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Naruto, not really a TV show for english viewers, but still





Dragate
who likes naruto!? great manga and anime! great music too! for dl's go to http://www.realitylapse.com (for other anime and manga too) or http://www.narutopub.com naruto rocks!!! ;D
nakamaru
Yeah it does. Except for the CN version. The show has an AMASING storyline and great complicated characters and abilities but CN has chopped it and dubbed it into stupidity and idiocidy in order to please the Televison dubbed anime community. AKA:Douchebags.
Scaramanga
First, to the OP:
Quote:
b. Posts, avatars and signatures must not contain links to or ask for information on warez, crackz, etc. or re-print material without permission.

Man, Naruto is licensed and available on TV (and soon DVD.) If people WANT to watch the show/read the manga they should BUY it.

nakamaru wrote:
Yeah it does. Except for the CN version. The show has an AMASING storyline and great complicated characters and abilities but CN has chopped it and dubbed it into stupidity and idiocidy in order to please the Televison dubbed anime community. AKA:Douchebags.

What makes people who like their anime dubbed douchebags exactly? I don't know about you, but english is my first language (and probably as it is of MOST people who watch Cartoon Network,) and I can see quite a few people not wanting to have to read subtitles to enjoy a show. Also, CN edits a show for their own decency standards NOT because of dubbing issues. It's cool if you don't like dubs (I don't watch 'em much myself,) but you probably shouldn't call people douchebags based on how they enjoy their anime. And furthermore, what CN does with it's show is a far cry LESS than what companies like 4Kids do. If you don't LIKE dubs you can always BUY the show on DVD (where you have your choice of dubs OR subtitles.)

As for Naruto being a deep show, give me a break. It's a shonen fighting show akin to Dragon Ball. Sure it has SOME character development, but that's overshadowed by the amount of multi-epsiode fight-sequences and new "special attacks" added every few episodes. It's a fun show, to be sure, but don't make it out to be anything more than what it is. A stereotypical "I want to become stronger" fighting show.
mtoni
I like naruto and im glad that there are fansubbing groups that sub licensed series like naruto...

I live in the Netherlands and I don't have cartoonnetwork and it's pretty expensive to buy every episode (+ you can't be up to date)
Scaramanga
mtoni wrote:
I like naruto and im glad that there are fansubbing groups that sub licensed series like naruto...

I live in the Netherlands and I don't have cartoonnetwork and it's pretty expensive to buy every episode (+ you can't be up to date)

So wait, you're saying if you were poor it would be OK for you to steal? Man, saying it's expensive to buy every episode isn't an excuse for what is essentially THEFT. Anime is a luxury and a privilege, not a RIGHT. Also, every time one of you chuckleheads decides to download anime instead of buying the legit release you screw the companies who GIVE you the anime in the first place! The anime industry can't survive if people keep downloading their shows instead of paying for them live you're supposed to. Furthermore, anime is a fairly niche industry, it doesn't have the gigantic revenue of the film or music industry (and if they DID, I imagine you'd all be slapped with some lawsuits by now.)
nakamaru
Scaramanga wrote:
First, to the OP:
Quote:
b. Posts, avatars and signatures must not contain links to or ask for information on warez, crackz, etc. or re-print material without permission.

Man, Naruto is licensed and available on TV (and soon DVD.) If people WANT to watch the show/read the manga they should BUY it.

nakamaru wrote:
Yeah it does. Except for the CN version. The show has an AMASING storyline and great complicated characters and abilities but CN has chopped it and dubbed it into stupidity and idiocidy in order to please the Televison dubbed anime community. AKA:Douchebags.

What makes people who like their anime dubbed douchebags exactly? I don't know about you, but english is my first language (and probably as it is of MOST people who watch Cartoon Network,) and I can see quite a few people not wanting to have to read subtitles to enjoy a show. Also, CN edits a show for their own decency standards NOT because of dubbing issues. It's cool if you don't like dubs (I don't watch 'em much myself,) but you probably shouldn't call people douchebags based on how they enjoy their anime. And furthermore, what CN does with it's show is a far cry LESS than what companies like 4Kids do. If you don't LIKE dubs you can always BUY the show on DVD (where you have your choice of dubs OR subtitles.)

As for Naruto being a deep show, give me a break. It's a shonen fighting show akin to Dragon Ball. Sure it has SOME character development, but that's overshadowed by the amount of multi-epsiode fight-sequences and new "special attacks" added every few episodes. It's a fun show, to be sure, but don't make it out to be anything more than what it is. A stereotypical "I want to become stronger" fighting show.


You just proved my point about the douchebags by saying the show wasn't deep. Download some real naruto instead of watching your television chopped up intentionally for an audience 8 or younger.
nakamaru
Scaramanga wrote:
mtoni wrote:
I like naruto and im glad that there are fansubbing groups that sub licensed series like naruto...

I live in the Netherlands and I don't have cartoonnetwork and it's pretty expensive to buy every episode (+ you can't be up to date)

So wait, you're saying if you were poor it would be OK for you to steal? Man, saying it's expensive to buy every episode isn't an excuse for what is essentially THEFT. Anime is a luxury and a privilege, not a RIGHT. Also, every time one of you chuckleheads decides to download anime instead of buying the legit release you screw the companies who GIVE you the anime in the first place! The anime industry can't survive if people keep downloading their shows instead of paying for them live you're supposed to. Furthermore, anime is a fairly niche industry, it doesn't have the gigantic revenue of the film or music industry (and if they DID, I imagine you'd all be slapped with some lawsuits by now.)


Yes it can survive with downloading. Japan makes a shitload of money off of anime even without U.S. consumers. Excuse us intelligent people for prefering to see our anime in as close to a true form as possible without the annoying voices, deleted scenes, and lack of a realistic look. I actually sat down and watched naruto on CN the other day. It was INCREDIBLY horrible. The voice for naruto is total shit and the others...though fair can't hold a candle to the original. How can you speak pro-CN without seeing the show beforehand? I respect the dubbing on adult swim which is technically CN but a show like naruto should have ended up there rather than be made for such a young audience. It isn't a plotline they can grasp to any degree without making it into something completely different. I knew that my comment would just get you fanboy douches to proove your stupidity but you're taking the whole idiot act a little too far.
tsukiyuuki
The fact that the industry can survive the downloading doesn't make it right. The only time I download anime is when it isn't available in English any other way except for fansubs. Buying the Japanese DVDs would be useless to me because I A) can't speak enough Japanese to understand everything (but I do know that Naruto talks just plain weird) and B) don't have a multi-region DVD player. Once the anime I am/was downloading becomes available in English, I get rid of the downloaded episodes as they become available to buy. (And I buy them.)

And a note on the dubbing of Naruto-- it is generally decent, but Naruto's voice makes my brain bleed. My biggest beef with the North American version (because it does show on other channels than CN, and I want to be equal opportunity for all my fellow Canadians ^^ ) is what happened to Tsunami (Tazuna's duaghter and Inari's mother) in the Wave Country arc, when they were going to take her as a hostage and kill Inari. With two lines, they effectively destroyed her entire character. She was a well-rounded, strong female character, and they killed her.

Japanese version: "If you kill him I'll bite my tongue off and you won't have any hostages!"
English version: "Please don't hurt him! I'll do anything!" *whimperwhine*

*mourns the death of Awesome!Tsunami Crying or Very sad*


Scaramanga Arrow (OT- Awesome name! Do you have a golden gun? ^^ ) While I agree that Naruto is shounen and definitely a fighting show, I think I must disagree when you say it isn't deep at all and is just a stereotypical "I want to become stronger" show. I don't know how far into it you have seen/read, but I find it does have some very thought-provoking and deep themes in it. There's a lot about accepting yourself and others, and I find a major theme is what it means to have friends. The consequences of your actions and the actions of those around you, and staying true to yourself are other prominent themes. I mean, just compare Gaara and Naruto-- both born in very similar situtations, but they end up growing up with completely different personalities and values because of one small factor. Someone accepted and supported Naruto, and in turn got others to support and accept him, while Gaara was shunned and feared, and grew up entirely alone without support or friendship or acceptance in any form. (Until after the Chuunin exam, but that discussion is for another time. ^^)

If you disagree, though, that's fine, and I think we should agree to disagree. ^_^ Your opinion is entirely valid. Very Happy


nakamaru Arrow I think you're going a little far there in insulting everyone who happens to prefer dubbed anime. Some people don't like subtitles, or can't keep up with them, or they may have something like dyslexia, where reading subs could be quite difficult for them. Or they could just like to be able to watch their anime while focusing on the animation and not the yellow/white/whatever text at the bottom of the screen.

If anyone is being a douchebag here, it's you. You have no right to tell someone they can't watch dubbed anime, or that they shouldn't enjoy dubbed anime. You're being incredibley immature and quite rude and insulting. Just because you prefer to watch subbed anime doesn't mean everyone has to prefer watching subbed anime, and that's all there is to it.
Scaramanga
nakamaru wrote:
Scaramanga wrote:
First, to the OP:
Quote:
b. Posts, avatars and signatures must not contain links to or ask for information on warez, crackz, etc. or re-print material without permission.

Man, Naruto is licensed and available on TV (and soon DVD.) If people WANT to watch the show/read the manga they should BUY it.

nakamaru wrote:
Yeah it does. Except for the CN version. The show has an AMASING storyline and great complicated characters and abilities but CN has chopped it and dubbed it into stupidity and idiocidy in order to please the Televison dubbed anime community. AKA:Douchebags.

What makes people who like their anime dubbed douchebags exactly? I don't know about you, but english is my first language (and probably as it is of MOST people who watch Cartoon Network,) and I can see quite a few people not wanting to have to read subtitles to enjoy a show. Also, CN edits a show for their own decency standards NOT because of dubbing issues. It's cool if you don't like dubs (I don't watch 'em much myself,) but you probably shouldn't call people douchebags based on how they enjoy their anime. And furthermore, what CN does with it's show is a far cry LESS than what companies like 4Kids do. If you don't LIKE dubs you can always BUY the show on DVD (where you have your choice of dubs OR subtitles.)

As for Naruto being a deep show, give me a break. It's a shonen fighting show akin to Dragon Ball. Sure it has SOME character development, but that's overshadowed by the amount of multi-epsiode fight-sequences and new "special attacks" added every few episodes. It's a fun show, to be sure, but don't make it out to be anything more than what it is. A stereotypical "I want to become stronger" fighting show.

You just proved my point about the douchebags by saying the show wasn't deep. Download some real naruto instead of watching your television chopped up intentionally for an audience 8 or younger.

Uhhh dude, if you had even BOTHERED to read my whole post you would've seen that I don't generally watch anime DUBBED. I saw Naruto up through around eps 130 or so before it was licensed (at which point I stop watching because it's, you know, ILLEGAL.) I don't watch Cartoon Network or 4Kids for my anime, I like my shows to be generally more mature than the crap that gets shown on there (with the exception of some stuff they've shown on Adult Swim.) See, that's why I BUY the DVDs, so I can watch the shows uncut and unedited (in Japanese, with subtitles.)

nakamaru wrote:
Scaramanga wrote:
mtoni wrote:
I like naruto and im glad that there are fansubbing groups that sub licensed series like naruto...

I live in the Netherlands and I don't have cartoonnetwork and it's pretty expensive to buy every episode (+ you can't be up to date)

So wait, you're saying if you were poor it would be OK for you to steal? Man, saying it's expensive to buy every episode isn't an excuse for what is essentially THEFT. Anime is a luxury and a privilege, not a RIGHT. Also, every time one of you chuckleheads decides to download anime instead of buying the legit release you screw the companies who GIVE you the anime in the first place! The anime industry can't survive if people keep downloading their shows instead of paying for them live you're supposed to. Furthermore, anime is a fairly niche industry, it doesn't have the gigantic revenue of the film or music industry (and if they DID, I imagine you'd all be slapped with some lawsuits by now.)

Yes it can survive with downloading. Japan makes a shitload of money off of anime even without U.S. consumers.

Man what?!? I'm going to assume you are fairly young, because you obviously don't remember a day when there WEREN'T any digi/fansubs. And even when there were the shows were few and far between. Anime is ONLY this popular with people these days because of companies like ADV bringing these shows over to North America, and thus a much wider market than Japan alone could ever have. Also, I have news for you, the Japanese market has been steadily declining for years, and it is mainly because a lot of US licensors are picking up many more shows that a LOT of Japanese companies are able to stay afloat. Also, I happen to LIKE being able to buy DVDs and boxed sets and anime merchandise. What do you think would happen to that industry if North American companies were doing so poorly due to lost sales from people who illegally download licensed shows. I can pretty much guarantee that if the US side of the market to suddenly go under, there would be a LOT less series produced in Japan.

nakamaru wrote:

Excuse us intelligent people for prefering to see our anime in as close to a true form as possible without the annoying voices, deleted scenes, and lack of a realistic look.

Intelligent people BUY the DVDs, which have all of those things and more!

nakamaru wrote:

How can you speak pro-CN without seeing the show beforehand? I respect the dubbing on adult swim which is technically CN but a show like naruto should have ended up there rather than be made for such a young audience.

I'm pro-Cartoon Network?? What?!? Man I just said you shouldn't call people douchbags because of how they like to enjoy their anime. Also, I'd point out there are OTHER outlets besides CN for people to get quality anime from, such as G4TechTV, AnimeNetwork, oh yeah and again DVDs! I don't even watch CN except for the ocassional Adult Swim.

nakamaru wrote:

It isn't a plotline they can grasp to any degree without making it into something completely different. I knew that my comment would just get you fanboy douches to proove your stupidity but you're taking the whole idiot act a little too far.

Wait what?? Man Naruto's plotline is hard to grasp?!? Boy, I'd hate to see it if you watched any truly "deep" anime. "Boy with 'special powers' must grow stronger and fight bad guys to protect his friends and home." I think that's pretty much Naruto in a nutshell (as well as just about a CRAPTON of other fighting shounen shows.)

tsukiyuuki wrote:
While I agree that Naruto is shounen and definitely a fighting show, I think I must disagree when you say it isn't deep at all and is just a stereotypical "I want to become stronger" show. I don't know how far into it you have seen/read, but I find it does have some very thought-provoking and deep themes in it. There's a lot about accepting yourself and others, and I find a major theme is what it means to have friends. The consequences of your actions and the actions of those around you, and staying true to yourself are other prominent themes. I mean, just compare Gaara and Naruto-- both born in very similar situtations, but they end up growing up with completely different personalities and values because of one small factor. Someone accepted and supported Naruto, and in turn got others to support and accept him, while Gaara was shunned and feared, and grew up entirely alone without support or friendship or acceptance in any form. (Until after the Chuunin exam, but that discussion is for another time. ^^)

If you disagree, though, that's fine, and I think we should agree to disagree. ^_^ Your opinion is entirely valid. Very Happy

Here's the thing: I agree with every thing you raised about Naruto. However, I don't see that as making it a deep or thought provoking show (unless it's thought provoking to people that you should protect the ones you love.) People, I LIKE and enjoy Naruto. No where did I say it was a crappy series. I just didn't think it was that deep is all. But you know, sometimes it's OK to enjoy an anime that's just a FUN show.

tsukiyuuki wrote:
Scaramanga Arrow (OT- Awesome name! Do you have a golden gun? ^^ )

No, but I DO have a third nipple. Very Happy
tsukiyuuki
Quote:
No where did I say it was a crappy series. I just didn't think it was that deep is all. But you know, sometimes it's OK to enjoy an anime that's just a FUN show.


I wasn't trying to imply that you think it's a crappy series or anything, so if I offended you or anything I'm really sorry about that. ^^; *opens mouth, inserts foot*

Quote:
No, but I DO have a third nipple. Very Happy


Reeeeeeeeeeaaaaaally? *grin* Is it a suction cup? (I think I watch way too much Bond... but then again, there's no such thing as too much Bond! NEVER!)
Mushmush
Naruto? It's about this huy who tries to become a great ninja?
posessed by a demon fox If I remember right.
I have read some of the volumes.
Pretty cool manga Smile
nakamaru
I never said that people couldn't enjoy anime that was dubbed. All I was saying was that CN did a HORRIBLE job and people judge the series by that.

I also love how all of you guys stopped downloading because it was illegal when it came to the U.S. NEWSFLASH-It was just as illegal before. It's called international copyright.

At least Bleach hasn't reached the U.S. yet. Thank god.
tsukiyuuki
Quote:
I never said that people couldn't enjoy anime that was dubbed. All I was saying was that CN did a HORRIBLE job and people judge the series by that.


You called people douchebags for enjoying dubbed anime, which implies disgust for those that enjoy their anime dubbed.


Quote:
I also love how all of you guys stopped downloading because it was illegal when it came to the U.S. NEWSFLASH-It was just as illegal before. It's called international copyright.


Noone said that it wasn't illegal before; I imagine we all know what copyright is. The difference here is that I (to use myself as an example) was downloading because it wasn't possible for me to purchase the DVDs, etc., and I have now stopped downloading, because it is available here. I'm not even downloading the new episodes that aren't going to show here for at least three years.

I'm not saying me downloading is legal, but even when I was downloading, I was purchasing merchandise, even though I couldn't get the episodes, and now I am no longer downloading. I think everyone is probably aware of the legality issues with downloading fansubs, but there are some countries that don't recognise copyrights from other countries. I can't think of any specifically right now, but I know that several middle eastern countries didn't use to accept international copyright laws. They may now, of course, but I imagine there probably are a couple left.
Scaramanga
nakamaru wrote:
I also love how all of you guys stopped downloading because it was illegal when it came to the U.S. NEWSFLASH-It was just as illegal before. It's called international copyright.

The difference as I've pointed out already is that downloading a show that's NOT licensed here in the US doesn't hurt the US anime industry. Also, when it comes to Japanese shows, the anime industry there is completely different in as much as they are not as prone to cracking down on fan-produced materials of their shows (otherwise the doujinshi market in Japan wouldn't be the million dollar market it is.) Also, unlicensed fansubbing allows US licensors to estimate how popular a show is going to be. Do you think a company would've picked up Naruto (let alone paid the probably astronomical sums for licensing) if there hadn't been the huge whirlwind of fansubbing and discussions, websites and boards that resulted from said subs? Ethical fansubbers (groups that stop subbing once a show is licensed) don't make any money from their subs, they're not trying to do anything more than make people aware of the shows coming out of Japan. And hell if it weren't for that we'd NEVER see some shows (I wager the US will never see Kanon, Kimi ga Nozumo Eien and quite a few others.)

I'm sorry, I tend to get a little ranty about this subject, but people who insist on downloading shows that are licensed are doing NOTHING but undermining the very industry they claim to love.
tsukiyuuki
I agree wholeheartedly with Scaramanga. I like to think of this type of copyright violation as copyright violation with morals. ^_^

As long as it isn't licensed here, downloading something can do nothing but improve the North American (I don't want to specify US, since I'm Canadian ^^ ) anime industry but letting it be known that there /is/ a call for a certain show or movie or whatever.

*leaves to go order Hagaren DVDs*
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