the National Guard? I know we need to be more cautious because of terrorists and so forth, but there seems to be no easy way out.
Billy Hill
LA Ridge wrote:
I'm a white guy


What's that got to do with anything? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
AJ_Partow
Well, of course racism towards Blacks was horrendous back in the day with the slavery and such but nowadays I see sort of a role reversal in some senses because some people allow the calling of white people but the demicing of black's is NEVER tolerated but this also gives them the right to say what they want and call themselves racist slurs ' nigga ' . Overall, I think it is not really much an improvment since back then really ...
selim06
i only heard about only but i haven't seen anything about raciscm because in my country there is a small amount of black..But i think it doesn't matter blacl,white,blonde,latin etc...The important thing is the feelings and the HUMANs
odinstag
LA Ridge wrote:
Do you think that the races get along better now than in the past?


No, forced integration made relations much worse.

10's of thousands more people a year get hurt in racial violence now that never did before.

Our government in America forced people together that did not want to be together and the results have been horrific.

Racial Hatred may have a whtie face according to the media but from where I am setting, it's on all sides.
odinstag
AJ_Partow wrote:
Well, of course racism towards Blacks was horrendous back in the day with the slavery and such but nowadays I see sort of a role reversal in some senses because some people allow the calling of white people but the demicing of black's is NEVER tolerated but this also gives them the right to say what they want and call themselves racist slurs ' nigga ' . Overall, I think it is not really much an improvment since back then really ...


Do more reading and less watching TV for information. The racism was never that bad. Sure, there were segregation laws and slavery. All races have been through it at one time or another.

But it was white people after all that saw the injustice in slavery and abolished it. If whites in america were so racist, none of this would have ever happened.

Personally I think it is all personal choice.

I only disagree about the racism being horrendous back in the day. Sure there was racism, people were excluded. But the violence factor was minimum back then. Only if you got out of line and did something that you knew damn well not to do.

And most lynchings were of criminals. The media just likes to show people pictures and let them assume the worse. They seldom give any back story about the crimes the so called victim had commited. They also don't mention that the majority of lynchings in that time were lynching of white criminals. Lynching was not a racist thing accept in a few instances.

Most of the time it was just plain old vigilante mob justice. It has been used to propagandize the whole thing. Corporate America wants us all to fight so they can rob us blind in the meantime.

If you don't wanna be around white people, then you have a right to associeate with whoever you want or don't want. The problem is that integration was forced. They put bayonets in people's backs. That is the problem.

America is not supposed to put bayonets in citizen's backs and force them to do things against their will. But everyone has forgotten all about that.
valkyrie-heavens
It all depends on which race u are. Black racism is alot better, but now we have alot of people who are racist agains israli's (sp?) or asians, etc. there's just no happy medium with anyone. It also depends on the type of person u are and how u were raised to judge people. I think that as each generation grows racism because less of a major deal because people have become so aware of the problem that they just want it to stop.
Jack_Hammer
Mmmm Asian chicks.... I mean, everyone is racist, saying one race is better than another at something simply by their race is racist, where as saying that one race is better than another when it is factually true is not racist.
Wink
LA Ridge
Billy Hill wrote:
LA Ridge wrote:
I'm a white guy


What's that got to do with anything? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes



So it's not ok for me to say I'm white? But it is ok if someone else harps on themselves being black or brown? That is the essence of racism!

It is racism in reverse. It's ok to be proud to be black, brown or green, but if I am proud to be white it's some kind of crime. That is really bad.
snowboardude
LA Ridge wrote:
Billy Hill wrote:
LA Ridge wrote:
I'm a white guy


What's that got to do with anything? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes



So it's not ok for me to say I'm white? But it is ok if someone else harps on themselves being black or brown? That is the essence of racism!

It is racism in reverse. It's ok to be proud to be black, brown or green, but if I am proud to be white it's some kind of crime. That is really bad.


i so second that

now its actually criminal, or racist to say "im white and proud"
LA Ridge
Well, it's rediculous! I mean sure, if you are wearing a hood, burning crosses, or pretending to be some Nazi retard, then I guess you are screwed up in the head. But being European, say from German or English/Irish descent is nothing to be ashamed of.

It isn't a banner I wear around or anything, but I get really tired of all the Gay Pride, Black Pride, and Chicano Pride symbolism without equal time for everybody else.

I suppose it is most likely that Anglo's don't really have that much pride. No wonder, they have been put down for being racist for so long I guess they are convinced.

Being secular, or having a desire to be with your own race of people is not racism. It's the natural order of things. Tribes of similiar people have always done it. So no big deal.
Jeslyn
Racism is still alive and will always be, and anyone who says otherwise is a fool.

As for "reverse racism", that's not only an idiotic concept, it's offensive. Reverse racism, by most standards is when a minority is racist against a white: which inadverntly suggests that:
a) minorities can't be racist... apparently believers of this concept have come up with the idea that minorities are equipt with special genes that don't allow them to have the same feelings and emotions as everyone else.
and
b) that whites are the only people who are racist

as I said, it's a foolish concept.

As for the blacks saying "nigga" but whites can't, why would anyone want the "right" to demean someone else? Its an insult, and people want to be able to run around saying it just because they see a couple of uneducated knuckleheads on television and on the streets saying it, and expect to get away with it. And its not just blacks who say "nigga", most minorities, are able to get away with calling one another racial slurs, nonetheless its not acceptable. But there is a connection among minorities that most whites are excluded from hence why its "allowed" for blacks, hispanics, etc to call one another out of their name. Complaining about it only enforces that whites are not included in this 'connection'.
Regardless, Nobody of any race needs to say any derogatory term regarding age, race, sex or religion. It's the same theory as "s/he jumped off the bridge, so i want to too". Just because someone else does it doesn't make it acceptable, use your minds, assuming one exists.
LA Ridge
Jeslyn wrote:
Racism is still alive and will always be, and anyone who says otherwise is a fool.

As for "reverse racism", that's not only an idiotic concept, it's offensive. Reverse racism, by most standards is when a minority is racist against a white: which inadverntly suggests that:
a) minorities can't be racist... apparently believers of this concept have come up with the idea that minorities are equipt with special genes that don't allow them to have the same feelings and emotions as everyone else.
and
b) that whites are the only people who are racist

as I said, it's a foolish concept.

As for the blacks saying "nigga" but whites can't, why would anyone want the "right" to demean someone else? Its an insult, and people want to be able to run around saying it just because they see a couple of uneducated knuckleheads on television and on the streets saying it, and expect to get away with it. And its not just blacks who say "nigga", most minorities, are able to get away with calling one another racial slurs, nonetheless its not acceptable. But there is a connection among minorities that most whites are excluded from hence why its "allowed" for blacks, hispanics, etc to call one another out of their name. Complaining about it only enforces that whites are not included in this 'connection'.
Regardless, Nobody of any race needs to say any derogatory term regarding age, race, sex or religion. It's the same theory as "s/he jumped off the bridge, so i want to too". Just because someone else does it doesn't make it acceptable, use your minds, assuming one exists.



Obviously, you think you are educated, but it is obvious that your education is not entirely real world. Have you ever heard of "Affirmative Action", or race quotas? Apparently not.

Who would want to be called Nigga? Not me. Nor do I need to be called anything else as offensive as that. You missed the whole point.

It's ok to have a Black Only T.V. cable channel. Let me go out tomorrow and have the "White Guy" broadcasting network and see if feathers don't get ruffled.

I have no idea who you are, or where you come from. So I am not cutting your experience, it is your own. But since I have a day or two on you most likely, and I have been involved in many situations regarding the job race quota, don't tell me there is no such thing as reverse discrimination. In Arizona, if you don't speak Spanish, about half of the employment opportunities are not available to you. I can site examples all day long, but since you appear to know it all my guess is that you have enough hot air to blow up all of our balloons, so enjoy!

My experience has been that people who go around touting that others are fools, or idiots, or any other words to that effect, are usually guilty of some component of the topic at hand. It is a defense mechanism that appears when someone feels they are being attacked. So indirectly, they attempt to get personal while arguing their point rather than standing on the possible accuracy of data that they are trying to represent. So their argument, while at some point possibly having validity, turns into a moot point on the basis of their lack of control in the delivery.

I can't argue with one who is denial, so I rest my case. So in other words... Have a nice day!

And your signature has racist components in and of itself. I can read Spanish.
marques1975
Does it matter today?

There are so many problems we have to face nowadays, that we should not care if someone is black, white or oriental.
Everyone knows that we descend from so many different people, of so many different origins, that we must see other people as equal; after all, we are all humans.
I think the future will be similar to sports, our favourite athlete or soccer player may be David Beckman or Ronaldinho, we don’t care about the colour they have, and we just care about how good they are in what they do.

Oscar
Rmgk
....yeh knock them borders down, and completely ruin the economy.....
tyrant
Racism exists everywhere, in every country. The problem is people seem to thing highly of the whites when there isnt anything special about them. I've have so many asian friends (i'm asian an i live in singapore) who worship the whites with comments like oo he's so cool or i love the whites, they are all good looking , their culture is so open and care free.

Seriously i think its pathetic to worship others because of their skin color, or simple because their country holds power. Majority of IT experts in US are indians. Hotmail was invented by an indian guy which microsoft bought over.
Creative Sound Is an Asian company and so are many others. However sometimes people mistake biasness for racism. Racism is an exteme word. Most people tend to be bias in the sense that they prefer their own race as comapred to others. It's all about feeling good about yourself.

Well that's what i think and a lot more which would make this a political forum rather then webhosting.

cheers
LA Ridge
tyrant wrote:
Racism exists everywhere, in every country. The problem is people seem to thing highly of the whites when there isnt anything special about them. I've have so many asian friends (i'm asian an i live in singapore) who worship the whites with comments like oo he's so cool or i love the whites, they are all good looking , their culture is so open and care free.

Seriously i think its pathetic to worship others because of their skin color, or simple because their country holds power. Majority of IT experts in US are indians. Hotmail was invented by an indian guy which microsoft bought over.
Creative Sound Is an Asian company and so are many others. However sometimes people mistake biasness for racism. Racism is an exteme word. Most people tend to be bias in the sense that they prefer their own race as comapred to others. It's all about feeling good about yourself.

Well that's what i think and a lot more which would make this a political forum rather then webhosting.

cheers


Cool, they WORSHIP us there? I wanna go! Give me a plane ticket! lol

Who cares if it gets political? This is a forum and that is all they want us to do is post. We can't just talk about webhosting because half of the people here don't even have a website, plus that website chat can only go so far.

Asian people are smart, so are people from India. So are you. So what? We are smart, ok. So, if the populations are so damn smart, then how come we still have borders? Like this guy up here says, "Ruin the economy," I doubt it. We already have NAFTA and most of our work goes out the door anyway. Where to? India, Asia Minor. Places who can live on $3.00 a day. So is that dumb? Not mathematically.

Our culture in America is changing. We are producing less and less, but we need more and more. That creates a problem. We are becoming dependent on everyone else in the world. Hell, a couple of years ago some purchasing agent started purchasing military uniforms from China?

Ok, so there is always gonna be race "bias." let's say that racial hatred is at an all time low, henceforth there is a better balance and more or less equality amongst people here. Now I can't speak for Asia, or any other country, nor could you speak on our behalf. But, for the sake of finding middle ground, let us just agree that everything is equal.

So now what? We in America have a border situation, and with the threat of terrorism at everyones back door, I would guess that many parts of the world do. So you have this Islamic faction of extremist who think you are Satan and they are with Allah. So what do you do?

We tighten up our borders and people in Mexico get all upset. We blow the Talibans nardos off (he, he) and we get called war mongers. We attempt to help a Nation rid themselves of a tyrrant and we get accused of being oil hogs. So what is it? Sit around crying the blues, or take some proactive measure? Your call, you got the ball. Imagine that!
ricrose322
of course things have changed. but now we are just better able to hide our discrimination better.
Revvion
Yes i also think things have changed, people hide it more these days. Some do it to be sure no harm will come to them, atleast thats what i think, while others are just not willing to talk about it. I for one think like them to a sertant degree, why? simple everybody around me dous. the more people talk about being equal the less equal they seam to get in there mindset.
LA Ridge
I'm not going to entirely disagree. I think people hide a lot of stuff better today then they did years ago. The reason I think is "Political Correctness." That is a fairly new concept. It wasn't around when I was young. It really didn't actually come into our vocabulary until the mid 90's. It has changed a lot of things.

A word that really gets under my skin is "Tolerance." Wow! What a trashy way to describe acceptance of other people! I think acceptance is a positive word, but tolerance is really a strange way to put things. If I am just tolerating you that means that I might still want to whoop your butt sometime, I'm just putting up with you because I have to.

I have issues. I have had a lot of racial issues with people in my past. I grew up in a mostly black and hispanic part of town. Never had problems generally speaking, it was always with intimate relations that I have had the issues. I'm not going to get into particulars, other than to say it has to do with loyalty problems. Being stabbed in the back. And it has happened almost like clockwork in many cases. Has kept me on my guard, and I think that is sad.

So I am wondering if everything else were equal, and people generally accepted one another, would there be this undertone of distrust that would always be there?
LA Ridge
marques1975 wrote:
Does it matter today?

There are so many problems we have to face nowadays, that we should not care if someone is black, white or oriental.
Everyone knows that we descend from so many different people, of so many different origins, that we must see other people as equal; after all, we are all humans.
I think the future will be similar to sports, our favourite athlete or soccer player may be David Beckman or Ronaldinho, we don’t care about the colour they have, and we just care about how good they are in what they do.

Oscar


Wow! I missed this one. Of course it matters! There is an undertone of racial hatred the likes of which we have never seen in two generations brewing and stewing and ready to explode! And it's not anything to do with black versus white, although I am not convinced that is entirely over with.

It has to do with religion rather than race. Of course that has been going on since, well since then... lol

Currently though it is Islamic extremists against the Infidel! Whoever they may be. Which according to the extremists it's everybody who is not Muslim. That doesn't account for the whole religion either. But, we are talking about closet racists here! These extreme thinkers are racists in the purest tradition! And they hide in the shadows and you can't tell them from any other Muslim. So yes, it still matters! It shouldn't, I agree 1000% But it does to many, many people.
01000101
well, i hear ALOT about this kinda stuff.
i hear anything from, "we should open the gates to all, and accept anyone who wants to be here to save them from other bad countries."

to

"we should have an immigration sniper team."

really, i think racism should stop all together.. blacks say white people are racist towards them, all while whites are saying black people are really the racist ones.. theres names for all types of races, all derogitory and mean hearted.

People these days get WAY too offended over things that arent meant that way.. blacks get upset over being called "African Americans", and i see their point, they MOST LIKELY arent from Africa.. but on the flipside, ive never been to Caucasia.

so really, racism is retarded, and im sorry if i offended some mentally challenged persons out there, but once again, its not meant to be taken personally..

Pe@cE
LA Ridge
01000101 wrote:
well, i hear ALOT about this kinda stuff.
i hear anything from, "we should open the gates to all, and accept anyone who wants to be here to save them from other bad countries."

to

"we should have an immigration sniper team."

really, i think racism should stop all together.. blacks say white people are racist towards them, all while whites are saying black people are really the racist ones.. theres names for all types of races, all derogitory and mean hearted.

People these days get WAY too offended over things that arent meant that way.. blacks get upset over being called "African Americans", and i see their point, they MOST LIKELY arent from Africa.. but on the flipside, ive never been to Caucasia.

so really, racism is retarded, and im sorry if i offended some mentally challenged persons out there, but once again, its not meant to be taken personally..

Pe@cE



Ok, so you just did. Why mention "Mentally Challenged" people in a conversation at all? I have Bipolar disorder, and I am legally insane. So you probably offended someone like me. So why mention it if you don't want to offend me? That is "Ploitical Correctness" in action! See, I don't really care that you said that, but today it's like walking on egg shells with people.

I think it is hilarious that black people would be offended by African American. Sure, it's a rediculous label, I don't think anybody wants to be in Africa anyway right now as crazy at it is there. But that title was originally designed to replace negro, which offended them, and they didn't want us calling them black either, so what do you do?

Who really cares. Call me what you want, just don't call me late for dinner and a movie! And don't talk bad about my dog... Those would cost ya!
David_Pardy
Political correctness is one of the worst things to ever happen to humanity.

Life would be SO much easier if we could just call ourselves black or white or yellow or pink or whatever.

Did you know they can't call them "Blackboards" or "Whiteboards" anymore in Australia? They have to be called "Chalkboards" or "Penboards" now. Ridiculous - all because of political correctness pushing smegheads who should never, EVER breed.

To all those who would take offense at not being called something politically correct, I have something to say to you:

If you have dark skin, YOU ARE BLACK
If you have light skin, YOU ARE WHITE.

Get over your damn self righteousness, off your political correctness soapbox and accept that generic adjectives CAN be used to describe your appearance.

What's next? "Oh he looks happy" "DON'T SAY THAT YOU MIGHT OFFEND SOMEONE!"


DavidPartay: Proud member of SPAPCAR (Sane People Against Political Correctness And Racism)
bluedragon
Black and White ... it still leaves room for discrimination. Not to mention it's a dichotomy just like male/female ... why do we even have to differentiate? We're all human, not of just black or white skin, but of many tones that change through the year for many. Some are dark, some are tan, some are paler than others. Not black, more brown, really. Not white, but peach, maybe.

Now if we can just get over it all and start abolishing marriage we'll be on our way.
LA Ridge
bluedragon wrote:
Black and White ... it still leaves room for discrimination. Not to mention it's a dichotomy just like male/female ... why do we even have to differentiate? We're all human, not of just black or white skin, but of many tones that change through the year for many. Some are dark, some are tan, some are paler than others. Not black, more brown, really. Not white, but peach, maybe.

Now if we can just get over it all and start abolishing marriage we'll be on our way.


Dichotomy? Wow, that's a good 50 cent word! Maybe a dollar word, I don't know. (That's a good thing in case you are not aware. lol)

Black, brown, pink, purple... Yes we are all human. The real differences are cultural and religious. We put our pants on the same way. Family dynamics are different in the different cultures. Traditions and belief systems are what forge our vision and our personal reality. So it's these belief systems that have to change in order for things to be different. And they have in a lot of ways.
01000101
it was part of the point , the "mentally challenge" thing, dont worry i dont feel bad about it tho, im bipolar as well. once again, just proving the afore mentioned point. the entire post was somewhat of a joke, mind you tho, there was some truth in it..

ok so... the dark? people?.. didnt want us calling them
Niggers, so we called them Negro's, then they didnt like that, so we called them AfricanAmericans, nope, that didnt float their boat either, so now were at black.... and they get offended at that... what are we SUPPOSED to call them.. the darker but-not-too dark north americans?..

im not hating on anyone, im not racist at all, but seriously!

they got their way, they can call us Crackers and whiteys and shit, but when they say it, we back it up with "oh... crackers were our poor ancestors"... BULL $HIT.

native americans are complaining, they have better things to do than come up with names for us, or find different names for themselves. ill never figure it out, why cant we be called Humans, or People..

like when your outside and theres a group of (other than your own) race, everyone would say "lets go chill with those PEOPLE"... its not hard.. and it clears up alot of red tape.

There are black/negro/african american/darker-than-white skinned people holding high rank in office and military, so what is the issue.. its not like they are being held back. i think its time everyone stopped bitching about the idea (ill stop bitching after this post :-]] ).

racism needs to stop, everyone needs to hold and hands around a campfire and sing a barry manilow song, cuz barry manilow brings the world together (vomits)...

Pe@cE
LA Ridge
Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing You're a "thinking" person. Most bipolars are, so I guess we are kindred souls.

People. Remember the movie "A Time to Kill?" I loved the summation that the attorney gave, describing the horrific things that happened to that man's little girl. Then he says... "Now imagine she's white!" Oh, man did that hit the right chord or what?

It's all about the lens we look at the world through. Belief systems that are passed on in families. My father was semi-racist, my mother had not one racist bone in her body. I went through my stages, had to fight half of the devil on that subject. It is more peaceful being a non-racist, trust me on that.
psycosquirrel
Here in Atlanta, immigration is not much of a problem. I get along fine with anyone I meet or work with, despite the race. Sometimes there are cultural differences, but that is what makes everyone unique. I just respect their views and try to understand them, even if mine are the opposite.
LA Ridge
psycosquirrel wrote:
Here in Atlanta, immigration is not much of a problem. I get along fine with anyone I meet or work with, despite the race. Sometimes there are cultural differences, but that is what makes everyone unique. I just respect their views and try to understand them, even if mine are the opposite.


Yeah, me too. I have more problems with intimate relations along racial lines sometimes. It's probably something with me and not the other person. But, I get along really well with people in general.

Who am I kidding? It's not really racial, I fight with everybody... Embarassed
felisleo
[quote="LA Ridge"]
tyrant wrote:


. We blow the Talibans nardos off (he, he) and we get called war mongers. We attempt to help a Nation rid themselves of a tyrrant and we get accused of being oil hogs. So what is it? Sit around crying the blues, or take some proactive measure? Your call, you got the ball. Imagine that!


right .americans are the knights.they are the world police...in every possible issue some american or american lover european emphasises that they are just trying to make out a world peace...bullshit.. Smile

if you didn t buy gas from kuwait you wouldn t move your finger which makes you oil hogs(us spends %23 of the whole gas in the world by the way)...you bombed iraq killed 150 thousand iraq soldier and thosands of civilians invased
the country and now you are up to separating it and make out a kurdistan in which u can put up a military base and control middle east.you are the tyrrant
.( and where are the nuc weapons if u didn t take them to your ..)

at least accept it.

i know this is off the topic but i had to answer..
S3nd K3ys
snowboardude wrote:


now its actually criminal, or racist to say "im white and proud"


Correct. But I see (almost every day) stickers on cars saying "Brown Pride" or "Black Pride" or "Mexican Power" etc.
S3nd K3ys
felisleo wrote:
...blah blah blah....


Facts own you.
LA Ridge
[quote="felisleo"]
LA Ridge wrote:
tyrant wrote:


. We blow the Talibans nardos off (he, he) and we get called war mongers. We attempt to help a Nation rid themselves of a tyrrant and we get accused of being oil hogs. So what is it? Sit around crying the blues, or take some proactive measure? Your call, you got the ball. Imagine that!


right .americans are the knights.they are the world police...in every possible issue some american or american lover european emphasises that they are just trying to make out a world peace...bullshit.. Smile

if you didn t buy gas from kuwait you wouldn t move your finger which makes you oil hogs(us spends %23 of the whole gas in the world by the way)...you bombed iraq killed 150 thousand iraq soldier and thosands of civilians invased
the country and now you are up to separating it and make out a kurdistan in which u can put up a military base and control middle east.you are the tyrrant
.( and where are the nuc weapons if u didn t take them to your ..)

at least accept it.

i know this is off the topic but i had to answer..


Wow, really angry person here.

No, it's ok. Off topic or not you may have some valid points. Problem is you don't say really what you are grounding your information on.

We went after the Taliban to find Osama Bin Laden. I think we had a right. After a gutless attack on our soil, we went after the bad guys. No big deal there. I was a Marine for 12 years, that's what I got paid for.

The Iraq situation. Sticky. Not entirely clear. The first suggested purpose was weapons of mass destruction. I agree to that. If you are familiar with atomic explosions, then you might see some validity. Having a rogue nation like Iran or Iraq carrying nukes? Naw, not good. But, they were not there, or haven't yet been found. It could be oil, but I doubt it. More than likely it is strategic. Look at where all of the trouble starts, the Middle East. Now, we are right next door to Iran, who is a definite threat to the world at large, always has been. I was in the Marines in 1979. Iran is a threat. So I think that the plan was a matter of placement. If we are currently where the trouble is, then we can react quickly.

See, there is something you need to remember about us, we are a military of volunteers. Unlike many nations who force the populace to serve, we are not currently in a draft state. So we have limited troop resources. Having a "friendly" nation right in the zone is our best defense currently. It's a military strategy with benefits. The world is oil hungry my friend, as sad as that is, we are all dependent.

Is this "Nation Building"? Probably. Iraq doesn't really appear to be converting to our will easily. There are too many old traditions and separate factions that will probably never conform to our way of thinking. Nor should everybody. That will have to be seen to be believed in my opinion. I don't think they will fully convert.

So your argument about oil may have some truth, but I think the bigger truth is convenience. We have a grudge right now. You may not agree with it, but that part of your opinion does not matter to me. What happened here on 9/11 will be revenged! This is the first time in our history that we have been proactive. If you have some other suggestion on how to fight terrorism, then please tell it to us. We are waiting!

And don't respond to this on a personal attack level. I did not personally attack you, and you will lose any fight with me. So just state your case in some nice way. I would appreciate that and respect your opinion.
bdoneck
Races do get along much better but i dont believe there will ever be a perfect equality. the only thing i have to say is that people will never get along better until they start accepting themselves for who they are and stop taking offense to someone noticing that they are black or hispanic or anything like that. those statements are not racist they are simply observations made by the eye. the color of your skin will never change and people easily recognize other people by the color of their skin, but what really matters is the way we treat each other, not the way we name the color of their skin or their ethnic background
David_Pardy
I've said this before and I'll say it again.

Whether Bush has the intentions that he tells the public or not, whether he really is concerned with giving Iraqis or any other Middle Eastern people more freedom or not, HE IS DOING SOMETHING.

How many of you people are doing something other than sitting on fat arses whining about what Bush is doing? Give him the benefit of the doubt until YOU start making a contribution to the situation in Iraq yourself.

This is not showing support for the actions of the US Army or Bush himself, but it is simply saying "Hey, at least he's doing something with the guise or truth of helping people, so stop complaining"
LA Ridge
David_Pardy wrote:
I've said this before and I'll say it again.

Whether Bush has the intentions that he tells the public or not, whether he really is concerned with giving Iraqis or any other Middle Eastern people more freedom or not, HE IS DOING SOMETHING.

How many of you people are doing something other than sitting on fat arses whining about what Bush is doing? Give him the benefit of the doubt until YOU start making a contribution to the situation in Iraq yourself.

This is not showing support for the actions of the US Army or Bush himself, but it is simply saying "Hey, at least he's doing something with the guise or truth of helping people, so stop complaining"


The US Army follows orders. So not to support them is blasphemy! Listen, I am a Marine. My thinking apparatus is to kill them all, men, women and children, and worry about crying later! That was what I was trained to do. But my orders are to limit "Collateral Damage" or some such nonsense. (I hear Vietnam in my subliminal senses.)

War is war. Kill the enemy is the message of the day, but in this scenario who is the enemy? They all look and talk alike, many pray on a carpet 4 times a day. Who do I kill and who is spared? Depends on my orders.

There is madness all over that battlefield. American troops, Many who are "part time" soldiers, who used to be butchers, bakers and candlestick makers, are forced into being killing machines! Separated from their loved ones, possibly losing their jobs at home, AND being paid like busboys at Denny's, they do the work of the warrior. They are changed FOREVER! Never will they be just Johnny from the streets, they are now Veterans of War, and scarred forever in hideous and insane ways! And when Johnny comes marching home, who gives a damn? You? Me? And all this so they could get a little extra scratch once a month, or pay for college? See, that's what they don't tell you in the recruiting pamphlets or the "Be all you can Be" commercials. "It's just the Army Dad," and the wise man says, "It's still the Army." I am all for serving, obviously, I did my time. But, know what the hell you are in for! The majority of troops are reserve. They are front line troops! We have such a small amount of regulars that our reservists are fighting this war. So buyer beware!

We are all they have people! We are Americans and we have been in war for five (5), count them, FIVE LONG YEARS! Who is gonna pay the price for this war? Soldiers, that's who!

I am a disabled Vet. I go to the Vetarans Administration a couple of times a month, have been for twelve years. There are guys who are still there man! They are still in the Nam, or Desert Storm. I even know WWII Vets and Korean Vets. There are not many left, but there are some that never left Okinawa, or Siagon! That is their legacy. Death, dismemberment, atrocities, sometimes committed by their own comrades, and a SERIOUS WRONG and INJUSTICE done to Vietnam Vets by the American public!

Do not let this happen to these people who lay their blood on the line for you. Ignoring our troops is wrong! Bush can stand on his own legacy, don't let these fine defenders get left in the shadows.
David_Pardy
First off, I am not a US Citizen nor do I wish to be one.

I respect my army and I trust the lives of me, my friends and my family to them. I would never trust my life to the US Army, I'd be just as likely to get killed by friendly fire as from hostile fire.

I said I support that Bush is doing something. I never said that I DON'T support the army, I said that my statement wasn't a show of support.

Contrary to the above paragraph about not trusting my life to the US Army, I DO completely respect the men and women involved and that they're doing their job just like I do every day. I respect what they go through to get to their position, and I respect that they are ordinary Joes just like me who are sent to the front line.

One thing that I found interesting a while back was that on two forums - this, and an Australian forum called Just Commodores - there was a poll with the title "Would you fight for your country/do you support a draft?"

Basically both discussions turned to "Would you die for your country?" 99% of the Australians said they would, and the majority of the people here said they would NOT. If you want to beat support for your country and army into people, then beat it into the citizens of your own country.

By the way - I do not disrespect the marines, just the idiots who cause all the friendly fire casualties. Granted they are mostly reservists, but the majority of the Australian army are reservists as well, and we have had very, very few military casualties in the last 10 years of active overseas duty.

(Yes, I did edit this due to being fed some misinformation)
felisleo
Problem is you don't say really what you are grounding your information on.

us entered iraq in 1990 .they first destroyed -killed- the whole iraqi army
whose number was more then 150000.after they were done with the army they killed resistance forces which is assumed to be a few thousand (nobody knows the exact number of course) .by the second entrance they killed some more soldiers ,resistance forces and civilians (women and children most of whom was just hiding in their houses)

We went after the Taliban to find Osama Bin Laden. I think we had a right. After a gutless attack on our soil, we went after the bad guys. No big deal there. I was a Marine for 12 years, that's what I got paid for.

The Iraq situation. Sticky. Not entirely clear. The first suggested purpose was weapons of mass destruction. I agree to that. If you are familiar with atomic explosions, then you might see some validity. Having a rogue nation like Iran or Iraq carrying nukes? Naw, not good. But, they were not there, or haven't yet been found. It could be oil, but I doubt it. More than likely it is strategic. Look at where all of the trouble starts, the Middle East.

the troubles started when us located israil on the region.israil basicly captured the the land which belonged to the arabs with the help of us.they took the freedom of phalestonen people and sentenced them to live in misery.now i have nothing against jews in fact i even like them but that is just unfair.where there is no justice caos exists.



Now, we are right next door to Iran, who is a definite threat to the world at large, always has been.

unlike us iran has never started a war against any country .unlike us they have never killed a single person in vietnam laos nicaragua or africa.i don t get why they are a threat to the world.they are not saying we are gonna blow up the world once they are nuc.israil is nuc (very nuc in fact) and they threating to shoot iran if they start nuclear researches.pakhistan india korea china france russia china have got nuclear weapons.why aren t they
a treat to the world?



I was in the Marines in 1979. Iran is a threat. So I think that the plan was a matter of placement. If we are currently where the trouble is, then we can react quickly.

See, there is something you need to remember about us, we are a military of volunteers. Unlike many nations who force the populace to serve, we are not currently in a draft state. So we have limited troop resources. Having a "friendly" nation right in the zone is our best defense currently. It's a military strategy with benefits. The world is oil hungry my friend, as sad as that is, we are all dependent.

Is this "Nation Building"? Probably.

how easy is that to you right? you are trying make out new borders which seemimgly will cause thousands maybe hundred tousands of people to die in pain on a land which does not belong to you.but who cares


Iraq doesn't really appear to be converting to our will easily.

do they have to?

There are too many old traditions and separate factions that will probably never conform to our way of thinking. Nor should everybody. That will have to be seen to be believed in my opinion. I don't think they will fully convert.

So your argument about oil may have some truth, but I think the bigger truth is convenience. We have a grudge right now. You may not agree with it, but that part of your opinion does not matter to me. What happened here on 9/11 will be revenged! This is the first time in our history that we have been proactive. If you have some other suggestion on how to fight terrorism, then please tell it to us. We are waiting!

get the hell out of middle east .stop horrassing third world countries.

and why are you in iraq and afghanistan.the 9/11 terrorists were mostly suudi arabian.


And don't respond to this on a personal attack level. I did not personally attack you, and you will lose any fight with me. So just state your case in some nice way. I would appreciate that and respect your opinion.[/quote]
felisleo
LA Ridge wrote:




Listen, I am a Marine. My thinking apparatus is to kill them all, men, women and children, and worry about crying later! That was what I was trained to do.


we all know that dont we
LA Ridge
Look here. To the guy who has no earthly idea what end his butthole is on, and has no idea how to post a coherent post. Get a life. You are totally out of line and you would be dogmeat if I felt like tearing you a new one here on this forum. But let me just say, you have a right to your opinion. So you said your piece, I said mine. It's over, go home

You Australian fellow. You are right about one thing and one thing only. You are not American. This country is free and proud and I would not live in your rathole. So where do you get off talking or even mentioning us. You come from another land and have no idea what it is to be American!

Your country is so screwed up right now, so stay to your own doorstep and sweep that first. Don't even try to disrespect our military.

Plus that, we can kick you ten times to China if we felt like it. So go do something constructive please. You are also way out of line. But, I respect your opinion, you respect mine. It's over now, go home.

You are screwing up a good thread, and it is my thread. I am asking you immature posters to go somewhere else. We were discussing a real issue and getting along fine.

If you want to fight, fine... I have a fight club on my forum and you are welcome to join, all bad feelings aside, I have nothing against you. Just respect my request and stop your ranting here. Start another thread with that topic and I will come and make a fool out of you there, but I would rather not. Now go home. Thanks
joxang
Quote:
Listen, I am a Marine. My thinking apparatus is to kill them all, men, women and children, and worry about crying later! That was what I was trained to do.


LOL, LA Ridge. After that thread of ours on the music board, and your thread about money, I searched for your last couple of threads just to see whether you were always that arrogant.

Let's just say that I always thought the american marine stereotype was...well. Just a stereotype. Looks like I'm wrong.

Quote:
They are still in the Nam


There are americans still in vietnam Neutral??
Soulfire
Yes, we're equal. Racial equality is "better" now. I use the word better loosely, because discrimination still exists, but the barriers are being torn down.

Everyone keeps saying "You're a nation of immigrants, and now you turn your back?!" To them I have to say: When do we stop? We do not have the resources to allow a constant flow of ILLEGAL (meaning LAW BREAKING) people to stream into our nation.

Our country compared to a bathtub... (Let's see how this goes Shocked)

America is the actual bath tub, the container. You turn the faucet on (and allow the immigrants in). There's a point where the safety drain (current laws, fences, resitrictions, etc.) are not enough to slow the filling water. At some point, we overflow... and that's not a good thing.
mabuhay
I just got back from a 2 week visit to Colombia and met an african-american group that shared some of the successes of African-American struggles in the US with the afro-Colombians. They were over-joyed to hear about some of victories as far as equal rights and public aministration. American culture is very influential and can set a higher standard for equality - if we can ever acheive it.
LA Ridge
joxang wrote:
Quote:
Listen, I am a Marine. My thinking apparatus is to kill them all, men, women and children, and worry about crying later! That was what I was trained to do.


LOL, LA Ridge. After that thread of ours on the music board, and your thread about money, I searched for your last couple of threads just to see whether you were always that arrogant.

Let's just say that I always thought the american marine stereotype was...well. Just a stereotype. Looks like I'm wrong.

Quote:
They are still in the Nam


There are americans still in vietnam Neutral??


Little one, please go home to your XBox and leave the talking to people who can have an original thought... When you have lived anywhere near as long as I have, and you have 6 grown children and 7 grandchildren then you can talk to me about how smart you are and all knowledge that you posses about Marines, Soldiers, and America. Ok Sweetie? Have a nice day, and get your own thread, ok? Have an original thought.
LA Ridge
Soulfire wrote:
Yes, we're equal. Racial equality is "better" now. I use the word better loosely, because discrimination still exists, but the barriers are being torn down.

Everyone keeps saying "You're a nation of immigrants, and now you turn your back?!" To them I have to say: When do we stop? We do not have the resources to allow a constant flow of ILLEGAL (meaning LAW BREAKING) people to stream into our nation.

Our country compared to a bathtub... (Let's see how this goes Shocked)

America is the actual bath tub, the container. You turn the faucet on (and allow the immigrants in). There's a point where the safety drain (current laws, fences, resitrictions, etc.) are not enough to slow the filling water. At some point, we overflow... and that's not a good thing.


Well, see I think we are doing better too. Since the 60's we have come a long, long way for sure. There were, (and still is to some degree), neighborhoods in LA you didn't dare go. But say, like here in Phoenix you can go most anywhere. I have never really been in a place in this town where I felt afraid.

Here is my thought on the immigration scene. Now, where I live used to be Mexico, and we took it many years ago and made it CA, AZ, NM, TX. Now I heard a rumor, and was only that mind you, that the hispanic population here had a plan. They were going to overpopulate by having many children... You get the drift.

So, we are getting along fine down here, right? Everyone gets along and there is no racial bitterness and so on. The Mexican Nationals have been coming here for decades, doing labor type jobs, landscaping, dishes, etc. That has been going on here for literally 100's of years. No problems, they pay taxes, they are not into criminal stuff for the most part, (out of fear) and they send all their extra money (literally) back to momma. So what is the problem? Why bother them. I don't want their jobs.

So why create bitterness with a group of people that we normally have no trouble getting along with, in fact, they are helping us out?

Ok, so I am one who likes solutions. Rather than complain. Some of the friends here think I am a whiner, or whatever, and that is so wrong, but here is the solution...

Knock down the borders between us and Mexico. Help the Mexican people recover their economy by sharing with them our Gross National Product, and turn over our industrial outsourcing we do with India, etc. over to Mexico and South America. They are ripe for industry and they can produce like crazy! And let them have a dual citizenship status, Mexican if they choose and American if need be. At the same time we are helping each other out we all prosper.

Race relations can only deteriorate if we continue our hostile attitude toward people south of the border. This has been my point all along! If you read some of my original posts, you will see that I have already said this.

Then, Mexico is a heavy alliance, and we fight terrorism as partners. Why alienate our brothers and sisters there, or Canada for that matter? That is all we have here is our neighbors.
d-man28401
I think ppl are getting along much better than they were in the past, im blk and i have friends of all races, neither of us disrespect one another in anyway. I frown upon anyone who is racist these days becase i think racism is very stupid
igor123d
Racism and immigration are to distinct concepts, and even though they overlap on several occasions, they should generally not be fused in any discussion. The current discussion regarding immigration policy does have some racial overtones as the overwhelming majority of the migrant workers found in the US illegally come from Mexicio or Latin America in general. Nevertheless, among the country's legislative branch few view this problem as inherently racist. It really doesn't matter what the race of the illegal immigrants is, only their status does.
David_Pardy
Haha! So LA Ridge is RACIST! Isn't that ironic?

I know what it's like to be American. I had one stay at my place for 6 weeks. 6 weeks of the stereotypical obese, obnoxious, loud, arrogant and rude American.

You're obviously patriotic, LA Ridge, and it blinds you to reality. If America is so great, then why the prevalence of huge gangs and poverty? Australia has homeless people, it's got gangs, but to quote one American "Your gangs are cute.". We also don't have nearly as high a proportion of homeless people. Why don't you go tell THEM that America is great and that they're lucky to be there? You'd get punched in the head. Your government is doing NOBODY any favours except those with money already - the government wants nothing to do with people without money.

And Felisleo is making more valid points in each one of his posts than you have made on this entire forum.

Seriously, get over yourself, get over America, and take a look at reality. America is the rathole. You think your army could beat ours? The ONLY advantage your army has is numbers, and they would be SEVERELY REDUCED after all the friendly fire casualties from the huge level of incompetence. Australia has the most well-trained army in the world, and you're just going to have to accept that.

You're not a marine anymore, my friend. It's time to move on and to open your eyes. Corporate America is destroying the world and destroying people. There are very few people high up in the leadership of your country with good intentions and none of those people have the power to put those intentions into action.

And I would rather live in my 'rathole', where I am safe and happy, than live in a country full of arrogant, blind, hypocritical patriots. All Australians are patriotic, but we also keep an eye on reality. At least we see the problems in our country and we work to fix them - which is why Australia is the greatest country in the world.
kung_fu_stu
Borders don't create racism they create countries. People create racism. Racism will always exist, because ignorant, selfish, controlling peole will always exist. Some people are just looking for a fight and race is an easy difference too pick out; but if that person can't find someone with a different skin colour, well then there is always religion, hieght, maybe just the brand of clothing that someone is wearing.

As far as reverse racism goes; just try getting a government job. For years they have had ethnicity quotas (meaning they have to hire a specific number of nationalities). This all means that the job is not necissarily going to the PERSON who is most qualified for the job. So in this instant the caucasian can offten be the minority.

You must accept your self before you can accept others. Do you know who you really are?
sistahgeek
This is the stupidest sh*t I've ever read on this board! You have NO IDEA what you're talking about. How DARE you claim that racism "wasn't that bad" in the past? What the f**k have you been smoking?!!! It's obvious that YOU need to do more reading.

Don't talk about what you don't KNOW about!!!

I'm a black woman from SOUTH CAROLINA, of all places. My entire family is from there, and still lives there today. You're some white boy from Europe. What the hell do YOU really know about racism against black Americans in the past?

I can't believe you posted this ignorant, white-washed bullshit. Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad

odinstag wrote:


Do more reading and less watching TV for information. The racism was never that bad. Sure, there were segregation laws and slavery. All races have been through it at one time or another.

But it was white people after all that saw the injustice in slavery and abolished it. If whites in america were so racist, none of this would have ever happened.

Personally I think it is all personal choice.

I only disagree about the racism being horrendous back in the day. Sure there was racism, people were excluded. But the violence factor was minimum back then. Only if you got out of line and did something that you knew damn well not to do.

And most lynchings were of criminals. The media just likes to show people pictures and let them assume the worse. They seldom give any back story about the crimes the so called victim had commited. They also don't mention that the majority of lynchings in that time were lynching of white criminals. Lynching was not a racist thing accept in a few instances.

Most of the time it was just plain old vigilante mob justice. It has been used to propagandize the whole thing. Corporate America wants us all to fight so they can rob us blind in the meantime.

If you don't wanna be around white people, then you have a right to associeate with whoever you want or don't want. The problem is that integration was forced. They put bayonets in people's backs. That is the problem.

America is not supposed to put bayonets in citizen's backs and force them to do things against their will. But everyone has forgotten all about that.
izimngcubes15
I think even though the society says all men are equal, I don't think many people agree.

What's in their minds? They might be racist and thinking bad something about them behind their backs, I mean even though we all think we're living in a free country, there are many people still are racist against others and I believe when it comes to a time when a white guyu has to help a black guy, the white guy won't help because he's racist inside.

I think we all still are developing through the changes that was made more than 30 years ago.
HoboPelican
sistahgeek wrote:
This is the stupidest sh*t I've ever read on this board! You have NO IDEA what you're talking about. How DARE you claim that racism "wasn't that bad" in the past? What the f**k have you been smoking?!!!


Sistahgeek, I would say you have some anger issues....lol....go for it!

That clown really didn't have a clue. I grew up in Cleveland during the 50's and '60s, and even from a middle class, white perspective, it WAS bad. It makes a difference whether you read something in a book or live it.
Vrythramax
My older brother lives in Mesa and let me tell you he has alot to say about the subject.....not all of it good. I won't debate with anyone on the subject as I have little understanding of the ramifications involved.

I will say this though...if you want to be a citizen of the US...do it legally. My parents did, as did so many others.
Malar
About racism: skin colour is not an independant binding factor when it comes to behaviour. Genes play some part in the behaviour, but I don't believe that all white people differ from black people in one way or another. The difference comes from culture and society. Basically, the only true concept is that every human is unique in his own way and skin colour doesn't say anything about them.

LA Ridge wrote:
The Iraq situation. Sticky. Not entirely clear. The first suggested purpose was weapons of mass destruction. I agree to that. If you are familiar with atomic explosions, then you might see some validity. Having a rogue nation like Iran or Iraq carrying nukes? Naw, not good. But, they were not there, or haven't yet been found. It could be oil, but I doubt it. More than likely it is strategic. Look at where all of the trouble starts, the Middle East. Now, we are right next door to Iran, who is a definite threat to the world at large, always has been. I was in the Marines in 1979. Iran is a threat. So I think that the plan was a matter of placement. If we are currently where the trouble is, then we can react quickly.

I agree that Iraq is a very strategic point in the Middle East, especially with the nuclear threat from Iran, most likely directed as Isreal in the coming future. The problem with the whole situation was that the U.S. acted like some universal police, effectively overruled the United Nations and did what they thought was right. I believe you can safely label that as arrogance. The paradox is that in your quest to reduce the threat of terrorism, going outside the U.N. probably only increased it.

Quote:
Is this "Nation Building"? Probably. Iraq doesn't really appear to be converting to our will easily. There are too many old traditions and separate factions that will probably never conform to our way of thinking. Nor should everybody. That will have to be seen to be believed in my opinion. I don't think they will fully convert.

Freedom isn't something you impose or establish. If the people are not ready, it will not happen. Look at European history: concepts of free thinking and individuality took thousands of years to develop and revolutions were never imposed by foreigners. Also it is not said that those concepts are the 'end all' solution to all problems: it's just the solution the western world adopted. Who are the U.S. to say that this is the best solution for Iraq? Also, as long as Guantanamo Bay is intact, where people are being held without any form of trial, it is extremely hypocrite to try to establish a 'free democracy' at the other end of the world.

Quote:
So your argument about oil may have some truth, but I think the bigger truth is convenience. We have a grudge right now. You may not agree with it, but that part of your opinion does not matter to me. What happened here on 9/11 will be revenged! This is the first time in our history that we have been proactive. If you have some other suggestion on how to fight terrorism, then please tell it to us. We are waiting!

I think the best way to fight terrorism is to not give any extremist reason to attack you. That means you back away from Iraq, adopt the Monroe doctrine again, stay on your continent and stop interfering with the world's business. Of course that's not possible because of economic interests and you can't really leave Iraq: the Bush administration sure made a mess of it all.
THE11thROCK™
Racism was rampant in the past. At least racism today can be limited if not controlled today. Empires and kingdoms and Regimes ruled in the past. However, much of the differences in society nowadays is not primarily associated with race. I believe that Religion, Politics, Power and Economy plays a vital role. I disgrace racism itself, but it is a thing which may not be avoided. Cultural differences, language barriers and nationalism can still hinder one way or another our ability to live without prejudice. Yes, we are in a free society. However, the shackles of Racism will still cast its' shadow upon every soil we step upon. Be it less or greater, what's important is we learn to respect each race, while believing in our own and being proud of where we really are from.
haydenharasta
Gratz man, I second you on this! And just to put this out there as I haven't much time... let's not be gung-ho shoot-em-up marines, and just because we're happy about who we are, doesn't mean we have to go over to Iraq, blow up a few embassies, kill 50+ Iraqi citizens, accidently friendly-fire one of our own, and give a 30 minute news special on him/or her, and fail to mention a single Iraqi casualty. I'm happy this forum arose, so I could state this, and I have all respect for our american fighters, but not a lot that they're fighting for.
OutlawSpirit
AJ_Partow wrote:
Well, of course racism towards Blacks was horrendous back in the day with the slavery and such but nowadays I see sort of a role reversal in some senses because some people allow the calling of white people but the demicing of black's is NEVER tolerated but this also gives them the right to say what they want and call themselves racist slurs ' nigga ' . Overall, I think it is not really much an improvment since back then really ...


"nigga" is not a racist slur - "******" is....

a role reversal Rolling Eyes i think you need to educate yourself a bit more and open your eyes and take a real look Shocked
HoboPelican
OutlawSpirit wrote:


"nigga" is not a racist slur - "******" is....


Really? What is the difference. I would think it's just a different form of the same word. Like Me calling someone an A-hole instead of an a**hole.
haydenharasta
There is no difference. It's just a shortened version like HP said...
AdamantMonk
LA Ridge wrote:


The US Army follows orders. So not to support them is blasphemy! Listen, I am a Marine. My thinking apparatus is to kill them all, men, women and children, and worry about crying later! That was what I was trained to do. But my orders are to limit "Collateral Damage" or some such nonsense. (I hear Vietnam in my subliminal senses.)

War is war. Kill the enemy is the message of the day, but in this scenario who is the enemy? They all look and talk alike, many pray on a carpet 4 times a day. Who do I kill and who is spared? Depends on my orders.

There is madness all over that battlefield. American troops, Many who are "part time" soldiers, who used to be butchers, bakers and candlestick makers, are forced into being killing machines! Separated from their loved ones, possibly losing their jobs at home, AND being paid like busboys at Denny's, they do the work of the warrior. They are changed FOREVER! Never will they be just Johnny from the streets, they are now Veterans of War, and scarred forever in hideous and insane ways! And when Johnny comes marching home, who gives a damn? You? Me? And all this so they could get a little extra scratch once a month, or pay for college? See, that's what they don't tell you in the recruiting pamphlets or the "Be all you can Be" commercials. "It's just the Army Dad," and the wise man says, "It's still the Army." I am all for serving, obviously, I did my time. But, know what the hell you are in for! The majority of troops are reserve. They are front line troops! We have such a small amount of regulars that our reservists are fighting this war. So buyer beware!

We are all they have people! We are Americans and we have been in war for five (5), count them, FIVE LONG YEARS! Who is gonna pay the price for this war? Soldiers, that's who!

I am a disabled Vet. I go to the Vetarans Administration a couple of times a month, have been for twelve years. There are guys who are still there man! They are still in the Nam, or Desert Storm. I even know WWII Vets and Korean Vets. There are not many left, but there are some that never left Okinawa, or Siagon! That is their legacy. Death, dismemberment, atrocities, sometimes committed by their own comrades, and a SERIOUS WRONG and INJUSTICE done to Vietnam Vets by the American public!

Do not let this happen to these people who lay their blood on the line for you. Ignoring our troops is wrong! Bush can stand on his own legacy, don't let these fine defenders get left in the shadows.


Mind if I start a chain letter of this?
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