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Beam weapons, a new way of warfare?





Bondings
30-40 years ago, laser weapons used to be hot items in every science fiction movie and/or book. Since then, they slowly lost popularity and were never really used for warfare. However, beam weapons seem to be coming back and are apparantly almost ready for battle.
MSNBC News wrote:
Beam weapons almost ready for battle
LOS ALAMOS, N.M. - There is a new breed of weaponry fast approaching — and at the speed of light, no less. They are labeled "directed-energy weapons," and they may well signal a revolution in military hardware — perhaps more so than the atomic bomb.

Directed-energy weapons take the form of lasers, high-powered microwaves and particle beams. Their adoption for ground, air, sea, and space warfare depends not only on using the electromagnetic spectrum, but also upon favorable political and budgetary wavelengths too.



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10805240/?GT1=7538

That picture looks almost identical to screenshots from Command & Conquer, in my opinion.

Anyway, do you think that beam weapons are the weapons of the future and will revolutionize modern warfare?
ocalhoun
Of course they will. Just think, did the knights of the middle-ages scoff at the prospect of guns and cannons revelutionizing warfare?
Probably, but it happened.
Dark_Jedi06
It's only a matter of time before science-fiction is no longer fiction.

I'd have to say that that picture looks pretty awesome, in a deadly-forboding-cool kind of way, it's like I'm watching Star Wars. Razz

But yeah, this is a pretty big step into making our visions of the future a reality.
ocalhoun
It'll be interesting to see highly reflective tanks so as to be immune to light.
DarkMuffin
I don't think that 'beam' wepons will be used in the way that older science-fiction novels described them and here's why:

Lasers would have to be extremely high-powered and focused on a target for a long time to do any harm to that target. Think of magnifying the sun to burn leaves? (and ants, for the more violent side of us Wink) It's the same idea with a beam gun. You would have to have extreme amounts of electric power to run these machines.

But I do think that lasers or some other kind of 'Light Bomb' will be used to blind the enemy and then high-powered grenades will be launched from high-tech undertheradar aeroplanes.
shr3dd
Beam weapons in the incarnation shon here will not revolutionize warfare. It will spark a chain of reinvention of today's weaponry, however. As technology advances to help us communicate, it will also advance to help us kill each other. I think beams of energy would work for disabling a target's missle guiding systems, computers and warfare electronics of the like. I hope I live long enough to see some crazy sh*t that we come up with for weapons.
maclui
Non conventional weapons are a reality, some of them beta versions. In the near future a full reality. Yes I think a laser weapon will be succesful because it can also be a non-lethal arm which will be more easily accepted by people against war.
michael88
who have the modern hi-tech, who will win.
Ray Gravin
I did hear about all this awile back but I dont see it becoming a practical weapon anytime soon. Im personaly pretty non supportive of warefare in general. I believe that better deplomacy is were we should focus our efforts. Technologicly we have better things to do with our time and money as well. Dont get me wrong I believe there is a time and a place for war .... but only in self defense against a threat like say.... the nazi army. Even in that case the sole act of war doesnt seem right to me, only the act of eliminating such a threat to humanity in self defense.

I move that we follow a diffrent path towards super cool scifi weapons of war. Like that movie were in the future nations settled there disputes in an arena were two huge robots duked it out. Hey they did have lasers didnt they? I guess thats a step in the right direction sort of ? I wish i remembered the name of that movie now : ( anyway we should just work on making big semi huminod shaped robots to fight each other with mono eh mono (SP?) but the idea of a fair one on one fight between humans on a international level is as far fetched as the laser pistol idea : )
DX-Blog
There have already been tests with this in the past, like 3 years ago shooting down shells with laser turrets. The US army is or was working on laser technology along with Israel, don't know if they still do work together or not.

But well yeh, also laser weaponry in the form of guns is being produced, currently the thing is like 40kg and over a meter long, but it can fire a laser.

And unlike what DarkMuffin said, the laser which shoots down the shells does so instantly. Remember, you do not have to heat the entire thing to destroy it or anything, you're not microwaving it for dinner. If you heat only 1 part of a missile or so and enter the core the thing will just detonate cause of the heat. If you would lock on to certain parts of a tank, aircraft or whatever vehicle you would be able to either turn the thing of or let possibly onwoard missiles or such detonate.

There also was something written about what would happen when used on humans, although it wasn't tested yet or anything. But the description wasn't pleasent when I read it about 2 years ago Razz. Something about having the feeling of setting a blowtorch on your body would be something you'ld wish for at that moment instead of what would be happening to you Laughing.

For the article about laser weaponry taking down artillery shells you can check this article:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/2407807.stm

Couldn't find the article about the laser gun.
pjv
Technology is good but can also be deadly like this laser cannons. Maybe if they can also invent something that fires love not bullet nor laser or bomb, then it would be a good sign.
MWANGI
Yes I agree

http://www2.msstate.edu/~bac7/Public_Shared/BASE%20BITMAP.bmp
kawa
i suppose a government will never allow its secret weapons to be shown in public, so i can say that this photo is false...
Scimus
The US government may have its laws about showing off its technology but as far as i can remember, the technological advancement in the field of warfare is known all over the world as USA. Also, most of the latest developed arms by the US are known in a matter of a few Months, from date of release all over the world. That picture may or may not be a fake, but as far as i see it, it is possible that weapons using light will become the weapons of a latter world, but that world is not in the near future.

it could be a lot of time before we discover the true potential of LIGHT.
Smile
kawa
i dont say it is impossible to make laser weapons, i just say US goverment(not only us accually) wont let such pictures to be shown in public, i mean ; i dony believe U.S have a weapon like that coz,if U.S had they would not let that...
helk
I don't see why anyone would invent something so dumb.

Really, it's all about projectile weapons. They would be doing more research into lighter more powerful PROJECTILE weapons.

And EMP, raising the efficiency of current fusion bombs, and any other stealth and infilitration technology.

that or either they are pouring there apparently prodigous budget into economic or information warfare.

dontcha think?

i mean, its just flashy crap.
Vrythramax
Beam type weapons are a fact and are currently in use today. Alot of prisons utilize a "Raygun", of sorts that projects a green beam of light that not only renders the victim incapacitated, it also has the pleasant side effect of causing vomiting.

I think that would much chill me out.
lukeropro
That tank is so cool! If there was such a weapon, the world will be a much dangerous place to live in. Such a weapon can only cause total destruction to the world eventually, if all the countries are in war. I seriously think that there should be peace on earth and weapons are no longer necessary, unless for alien attacks Razz But this weapon is so cool!
baronblod2003
Well, nuclear weapons can so to speak "get rid of" any problem....(Well, make it disepear at least).
But no one humar have the IQ to create a laser powerful enough to kill another.
They can't concentrate the light enough to burn thru more than a piece of paper, or to remove tatoos.

It is just possible...
Exclamation
forgeteden
That does look exactly like C&C generals.

I loved that game. Used to play it with my boyfriend until he dumped me.

Sad

So. This is my first post and I'm a bit confused about what exactly i'm supposed to do. But i guess i will just be myself.

Beam Warfare, i mean its bound to happen sooner or later. Technology has that way of getting in the way of the future.. To be poetic.

I'm just sad that we none of us will be alive to see space travel become something like the movies.
Phil
Incredible.
I remember going through basic training at the Infantry Training School at Fort Benning almost 20 years ago and being just scared to death (no pun intended) at the technology then. I realized then there are many ways to kill people.
One weapon that always stuck in my mind was the Russian Hind...the Russians where the bad guys back then and the Hind was the biggest, baddest attack helicopter at the time. At basic we where told it could it could "put a bullet every square foot in a 100 meter radius". Drill sargent always punctuated this statement with "hard to hide when you got that many rounds downrange". Then always came, "The life expectancy of the average soldier on the modern combat field is 6 seconds".
What amazes me is that that technology is pale compared to what is available today. And though I think that lasers and such are still quite a ways off from being conventional, just the fact they are being worked on is scarey.
And while all this science and technology is feverishly being worked on, you still have those who will just strap 50 pounds of TNT to themselves on set it off..... and those who will exploit such blind devotion.

“Wars may be fought with weapons, but they are won by men.” ......Gen. George S. Patton, 3rd US Army
phx777
erm, projectiles are just more deadly,.... beam weapons are like.... even if they ever will be in use i dont think projectiles and explosives will go out, and they certainly wount look like in movies and games, cause you dont really see a beam Razz it will look way less pretty and way more horible.... something just burning and going to hell without much effects to see Razz

PS: oc it looks like command and conquer, its 3d render, and all the lovers of beams and all (im a star wars fan too) lets remember that frying people up isnt really about gaming and movies... and that beam weapons wount be entertaining....
SunburnedCactus
Laser weapons which can blind infantry are currently banned by the Geneva Convention, although I see the US military are planning to use weak beams to "dazzle" ground troops with RPGs etc.
lockwolf
All right! Now I can go on a laser rampage at my school! NOBODY WILL STOP ME!
baronblod2003
forgeteden wrote:
That does look exactly like C&C generals.

I loved that game. Used to play it with my boyfriend until he dumped me.

Sad

So. This is my first post and I'm a bit confused about what exactly i'm supposed to do. But i guess i will just be myself.

Beam Warfare, i mean its bound to happen sooner or later. Technology has that way of getting in the way of the future.. To be poetic.

I'm just sad that we none of us will be alive to see space travel become something like the movies.


So you like C & C Generals?

I have C&C 1, C&C - Eagle Red and C&C Generals
bassgs_17
That's scary... It reminds me of a science fiction move come true!
-Aquastrike
AG007
See the thing on laser or beam weapons on the past is that the weapons when fire were slow and you could see the little ray of light passing by you. Can you see bullets?

My thougth on the beam weapons is that they will be powerfull, faster than a bullet and can penetrate anything. That was not the case back then.
bliushift
even if the picture is false, there have been a lot of reports of laser weaponry. Currently, the only weapons that are accessible (post production) for the military resemble big shotguns where the laser is housed in the barrel. The weapon is only meant to blind, however, similar to a flashbang but only directed.
helk
Set phasers to STUN!

Cool i want one.
Link to phaser replica Laughing
http://filmforce.ign.com/articles/492/492639p1.html
polarBear
Although the whole concept of phasing, directed light weapons is nice, with current laser technology it would require an energy source so huge that it wouldn't be practical. There's more future for a strangelets generator to be used as a weapon than this, though it poses some WAY wackier downsides, like the certainty of eventually destroying -literally-the whole universe with just one use. Other nice weapon would be particle accelerators, but they don't come on pocket sizes.

OMG, sorry for the deviation. Before the sci-fi ranting I was writing about the energy source of such a weapon.

Current lasers cut not because of impact but because of overheating. It's not like they don't work (cutting a 2in height vanadium steel piece in less that 30 seconds is just fine for me), but it takes a GREAT energy consumption to do it, for a quite long time if compared to a shotgun -where no real energy input is needed aside from pulling the trigger-. If you would want, say, a tank to use a CO2 laser effectively, it would need some four trucks of fuel and a HUGE engine to generate the power to cut another tank in two pieces, and it would take so much time that the target would probably flee or shoot back before being destroyed.
a.han
Its the directed microwaves that scare me more than the lasers. Directing a microwave at someone could potentially boil them from the inside out.

Pretty dark.
bewald
Beam weapons seem like they would be extremely expensive. They could save money because of no ammunition to buy, but there are just so many things to think about...

What about the safety of the person operating the beam? Lasers and xrays aren't very safe for people to operate....

I think that there isn't much understood about the technology, but also think that lasers seem really dangerous, and while i'd love the USA to have them, and be able to beat everyone else, but I would hate for lasers to be used against us.
atomictoyz
polarBear wrote:
it would require an energy source so huge that it wouldn't be practical.
For the most part yes. The platforms for these weapons are not jeeps or backpacks. Think big, costly and think in terms of 190Kvw as the ballpark of what it takes just to power it. Then think about EM interference with targeting systems, backscatter and cooling.


Peace,
Atomic
DX-Blog
100 years ago the current tanks would have required energy sources as big as a football field as well. Times change and energy resources become smaller and smaller.

In example think of nuclear submarines, their energy resource is pretty small in comparrison to how long they can stay under. Although it is not precisely known on how long, the guess is over half a year at minimum. That's a pretty damn long time and if you would do that on conventional fuel sources you would need an extreme amount in order to produce the same amount of energy.

In 100 years or so we'll be in a next stage of technology for sure, an age in which we would be capable of getting the required amounts of energy out of minor sources. Something which you just have to wait for to see it happen.
Bookface
Does anyone remember anything about how "they" were coming up with directed sound waves as a weapon?

As I remember it, basically the sound would be so intense you would be in pain... but I don't really remember the details.
psycosquirrel
I think waves of different sorts would be excellent weapons, especially microwaves. Not only do they totally mess up electronics, but they would force the enemy to take cover...
Amadeus
Bookface wrote:
Does anyone remember anything about how "they" were coming up with directed sound waves as a weapon?

As I remember it, basically the sound would be so intense you would be in pain... but I don't really remember the details.


I remember what you are talking about - it was all over the news a couple of years back. However, it was a typical example of the mouth engaging before the brain has thought about it. Spokespeople for various government and military thinking stations intentionally leaked information to semi-tabloid publications (which easily and quickly made its way to serious news routes) that the technology to which you refer was in the late-development stages.

Turns out it was a scam to affect some other operation somewhere and the whole thing was a bluff. Whoever was fooled by it, 'though, was exactly that - foolish: There is not enough power on all of Earth to generate sound waves that would be effective enough to cause lethal damage to human bodies!
DX-Blog
You could cause pain though with high frequency sounds and especially when produced at a high dB. The problem just is, every single person hears things differently so the amount of required dB and frequency would differ per person to cause seviere pain. So as weaponry it would be impossible to use.

As torture method on the other hand Wink.
Amadeus
DX-Blog wrote:
You could cause pain though with high frequency sounds and especially when produced at a high dB. The problem just is, every single person hears things differently so the amount of required dB and frequency would differ per person to cause seviere pain. So as weaponry it would be impossible to use.

As torture method on the other hand Wink.


I'm sorry - but you can only cause pain through high frequency and dB to someone via their ears! In that sense - yes you could torture someone and maybe eventually kill them, but it would be a fairly boring way to torture someone - they would go deaf long before they would die! The power required to reach frequencies high enough to cause lethal damage to masses of people/soldiers (ie - on the battlefield) is far too great.
polarBear
As a matter of facts, some tens of thousands dB would burn your skin, so it won't matter if you're deaf, blind or having a spare cromosome. What actually is of importance here is the megaJoules you receive.
maosite
i wont admiral when the army use laser weapons. nowaday, the technology is approaching to step over the board of the physics. Its imaginable, the army will use laser weapons or other modern weapons, which can adjusticate who will win the wars, who had better and more modern weapons, and who had no. it will be the adjusticater thing, not the strength of the soldiers. i think..
funkjunky
I reckon you the real probelm most people have with beam weapons is the face that they require huge amounts of energy to do there job.

this is true but couldn't you store the energy in capacitor "bullets" and fire a capacitor at a time discharging a massive pulse of the laser like happens in films and computer games?

that would be sweet, they should film space war if we have war in space, it would look sweet.
DX-Blog
Amadeus wrote:
DX-Blog wrote:
You could cause pain though with high frequency sounds and especially when produced at a high dB. The problem just is, every single person hears things differently so the amount of required dB and frequency would differ per person to cause seviere pain. So as weaponry it would be impossible to use.

As torture method on the other hand Wink.


I'm sorry - but you can only cause pain through high frequency and dB to someone via their ears! In that sense - yes you could torture someone and maybe eventually kill them, but it would be a fairly boring way to torture someone - they would go deaf long before they would die! The power required to reach frequencies high enough to cause lethal damage to masses of people/soldiers (ie - on the battlefield) is far too great.

Yeh, that's what I meant. That's why I said as tortute method. Most likely killing them through it won't be that much "eventually". Loud sounds of extreme frequency can cause extreme amounts of pain. Pain can be lethal by itself aswell. The body is not made to withstand continuous pain and could result in problems elsewhere, in example your heart could stop beating. So you won't kill them directly through sound waves, but indirectly it would be a farfetched possibility.


@polarBear: Theoretically yes, but producing those amounts of dB is just impossible.
helk
Wasn't it interesting (TERRIBLE - but interesting) when the US army used depleted uranium bullets?! They were, as a projectile, something fierce!

Being heavier than lead, they would burst into flames due to the air friction, and upon hitting something hard shatter radioactive, blistering hot shards of uranium death on people.

But my point is, don't you think they would just improve the guns and ammunition that is the most efficient method of attack? Wouldn't that research be going ten times faster and further (and probably more cost effectively) than stuff that is basically a BACK UP weapon?

Where's the media info on all that new stuff?
phx777
i really think its kinda not cool to discuss laser weaponry for military purposes as cool, as it really doesent have anything to do with fun and command and conquer Razz wanna see lasers? go to a party =D nothing better then that provided by laser technology =D really cool Razz

btw maybe infrantry will start carrying mirror shields Razz (let me remind you of yet another very weak point of lasers,... yes, theyre deflectable)
Amadeus
polarBear wrote:
As a matter of facts, some tens of thousands dB would burn your skin, so it won't matter if you're deaf, blind or having a spare cromosome. What actually is of importance here is the megaJoules you receive.
& as I said earlier, the amount of power required for that many decibels is too high for the battlefield! It is just too impractical - best to go back to debating the lasers!
knowledge
We are using laser technology in our weapons for guidance and the most important point that we are using direct energy to destroy stones in human body which is known as "laser treatment in medical science".
I think soon we will see the demonstration of this technology.
Scimus
Well i actually think that of all the governments, The U.S. govt. will be the first to show off its technology. I think many people would agree.
The whole world knows that US is working on the F-22 Raptor, EVEN before it has been released. That is definitely proof to show what US is capable of.

But if it is with regard to general govt. then I really can't say, i guess i'd agree that other govt would not post it. But this could be an experimental model to demonstrate or advertise in the arms race.

But frankly i don;t think we should twist the beauty and simplicity of light to the dreaded form of WEAPONS , cos weapons dont serve any purppose, and we justify our means to continue making weapons as ""Self - Defence"", now that is ridiculous.
Kazingbing
sounds cool, but Nuclear probabibly will kill more, beam is close-range
thiamshui
sounds bad.. technology has evolved n man is using it not to help themselves and other fellow organisms on earth but to cause harm..
DX-Blog
thiamshui wrote:
sounds bad.. technology has evolved n man is using it not to help themselves and other fellow organisms on earth but to cause harm..

When you look at technological advanses in the past you can see that a lot of this has come because of war. War after all is something for which you will need the best of the best in order to survive.

In example if you look at modern day technology:
GPS, a product of the US military which is now being used by a lot of other applications.
The internet, the first versions of something similar were used by the army.
Mobile phones, even those, the first were used by the army in forms of sattelite phones and such.


But not only have products been fully come out of wars as new things, war have also improved certain things in a much higher rate, like computers, airplanes, etc. But these still are just things of this century, in past centuries there is even more.



But this technology, which at first is part of something causing harm isn't the most deadliest form of making advancements. The "best" in causing death for it's own good is the medical branch, which in war has caused a lot of death for tests. Most of this always went behind closed doors till it was reveiled years or hundreds of years later, but it's a fact that it did happen. Like performing section on living human beigns, etc. As far is known the last time this has happened on a major scale was during WWII.

We have learned a lot from this though and thousands, perhaps even tens of thousands in some cases, lives are being saved on a yearly basis for certain diseases, medical problems, etc. because of research like this.



Although technological advancements can't truly directly be seen as "lifesavers" like that in the end, imagine where we would be without? If there would have been no need for getting better defenses and such because there was no war then people would have sticked to their every day lifestyle and most likely we would have had the same technology as the people did in 1200 or so and what we would have now wouldn't have come till at a far later point in time.
atomictoyz
polarBear wrote:
As a matter of facts, some tens of thousands dB would burn your skin, so it won't matter if you're deaf, blind or having a spare cromosome. What actually is of importance here is the megaJoules you receive.


The skin burning actually comes after your internal organs get cooked, if you live long enough through that the burnt skin won't hurt that bad...relatively speaking Smile

The Navy called and said, the weapons are to large for helmets let alone Dolphins Smile... The Lasers have been working fine Smile


Peace,
Atomic
Jewel Cubed
it seems to me like we would certainly have the technology for such an advancement.

I can just picture what comes after that.

Lightsabers, maybe?

But once we came up with it, the enemy would probably start making a similar technology as well, and then we'd be right back at the point we are now.

We have a gun.

Enemy has a gun.


We have a beam.

Enemy has a beam.

If it could destroy their tanks and aircraft better, They could destroy our tanks and aircraft better.

Do you see what I'm saying here?
Jazz
Jewel Cubed wrote:
We have a gun.

Enemy has a gun.


We have a beam.

Enemy has a beam.

If it could destroy their tanks and aircraft better, They could destroy our tanks and aircraft better.

Do you see what I'm saying here?


Yes i see what you are talking about, but if they managed to find a source to power an extremely powerful weapon that can only be found in their area they might ( i am only saying might) be able to keep it to themselves.

And about the lightsabers how would they be able to contain a beam so accurately that the beam didnt shoot off somewhere else, but can let out a little bit of the harnessed power to be able to cut the enemy, and also reflect bullets ( that would be a sight!). I think you are going over to Science Fiction now as in Star Wars and according to all logical proof the odds are that it will never happen.

Going on to the other point of this topic, directing a microwave could be a hazard to the enemy but it would also be a hazard to all of your army which would not be very good and if the enemy found a way to copy that weapon things could get pretty nasty so it would be best if they didnt use that weapon at all.

I hope this is clear enough to give you my full opinion.
DX-Blog
Jewel Cubed wrote:
it seems to me like we would certainly have the technology for such an advancement.

I can just picture what comes after that.

Lightsabers, maybe?

But once we came up with it, the enemy would probably start making a similar technology as well, and then we'd be right back at the point we are now.

If it could destroy their tanks and aircraft better, They could destroy our tanks and aircraft better.

Do you see what I'm saying here?

Why the hell would you start creating lightsabers? Currently the development of tanks and fighting planes which are computer controlled are already in progress. Soon wars will no longer have human soldiers involved with them, it'll just become a game of who has the most money to invest into technological advancements and mass production.




@Jazz: Creating a microwave beam would be a hazard? I dunno, but my doctor doesn't advice me artillery shells, grenades, bullets and laser beams either Razz.
xeroed
Dark_Jedi06 wrote:
It's only a matter of time before science-fiction is no longer fiction.

I'd have to say that that picture looks pretty awesome, in a deadly-forboding-cool kind of way, it's like I'm watching Star Wars. :P

But yeah, this is a pretty big step into making our visions of the future a reality.


well if you want to get technical most new inventions came from science fiction story like big screen TVs were from a science fiction book with wall sized TVs

its like insparation
pfrllc
There are some beam weapon technologies currently being tested in the U.S. which are being used primarily as a defensive technology. Though the concept of "Star Wars" never was truly accomplished, there was another method of defense against nuclear warheads using lasers that continued testing. This method used a modified Boeing 737 that carried a high-power laser in the nose cone. This laser was used to point directly at the nuclear missile and detonate it before Stage 2 was over, and the missile had reached space. This method was only applicable in Stage 1 or 2 because the laser had a specified range and could not reach space to catch the missile during Stage 3. During Stages 4 and 5 the missile is too far into victimized territories to not cause damage. This 737 that was equipped to test the technology was successfully flown out of an airbase near Boston, MA and knocked down a test missile.

As for the whole statement about light sabers, they are completely impossible to create, because the laser of the light saber could not be stopped at the endpoint of the saber. Even if a mirror was used to reflect the laser, the laser would then destroy the laser creating mechanism, and Anakin would be in pain.

Many of these new beam technologies can be employed in the field of combat, but when it comes to fighting, reconnaisance is one of the most important fields of battle. If one was to fire a beam weapon of some kind into the field, any reconnaisance person could be victimized by friendly fire. Personally, I prefer that war be advanced with focused sound technology, not lasers and microwaves that will create long, painful deaths. In any case, I am sure that no one would prefer war over peace, but war is a neccessity of the human race, as we are not perfect, so we disagree.
xeroed
Quote:
In any case, I am sure that no one would prefer war over peace, but war is a neccessity of the human race, as we are not perfect, so we disagree.


^^ its like agent smith from the matrix when he is talking to morpheous, humans don't accept things when all is peaceful we need our wars and distruction or else we think something is wrong
GDG
Hey guys have you ever noticed something and even in this article. I mean all these countries that are trying to abolish warfare and make peace across the world are also making teh tools that are used in war. I mean if you want to make peace a thing all across the globe than be a role model for everyone else.

Now I am not saying that making this stuff is bad, I mean for defence purposes OK!!! But why must you make it public and to the world, that only seems like a call to other countries bring it on!!!

But I don't know those are my ideas only.
Scimus
IT is interesting to see the way we justify the need for war. I found a post that says, half of our technical advancements were first used for war. Eg mobile phones, internet, etc.,.
Though this is alarmingly true, it does not mean that technology cannot advance without war - even you'd agree. In fact, i think, technology will advance faster if there were no war, because then more funds can be diverted to the technology sector.

But again there is no use if technology finds an excuse for man to war.
helk
It's interesting thought that if an inventor can get funding from the military, their technology is likely to become practical much quicker.

Like for example the un-manned tuareg that won the race with the 2million research prize + military contract.

Does civilian + corporate research get us better tech? Or is it mostly from miliatry research?
ben8coast
As far as I know one of the biggest issue with the development of beam weapons is the development of enough energy to drive them.

This is of particular importance in terms of portable weapons - its not really practical to travel always connected to a power source.

As cold fusion still hasn't been developed, batteries are good but not great I think beam weapons are a fair way off.
joeysicily
I thought lasers were already in the star wars projec that ronald regan was set out to do. I might be wrong, but i thought it was supposed to blew up incoming missles from space with a laser.. any thoughts?? do they have that up?
Treemo
seriously doubt it
pfrllc
As I said in a previous post, there is a method of defense using laser weaponry against nuclear missiles. This method has been tested and is successful, but it has not been completely cleared as a military project.

Another post talked about the "Star Wars" program launched by Ronald Reagan. The "Star Wars" program was completely dumped by, I believe, Bill Clinton. This program actually consisted of creating space stations that would have onboard lasers to destroy the nuclear missile in Stage 3. The program never got developed enough for this, so it was dumped. The technology was being developed for this, but the plans were completely cancelled by President Clinton to realign funds to other places. This is one of the reasons that I believe Clinton was detrimental to the development of defenses, and was one of the primary contributors to September 11th and the whole War on Terror. He did not continue with "Star Wars", he didn't capture Osama Bin Laden when he had the chance, and he never did anything with the defense programs of the United States.
bkatz
wow, very cool...I wonder if it will be as strong as shells/missles/bullets? Razz
hanay
I think that beam weapons are good and bad.

The good side is that the damages caused by a beam weapon to flesh would almost be irrepairable cause you can't mend what's been decintigrated...

The bad side is that light has 3 main characteristics. It can be reflected (like a laser on a mirror), it can be absorbed (like a flashlight on a wall), or it can pass right through stuff (such as an x-ray). The only way that light could do any damage is if it was absorbed. Now a 1 out of 3 ratio is pretty bad.
Download
DX-Blog wrote:
There have already been tests with this in the past, like 3 years ago shooting down shells with laser turrets. The US army is or was working on laser technology along with Israel, don't know if they still do work together or not.

But well yeh, also laser weaponry in the form of guns is being produced, currently the thing is like 40kg and over a meter long, but it can fire a laser.

And unlike what DarkMuffin said, the laser which shoots down the shells does so instantly. Remember, you do not have to heat the entire thing to destroy it or anything, you're not microwaving it for dinner. If you heat only 1 part of a missile or so and enter the core the thing will just detonate cause of the heat. If you would lock on to certain parts of a tank, aircraft or whatever vehicle you would be able to either turn the thing of or let possibly onwoard missiles or such detonate.

There also was something written about what would happen when used on humans, although it wasn't tested yet or anything. But the description wasn't pleasent when I read it about 2 years ago Razz. Something about having the feeling of setting a blowtorch on your body would be something you'ld wish for at that moment instead of what would be happening to you Laughing.

For the article about laser weaponry taking down artillery shells you can check this article:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/2407807.stm

Couldn't find the article about the laser gun.


I think its pshyco all those guns :p
But it proofs that the world is in big changes :d

Beeing serverd my robots OWNZ :p
nopaniers
Another post talked about the "Star Wars" program launched by Ronald Reagan. The "Star Wars" program was completely dumped by, I believe, Bill Clinton. This program actually consisted of creating space stations that would have onboard lasers to destroy the nuclear missile in Stage 3. The program never got developed enough for this, so it was dumped.


In fact, it was dumped because it is an unrealistic waste of money. The practical considerations of keeping a laser beam columated over such large distances make it completely impractical. Contrary to popular fiction, laser beams have a waist (which depends on the size of the cavity which you use to amplify the light), and the beam expands as the beam travels away from the laser. This, coupled with the tremendous power requirements, means that by the time it intercepts a missile it is too weak to shoot down anything.

IMHO programs of this type are flawed anyway. Real security comes from co-operation and peace, not from bombs and guns. Building more and more weapons just means that everybody else builds more and more weapons, WW1 style. The vast amounts ($500 billion per year) spent on the US military building guns dwarf any spending on peaceful efforts at cooperation, such as aid, education, disaster relief, contributions to the WHO or funding for children. Funding these programs leads to real peace. Building more and more bombs just leads to more wars.
superphysics
Well, these beam weapons actually exist. They have been, and are being, tested by the United States as an anit-missile system. To be precise, they are called rail-guns, and are basically high power lasers. But they suck huge amount of power and need to be mounted on something that can supply them wth the Volts (like converted Jumbo Jets).
atomictoyz
pfrllc wrote:
This method used a modified Boeing 737 that carried a high-power laser in the nose cone.


747 would be the model you meant to type Wink

ABL

Peace,
Atomic
summer-sensation
Isn't it a bit scary knowing that our government hides certain things from us citizens? I mean, of course they're not going to tell us Confedential stuff. But still!

I mean... we have all those movies about "Top Secret" stuff, Area 51... You canonly wonder what the heck we're working on now.
42mart2
baronblod2003 wrote:
Well, nuclear weapons can so to speak "get rid of" any problem....(Well, make it disepear at least).
But no one humar have the IQ to create a laser powerful enough to kill another.
They can't concentrate the light enough to burn thru more than a piece of paper, or to remove tatoos.

It is just possible...
Exclamation



I pretty much agree with you, there is no way they can create enough power!
Danny666
I read that be a laser weapon this weapon be used again a people an when it shoot the enemy feel like he is warming in a hot cofe and when is the gun off an enemy is all right thats very good Razz Razz
DX-Blog
Danny666 wrote:
I read that be a laser weapon this weapon be used again a people an when it shoot the enemy feel like he is warming in a hot cofe and when is the gun off an enemy is all right thats very good Razz Razz

Feeling all warm then you would be shooting at him with a beam of infra red or something, basically create a heating light. Even that isn't to good for the person. If you heat a person up to much no matter what you might not cause burn marks on the skin, but you will cause damage on a cellular level. Might not sound to bad at first, but you could think of it as during fever, if it gets to high it's deadly after all.
lordcody
Yea gods you people are dumb!

the military are no way even able to bring lazers into battle.

does anyone here know how much power is neede to maintain a 1 inch thick lazer beam for 5 seconds? its 500 megawatts!

and any way who cares?
bassgs_17
I never considered the sheer amount of energy needed to create such a beam, but my question is, how would they effectively produce such a charge? Wouldn't they need some kind of small nuclear reactor, like those on a submarine, to power it? I can see the military carrying a two ton Rayovac batter to power it, and it makes me laugh.

All hail the laser rampage!
-Aquastrike
polarBear
Three of this

full of gelinite or something similar per minute of activity (per unit)would probably be enough to burn a 3 feet wide hole across a building...

If you don't put a gamma downlink on top of the device and send all the energy to it, it's quite like using a giant battery Smile
ashok
polarBear wrote:
Although the whole concept of phasing, directed light weapons is nice, with current laser technology it would require an energy source so huge that it wouldn't be practical.


yes me too hav the same opinion Very Happy
ashok
polarBear wrote:
Although the whole concept of phasing, directed light weapons is nice, with current laser technology it would require an energy source so huge that it wouldn't be practical.


yes me too hav the same opinion Very Happy
ocalhoun
Reminds me, I've been slacking with my designs for my particle accelerator cannon...

It would accelerate two round shots (to counterbalance themselves and negate any vibration) in a centrifuge-like device with extremely powerfull electromagnets. Once the shots reach their maximum velocity (hopefully near the speed of light) they are released in the direction of your enimies.
Absolutely nothing could withstand that kind of firepower.
Ressurrector
While were at it can we get some photon torpedoes too? And a romulan cloaking device would be a nice touch.
pfrllc
42mart2 wrote:
baronblod2003 wrote:
Well, nuclear weapons can so to speak "get rid of" any problem....(Well, make it disepear at least).
But no one humar have the IQ to create a laser powerful enough to kill another.
They can't concentrate the light enough to burn thru more than a piece of paper, or to remove tatoos.

It is just possible...
Exclamation



I pretty much agree with you, there is no way they can create enough power!


This is a pathetically idiotic comment especially because there are lasers already in common production that cut materials such as Titanium. If something can cut through Titanium, then it surely can cut through a human.
Another idea I saw as I was looking at the responses talked about making a particle accelerator cannon of some kind. The reference to reaching "hopefully near the speed of light" is a completely impossible concept in this modern day. We have not reached even the slightest fraction of the speed of light in accelerating particles, so we cannot have the slightest hope of getting particles near the speed of light. If we could do this, we would have the ability to detect particles at the speed of light and may be able to capture the quarks during fission, and that, ultimately, would lead to the discovery of cold fusion. We have not advanced to this point in technology, so try to be realistic in your wishes.

Another truth pointed out in this topic was that beam weapons can be reflected, which can lead to devastation. I agree that this can happen, so I say that beam weapons should not be used for agression, but for defensive purposes, as they may bring destruction by friendly fire if the opposition is smart enough. These purposes of defense should not incorporate use in battle, but use to diminish or destroy threats such as missiles, ballistic and cruise. As long as they are not able to be reflected back onto themselves, the beam weapons could prove to be a very successful class of weaponry.
zapdude
What the, What the hell, is that picture real or what?
It may just be real, althogh behind close doors you don't know what's gonig on.
COTC
About.. ohh.. 6 years ago, as I was sitting in astronomy class, I was reading an article where they slowed the speed of light down to 36mph and said that with a little more work, they can slow it down to a crawl. As a theatre lighting designer, I am ecstatic! The things I could do. But... if you can slow it down that much, then what's to stop someone from 'pouring' light into a completely sealed container, prepared for deployment? When there is a mass release of light, there is a mass release of heat.
COTC
zapdude wrote:
What the, What the hell, is that picture real or what?
It may just be real, althogh behind close doors you don't know what's gonig on.


Quoted from the caption:


A laser fires from space toward Earth in this artistic rendering. The Air Force Research Laboratory’s Directed Energy Directorate is conducting research in a wide variety of laser weapons technologies. INTERACTIVE


• Combat in the cosmos
The militarization of space
COTC
42mart2 wrote:
baronblod2003 wrote:
Well, nuclear weapons can so to speak "get rid of" any problem....(Well, make it disepear at least).
But no one humar have the IQ to create a laser powerful enough to kill another.
They can't concentrate the light enough to burn thru more than a piece of paper, or to remove tatoos.

It is just possible...
Exclamation



I pretty much agree with you, there is no way they can create enough power!


Don't forget that microwave is 'light'.
You can tear apart your microwave, take the magnatron out, properly install it to any satellite TV dish, add a power supply, and >POOF< you have a microwave beam emitter capable of burning through any flesh. All they would need to do is create a shielding which shouldn't be too difficult, a lead film on the backside of the dish, proper armor with a lead film, and you have yourself a ray-o-death.
xalophus
lordcody wrote:
Yea gods you people are dumb!

Yes, I agree.
People here are just so dumb.
Here, I'll prove it -

lordcody wrote:
does anyone here know how much power is neede to maintain a 1 inch thick lazer beam for 5 seconds? its 500 megawatts!

Did you know that power is a function of time ?
Did you know that the power needed to maintain a 1 inch laser beam is independent of the time duration that it's maintained for ?
Did you know that 500 megawatts x 5 seconds is actually a measure of energy and not power ?

Did you know that "lazer" is actually spelt with a "s" in place of the "z" ?

Did you know that it's not "its" - it's "it's" ?

People are just so dumb.

lordcody wrote:
the military are no way even able to bring lazers into battle.

"Only birds and bugs can fly"

There always are skepctics.
But that has stopped neither the scientific advances nor their use for military purposes.

lordcody wrote:
and any way who cares?

Lucky for us - You do.
polarBear
what about using particle beams? It's a technollogy pretty well know so far -first experiment on this topic was done around 1999-, with real problems when you try to deflect it -problems like having a mass at near-light speeds for instance-. It still needs a huge energy source, but it's quite more effective and less prone to friendly fire
atomictoyz
The Particle beams are really cool up until the particles start splitting other airborne molecules in the line of sight. I have a friend who worked on a thing called FEL. The company I work for used to own and operate a research program that had a FEL lab. Not exactly a safe job.

Peace,
Atomic
zplitstonez
Technology is going to develop and develop many advance, and sophisticated gadgets will continue to evolve, we are now at the end times, terrorism is very popular, many killings, earthquakes, tsunami's, tornado's all of these are already written in the bible. We can not escape it, but don't lose hope there is one more way to escape the third world war. And that is to serve and Love GOD, and most of all, Repent and be baptize everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ..this quote is found in the bible on ACTS 2:38.
pfrllc
One problem with that, what if GOD isn't the real God. I'm a Catholic, but I still believe that God could be Allah who could be Yahweh, so any faith could be correct. Political correctness comes into play in many ways, so please don't refer to your own faith because it discriminates in the slightest ways.

Another post talked about slowing down the speed of light, but the speed of light as we know it is a scientific constant (299,792,458 m/s), so any slowing down of the speed of light does not matter. The previous post that refered to accelerating something to near the speed of light would be attempting to accelerate that thing to less than or equal to 299,792,458 m/s, which does not encompass the slowing of the speed of light. If you had refered to the context of this post, you would have noticed that the speed of light was refered to as a constant, so please read more carefully next time.
Lennon
Seems like we'll have laser-powered cookers, blowtorches, hair trimmers, toe clippers, laser-powerd scissors, laser powered knives, where the laser is fired right through the target...

imagine a toy pellet-gun which fires tiny pulses of laser which are really irritating and annoying but totally non-lethal.
ck88
They do exist, just not in Tanks. I am not sure the the information about energie consumption and generation displayed here is still current.
I have seen ground based and airborn Laser weapons for Ballistic Missile Defense tested and functional in White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico.
Geneva convention is certainly not a concern with this application and propelled amunition no alternative.
So wake up, they are here. Although personal weapons for the trooper might still take some time to be feasable.
Lied
A NASA exeriment about movement in space by laser.
For the exeriment it was used a superlight,heat resistant piece of fabric weight about 0.5gramms.It required to move 1MW Lazer.The instalation of this lazer was 1 cubic meter.
Do the math about penetrating.
decard cain
wow... laser tag gone extreme... maybe once the design is complete, the tanks and other vehicles could use lasers and the basic soldiers could be using say, plasma rifles?
anyway it'll probably be delta waves next lol
H2sniper
That would be freaking awesome!
Being able to like literally burn someone.......well nevermind.
Although you could just point the laser at their eyes and blind them!
That way you could like win a war like that couldn't you?
darknez3
Believe it or not, but I've read (reality) that about 20 years ago, russian scientists created a low frequency wave gun which shatters walls and creates bleeding without any actual visible contact.

This laser crap, will be without a doubt #2 of the dumbest ideas created with #1 being bullets. And this war paranoiea is a waste of money.
killj0y
'Tis true, besides I don't mean to insult you but this is all TOTALLY pointless, look at the bigger picture, a little excercise in lateral thinking for you all: the worlds power supplies are slowly but surely dwindling.
That means that we will not be able to USE any of these weapons because the power demand will simply be too large...
We may now have them, are using them etc... but the reality is that they will probably never be incorporated into any kind of assault rifle, tank etc.. because of the fact that:
a) the power unit/supply would be too big to carry
b) you have to incorporate the energy usage of all other auxiliaries includeing targeting systems because lasers are all about that kind of thing seeing as its concentration in order to be most effective would amount to a beam as thick as a pin therefore requiring huge accuracy.
c) the power DEMAND itself would be nigh impossible to achieve if the other 2 parameters cited above are fulfilled.
HoboPelican
Interesting stuff, I suppose. I can't help but wonder though. Look at how easily we knocked out Iraqs tanks with current tech. It was a turkey shoot. The current tech level is incredible, but I'd be more interested in hearing what they have in the works for the grunt operating in sits like Iraq, Afghanistan, Nam, etc. Sure we can knock out the infrastructure with our eyes closed, but it's controlling the cities, jungles, etc where small groups of insurgents are active is were I'd really like to see progress.
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