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Beginning Programming... Help!





randomaccess
I'm beginning programming. I don't know where to begin. So what language should i start off with
Stubru Freak
randomaccess wrote:
I'm beginning programming. I don't know where to begin. So what language should i start off with


If you want to do web programming, you should start with php, if you know html already, otherwise first learn that

If you want to do desktop programming, I would personally start with C/C++
Traveller
Back in the day, real beginners got started with BASIC, but that won't get you very far very quickly nowadays. Instead, C and C++ are better, although they are usually a little more difficult for some people to learn.

Start with C, so you learn the major concepts of programming, then move on to C++ so you learn object-oriented programming. Even though the NAMES of the two languages are similar, and they share a common base, they really belong to two different classes of language. C is procedural, and C++ is object oriented.

Once you can grasp the two different concepts, you will be able to pick up a good number of other languages, especially the web-related languages (e.g. PHP, Java, Javascript, etc.) since most of them share concept and structure with C or C++.

If you plan on working in more specialized fields, you may need to learn more specialized languages that use different base concepts. Some examples of these are: Assembly - for working more deeply inside the computer system, Forth - for use with observatory telescopes (among other things), APL - which probably isn't used for much any more, LISP - which is especially useful for AutoCad and artificial intelligence, and Prolog - for artificial intelligence and expert systems.

One important note: although computers DO use math, it is NOT as important for you to be good in math as it is for you to be good at breaking down tasks into smaller, individual steps. If you cannot think in terms of logical sequences, then no amount of mathematical ability will help you learn programming.

Welcome to the world of programming, and have fun!
x-stream
Traveller wrote:
Back in the day, real beginners got started with BASIC, but that won't get you very far very quickly nowadays. Instead, C and C++ are better, although they are usually a little more difficult for some people to learn.


Hmmm... Ive started with Qbasic, the easiest language that youll ever find, but Its a good way to learn programming, I think because you get the basic of programming without looking up difficult functions in a functions list... I think for a beginner, C/C++ is too difficult.
Nyizsa
You may try Pascal as a first step. It's easy to understand and it will help you develop very structured programs, what you will find useful when you switch to C, C++ or Java. It's mainly a procedural language, but it is also possible to do some object oriented programming in Pascal.
randomaccess
I agree that C/C++ is too complicated for a beginner like me. I chose Java to start with. Is that OK?
Sebaci
The best choose is C++, but it is also harder than Pascal and Visual Basic. C++ is the most popular programming language and you can write in it anything you want. There's also assembler, the hardest, but with it you can write very good viruses Wink
Stubru Freak
randomaccess wrote:
I agree that C/C++ is too complicated for a beginner like me. I chose Java to start with. Is that OK?


I find Java more complicated then C
woja
randomaccess wrote:
I'm beginning programming. I don't know where to begin. So what language should i start off with


Things to bear in mind:
    Learning programming is not the same as learning a programming language.
    Start with a general-purpose language (like Java, C/C++, Pascal) even if it seems complicated.
    All programming languages are complicated to start with.
    Don't expect to be able to write a killer-app immediately.
    If you can, learn two languages (or more) with different syntactic paradigms at the same time (e.g. learn Java and Pascal).
    Learn to live on caffeine-rich fizzy drinks.
frozenhead
Well, that's a good! Uhm..like the other already told you, start with C/C++. Just to add though, it because most of 3rd generation programming languages developed nowadays are based on C in its structure and semantics.
AhmedSalmanJamal
You should definitely start with Java. It is the language which every university teaches their students as a preliminary language. Hence I will recommend java to you. To start off you could get the eclipse editor but I would recommend you using normal textpad or notepad to write the code. All the best...and if you need any help then please send me a pm Smile
randomaccess
I found that java is very easy to learn and write. I use JCreator to type up the code. So i recommend java to every beginner.
munkey_boy
Use REALbasic 2006 the site is www.realsoftware.com download the trial then buy it if u like it
woja
AhmedSalmanJamal wrote:
To start off you could get the eclipse editor but I would recommend you using normal textpad or notepad to write the code.

Which reminds me that when I taught programming for a while (C, back in the 1980's), one of the biggest problems was getting over the hurdle of the development environment and the associated editors. A couple of my students got rather upset that they had to learn the editor as well.
Eclipse is wonderful if you already have some Java under your belt but is probably a bit daunting for novices. However, in some ways, it's better to plunge in at the deep end than to try and do it bit-by-bit (pun intended).
Good luck, randomacess, and enjoy the process.
quartz
To learn programming you may use any easy programming language like basic or pascal. If you want programm for web use php and html.
Best and quickiest method i think is to get some little project what you wanna to programm. Get some similar sources, take look to how that was made and try to do it yoursef. Also its good to get debugger and take look how your programm works step by step.
munkey_boy
[quote="quartz"]To learn programming you may use any easy programming language like basic or pascal.[\quote]

Exactly what i said in my post above, a couple of posts. Use REALbasic 2006 so easy drag and drop then just well type the code for it couldnt be easier unless u had someone to do it for you
benjad
Suggestion....

do NOT even consider using real basic, or quick basic. I started in good old Apple ][e's version of basic, and am now having a hard time wrapping my head around OOP. Start with something that is very OOP friendly.

If it has basic in the title (!= "visual basic"), ignore it.
Hellscythe
I agree strongly there. I started with QBasic, and although I love it dearly and can do some decent stuff in it, it's a horrible starting language for now-a-days. I have OOP problems now too, and I always forget line-end semicolons, except for in Perl for some odd reason. From first-hand experience, start with C/C++. It may seem hard at first, but it's a much better habit to form than BASIC.
rohan2kool
if u think of going with basic, I sugest u go with Visual Basic.
If u go with pascal, i suggest u go with Object Pascal or most preferrably Delphi.
{name here}
randomaccess wrote:
I'm beginning programming. I don't know where to begin. So what language should i start off with

To program games and applications:
Easy route: learn BASIC, then Pascal, then C. You may hae difficulty mastering C conepts though...
Hard route(but easier in the end): learn C, then Pascal, then BASIC. It'll be difficult at first, but then you'll be able understand and program better in BASIC.
http://petesqbsite.com/ has possibly the largest database of BASIC tutorials.
http://wikibooks.org/ has detailed and easy C prrogramming books.
http://taoyue.com/ has the ultimate pascal tutorial
Also, if you want to program games, try FreeBASIC. It's optimized for game programming but has some capability for applications. Do NOT learn visual basic. Your applications will be easy to tell apart from natural C programmed applications, and they will end up looking unproffessional.
There in basis one free route for Pascal, and that is FreePascal.
For C you have two free options: GCC and OpenWatcom. GCC is best for operating system programming while OpenWatcom is best for Applications and games due to its optimization. However, you will be confused with GCC right off the bat trying to download the right stuff no matter how they try to explain it(or lack thereof). If you get an IDE for GCC they'll supply a premade one without the hassle of trying to guess the directory structure.

To program Web Based things:
Best Route: Learn HTML, then JavaScript, then PHP, then MySQL.
http://tizag.com/ has tutorials on all of them.
Guyon
Well it depends on your interests and how much you want to spend.

General programming at no expense try Python:
http://www.python.org/

MS Visual Basic is easy to use and has a great editor
http://msdn.microsoft.com/vbasic/

Pure Basic is cheep VERY powerful and fast
http://www.purebasic.com/


Dark Basic - easy to use can make games
http://darkbasic.thegamecreators.com/

Nuclear 3D - A VERY nice C++, VERY powerful, can make games, and very inexpensive. Also used a FREE MS C++ base. I really recommend this
http://www.nuclearglory.com/
openaasman
i agree that c/c++ a bit difficult to understant for biggeners, but if you clear to system concepts and logics, then i don't feel there is any any difficulty to learn c or java any thing. i started my carrer c/c++.

if you under stand oops very well then u start with java.
Liu
Stubru Freak wrote:

I find Java more complicated then C

Ever done any memory management?
Stubru Freak
Liu wrote:
Stubru Freak wrote:

I find Java more complicated then C

Ever done any memory management?


No, I don't know C very well, sorry. I just know that after a day of learning I could output something useful to the command line in C (count the most occuring letters in a text :p), and in Java it took at least 2 weeks before I could get anything useful out of it. (Never did oop, that's probably the reason, I was used to php). But on the other hand I could write a small graphical game in Java after a month which I couldn't do in C I think.
gmman
I suggest for a begenner to start with a program like gamemaker it has its own scripting launage, gml, which is basicly just a watered down verson of c++. Personally i started with Qbasic then moved on to gamemaker then php and other web lanuages.

Gamemaker is free and can be found herehttp://www.gamemaker.nl
rayx
randomaccess wrote:
I agree that C/C++ is too complicated for a beginner like me. I chose Java to start with. Is that OK?

Java is just like C/C++. It has the same concept of programming structure. Usually JAVA was hook from C/C++.
IceNinjaa
whats everyones take on python? i have a book on it. just havent gotten around to it. also looking for a decent editor for it as well.
lasdjfk
I wonder why not more people suggests Python. I started to learn programming one month ago. Someone had recommended Python. It was supposed to be an easy to learn programming language, yet powerful and completely free.

Now, after a month of nightly programming I marvel at how easy it was to learn. I started out writing a vocabulary-checker playing an mp3-file for every word. First I wrote it in a procedure oriented manner, but I soon realized the power of Object Oriented Programming so I rewrote the program.

I have no previous programming experience (if you don't count batch-files) and to me Python seemed to be a very good starting point. There's also a lot of tuturials for beginners on the net.
I also strikes me how logical this programming is. No exceptions, just straight forward, simple rules to follow.
lasdjfk
IceNinjaa wrote:
whats everyones take on python? i have a book on it. just havent gotten around to it. also looking for a decent editor for it as well.


About the editor... I think the built in editor in Python - called IDLE - works very fine. There is more information on python.org.
IceNinjaa
idk if its just b/c ive been working with visual basic for about a year or if its just a misconceived thought, but how are forms and other objects created in other languages? like i think its the one thing thats been holding me back. i just don't know how i should be going about the creation and learning of everything.
Stubru Freak
IceNinjaa wrote:
idk if its just b/c ive been working with visual basic for about a year or if its just a misconceived thought, but how are forms and other objects created in other languages? like i think its the one thing thats been holding me back. i just don't know how i should be going about the creation and learning of everything.


VB is really form-oriented. In other languages it's a bit harder. But that isn't bad. In Java, for example, you would use the javax.swing package:
(Large document, give the main frame at least 5 seconds to change to the right section)
http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.5.0/docs/api/?javax/swing/package-summary.html
lasdjfk
IceNinjaa wrote:
idk if its just b/c ive been working with visual basic for about a year or if its just a misconceived thought, but how are forms and other objects created in other languages? like i think its the one thing thats been holding me back. i just don't know how i should be going about the creation and learning of everything.


There is GUI-based editors for Python. However I have not tried them. And I like better the though of code-based gui-programming, with total control over the generated code, i.e. writing the code for the objects by hand.
The built-in Tkinter-GUI for python is quit easy to use once you get the basics.
Just a few lines of code like this:

import Tkinter
root = Tk()
frame = Frame(root)
Button(frame, "IceNinjaa").pack()
#More content to the window adds here
root.mainloop()

This gives you a window with a button containing the text "IceNinjaa".
When you want to add more object to the window, it's done by only 1 or 2 lines of additional code.

For getting started I recommend http://www.byteofpython.info/read/ and http://www.freenetpages.co.uk/hp/alan.gauld/.
The object oriented programming could be a little bit tricky before you get the idea.

There's also a lot of information on http://www.python.org
kiranaghor
I can tell u reasons why u should start with Java. First there is a book called 'Head First Java'. This book will teach u everything about programming. And there tons of other books and free tutorials on net u can go thru. As u learn Java u will find C# eazy.
Second is it is cross platform. u can write on mac ,windows, Ubuntu etc.
Also Java n C# follow Object oriented paradigm.
U should also learn C to know more about procedural programming. Just start and u will know everything. Start asking questions and don't hesitate to pay for answers. I learned C from a well known expert in our area and I owe him whatever I know in Computer Science.
bigdbag
In the academic world, it's generally agreed that java should be learned after c/c++. besides c++, I think maybe visual basic may be good. It's a very visual and easy to work with language that beginners can use to understand the basics of programming. c++ should be next. c not so much since object-oriented programming is really what's needed these days.
Traquarius
I've got my website created in Dreamweaver that includes an order form. What I don't know how to do is program the form so that it returns the information to me via email.

Do I use PHP, Perl, or just CGI?

Can I get PHP from Frihost? Where do I begin?
benjad
Traquarius wrote:
I've got my website created in Dreamweaver that includes an order form. What I don't know how to do is program the form so that it returns the information to me via email.

Do I use PHP, Perl, or just CGI?


It depends on what you want to do. If you want the form results to just be mailed to you, there are some simple php ways of doing this (and also some very complex ways). It can also be done in CGI, altohough IMHO this is much more complex.

Another possibility I can offer is to explore the possibility of using the form as a database, and using mysql.


Quote:
Can I get PHP from Frihost? Where do I begin?


Frihost offers PHP and mySql.


[Need to split / move this one]
Traquarius
Thanks, Benjad. Sometimes I can get very frustrated when I know there's a simple answer out there but I just can't find it.

I read through the help pages more carefully, which pointed me to a page with links to PHP programs. I found one that gives you a free demo download. I got that on my computer, and found that it easily generated script for my webform.

I uploaded it to my public_html file, and voila! Everything worked. (That is, until I kept getting script error messages. Turns out that you can't use quotation marks on your echo messages. Wink

Now, if only the server was up and running...
benjad
one last <offtopic> note, for anyone begining with php. Watch versions carefully!

php 4+ made some interesting choices. For that reason, lots of hosts have stuck with php3.x. Working with the two have some signinficant differences. Explore carefully </offtopic>

And thanks for the donation! Smile
deepak
It depends on you, if you really want to design quick applications then Python, Ruby, Delphi are nice languages to start with. They are really easy and you could develop your application in few days depending upon their structure. However, Its is always better to start with C and then moved to C++ and then you can opt Java, C#, Python or Ruby. First, try to bolster you foundation of programing, then algorithms and then languages. Goodluck!
SurBiff
I started off with python, i think thats the best way to start.

nice multi platform editors:
DrPython
SPE

I personaly use:
Gedit (Ubuntu Linux) with Python tools
hostingguy
If you are a beginner in Web programming you can start with HTML
then contineu with CSS or PHP.
You can take some tutorials at W3Schools to start. Smile
Timmeh
I would add support to learning Java as a first programming language.

I think it is easier to pick up than other langauges and when you start write more complex code it remains easy. The tutorials on the sun website are very good to learn the basics from. I agree that you should steer clear of eclipse until you are ready to write much larger programs.

Java will remove the need for you to learn about datastructures, sorting and searching properly. This could be a big draw back.

I like that I was taught functional programming (lisp) first and that was used to teach programming concepts (functional, oo, search algorithms, datastructures). I know a number of other people that I work with also learnt functional programming very early on and apprecaite it. Unfortunately I think it would be hard to teach yourself functional programming, but then I have never tried.
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