| Quote: |
| -- Muslims killed in stampede during ritual stoning of devil at Hajj pilgrimage in Saudi Arabia; Reuters reports at least 50 dead. |
| Quote: |
| -- At least 345 people killed in Hajj stampede, according to officials in Saudi Arabia. |
You just come home from a tiresome day at university and then the first thing you see in your mailbox is this coming from CNN breaking news. You turn on the television and *bam*, the same story but the death count even higher.
The death count is still rising according to the news and there has only been 3 hours between these 2 reports. Makes you wonder, why do muslims always have to come in the news in combination with death. Whether it is something having to do with terrorist attacks or even something "peaceful" like this, there are always massive amounts of people dying.Islam seems associated with death now, because that's all that is going on. Why can't the middle east be peaceful to each other? They're all extremists in my opinion, people who are completely blind and refuse to acknowledge others, people who think Islam should dominate the world - and it never will.
**See my other post below, this isn't a "true" opinion per se, but more of a general opinion shared by too many people brought on by news media. Again, look lower on this page for more information**
Last edited by Soulfire on Wed Jan 18, 2006 2:15 am; edited 1 time in total
Can't generalize. Believe me, zealots are just a minor part of the population, but sound like a really big part 'coz they yell louder than the rest of the people. Just like repugs! Funny thing huh?
| Soulfire wrote: |
| Islam seems associated with death now, because that's all that is going on. Why can't the middle east be peaceful to each other? They're all extremists in my opinion, people who are completely blind and refuse to acknowledge others, people who think Islam should dominate the world - and it never will. |
I think human beings will always require antagonists to be all they can be, including all the worst parts of human nature, and they will always desire to be tested. And i think religion is a strong catalyst.
IMO there will never be any great time of peace, as long as religious beleifs continue to cause death.A tragic incident that could have been avoided. Anytime you mix religious emotion or euphoria with a crowd you will get this kind of result.
The most ridiculous thing about this, is that it was apparently caused by a few pilgrims tripping over bags left on the ground by the pilgrims in front of them. Why the heck are these people allowed to take their bags into a crowd of this size, performing a ritual of this kind?
Better crowd control and more information is the key. I work at an international airport, and I see hundreds of muslims leaving on hajj every day. They are met by volunteers who assist them. Why don't these people inform the pilgrims of the procedures and hand out a do and dont list? Why doesn't the Saudi government issue warnings and penalties with travel documents?
The real problem is that each person is intent on doing his own thing and doesn't care about the rest. This goes against the teachings of any peaceful religion. As long as that continues, such tragedies will continue to occur.
| Soulfire wrote: |
| Islam seems associated with death now, because that's all that is going on. Why can't the middle east be peaceful to each other? They're all extremists in my opinion, people who are completely blind and refuse to acknowledge others, people who think Islam should dominate the world - and it never will. |
That's absurd and ignorant to think that. Just because what's being publicized is mostly negativity from the middle east, does not mean that "they're all extremist... who are completely blind and refuse to acknowledge others". There are people there who are trying to make a difference, there are people who choose to live their lives peacefully and not get involved. Just because someone is born in a certain enviorment, in no way means they are destined to act a certain way, which in my opinion seems to be what you're saying. It's just that the people who are making differences, the women who are trying to start schools for young girls, the men who are fighing for their families' rights are not being recognized in the media, because that of course, is boring. Especially when we can see bloodshed and think that they are savages while we are the great white hope. Simple absurdity.
Edited: I just realized that some of this came out harsher than I meant it to - it's not my intention. 
I'd change but... I'm lazy.When the Thread Said muslims Killed , i knew the target of this discussion will be islam soon ,
@Soulfire
ur point of veiw is totally wrong , i live in a muslim country and i am christain , although there are a lot of negative things here , but it is still not what u said , even muslims have family and children , who they love and care for ,
Terrorists dont have any religions , if they say they work for islam , then we are stupid to beleave them , terrorists already brought shame on islam , now all muslims are suffering humilation cuz these terrorists ,
but i am happy atleast in india people are not like this ,
My parents are there. And when the news was broadcasted all around my family had a sleepless night till we finally got their phone call.
totally agree with Devil. I have many muslim friends, from all over middle east, and they are mostly decent people:) I say mostly, cuz some of them are pretty weird, but aren't we all? that has nothing to do with Islam...
Islam is meant to be peaceful, belive it or not, and those extremists are not true orthodox muslims. We really are wrong to judge the whole religion because of it's abusers..The problem is that we don't hear much about all those good people, who make the world a better place...I guess that's not interesting enough for our big news companies
But we are to blame too, I mean look at hollywood and the size of the movie production that pictures violence, in oposite to the one that does not have any...And don't argue that "the good always wins..." cuz that's not the point. The point is that there is violence, and the reason it is there, is that we like to watch that kind of stuff...I really don't know why...
I'm sorry to have brought hollywood into this..
...but it just had to be done! 
| Devil wrote: |
When the Thread Said muslims Killed , i knew the target of this discussion will be islam soon ,
@Soulfire
ur point of veiw is totally wrong , i live in a muslim country and i am christain , although there are a lot of negative things here , but it is still not what u said , even muslims have family and children , who they love and care for ,
Terrorists dont have any religions , if they say they work for islam , then we are stupid to beleave them , terrorists already brought shame on islam , now all muslims are suffering humilation cuz these terrorists ,
but i am happy atleast in india people are not like this , |
A point of view cannot be wrong. And what I was really portraying was the thoughts and beliefs of too many people, brought on by the negative protrayal of the news media, whom by choice delivers only the negative side.
Do I really believe that?
No.
I'm not quite that ignorant.
But if terrorists aren't associated with Islam, then why do they kill in the name of Allah? And why are the "conditions to give up jihad" only when Islam dominates the world?
No, the whole religion isn't ruined by the terrorists, it's just up for scrutiny. Talk to most people, and they believe that all of Islam is terrorists and deaths.
I should've added that to my post, but I figured you would all enjoy flaming me. | Soulfire wrote: |
But if terrorists aren't associated with Islam, then why do they kill in the name of Allah?
|
Just like not all white people are asked to justify the works of something like the Ku Klux Klan likewise you can't expect regular people to justify the working of the minds of terrorists.
From where I come, we have been plagued by terrorism for decades, they just call it militancy. In name of religion or for land what difference it makes, in the end the innocents suffer.
