http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/security_mexico_usa_dc;_ylt=AvL2Z5O8jZaDMCqajYJhEgms0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ
Mexican President Fox calls US plan to increase border security "disgraceful" and "shameful" and that it would violet MEXICANs rights.
| Quote: |
MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican President
Vicente Fox denounced as "disgraceful and shameful" on Wednesday a proposal to build a high-tech wall on the U.S.-Mexico border to stop illegal immigrants....
Fox, speaking in Tamaulipas state across the border from Texas, said such extreme security measures would violate immigrants' rights. |
Who the **** is he to say what we do with OUR borders? He just wants to make sure that the SECOND largest income in the country of Mexico, (illegals working in the US then sending money to Mexico) keeps flowing in.
Mexico to US: Open your Borders
US to Mexico: STFU! Shure thing. We have enough problems from legal immigration!
Build the wall!
(Minefields might also be an effective deterrent.)
| S3nd K3ys wrote: |
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/security_mexico_usa_dc;_ylt=AvL2Z5O8jZaDMCqajYJhEgms0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ
Mexican President Fox calls US plan to increase border security "disgraceful" and "shameful" and that it would violet MEXICANs rights.
| Quote: | MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican President
Vicente Fox denounced as "disgraceful and shameful" on Wednesday a proposal to build a high-tech wall on the U.S.-Mexico border to stop illegal immigrants....
Fox, speaking in Tamaulipas state across the border from Texas, said such extreme security measures would violate immigrants' rights. |
Who the **** is he to say what we do with OUR borders? He just wants to make sure that the SECOND largest income in the country of Mexico, (illegals working in the US then sending money to Mexico) keeps flowing in.
Mexico to US: Open your Borders
US to Mexico: STFU! |
Bitter about daddy losing his factory job to a mexican? Such is life my friend, free trade sucks doesn't it. | LumberJack wrote: |
Bitter about daddy losing his factory job to a mexican? Such is life my friend, free trade sucks doesn't it. |
My Dad died last month, thanks anyway. But you might consider the following in the unlikely event you become a responsible, functioning part of society... (heh, I made myself laugh)
| Diana Hull wrote: |
| “More than 60 hospitals have closed. Emergency rooms are closing and waits just get longer, much due to illegal aliens unpaid medical bills. Violent crime gangs run by illegal aliens are proliferating. ” |
| FoxNews wrote: |
| Last year, Los Angeles County spent $340 million to treat the uninsured; that's roughly $1,000 for every taxpayer. |
| Bill Morrow, California State Senator wrote: |
Illegal immigration affects the costs and availability of health care and social services. It affects unemployment and labor wages. It affects your insurance premiums. It overcrowds our prisons, providing pressure for early release of other criminals back into society.
It is a huge cost driver in our correctional system. Approximately 40,000 illegal immigrants currently are incarcerated in our state prisons?
Illegal immigration adds to the burden on our infrastructure. Somewhere between 2.2 and 2.4 million illegal immigrants rely daily on California’s roads, water and energy.
|
Your misconception of what free trade is compared to illegal immigration shows your complete lack of cogent ability in many arenas. The very thought of comparing free trade to illegal immigration is rediculous at best.
Not to mention the third grade insults you made about my father. Very pathetic and it makes you look like you're ignorant on the subject and have have nothing to contribute except your bad attitude and childish behavior.Destroyed! 
Don't mess with the S3nd! A sovereign nation has all rights to choose what it does with its borders, except perhaps during times of war when refugee migration must be allowed.
mess with the s3nd?
heh.
heh.
heh.
mess?
heh.
oh and he didn't mean to "insult" your father, the "daddy" was as in " who yo daddy? " etc.Also, he didn't know about the demise of your father, I apologise on his behalf for any (unintended) pain it may have brought to you. I guess you didn't pick up on the joke... oh well.
Not everyone is out there to "get you" s3nd 
| i_am_mine wrote: |
A sovereign nation has all rights to choose what it does with its borders, except perhaps during times of war when refugee migration must be allowed.
|
Correct. That's the point of this whole thread. Duh. The Mexican President can do what every he wan'ts with his side of the border, but needs to STFU about OUR side of the border. It's none of his concern. (oh, I take that back, considering the money sent back to mexico from the US by illegals is one of their BIGGEST economies)
| Quote: |
oh and he didn't mean to "insult" your father, the "daddy" was as in " who yo daddy? " etc.Also, he didn't know about the demise of your father, I apologise on his behalf for any (unintended) pain it may have brought to you. |
You seem to know a lot about him...
AE?? 
Either way, his childish stupidity has been put in it's place, (quite handily, if I do say so myself).
First of all you don't have to "Duh" about it, thats the only childish stupidity I'm seeing around here.
I'm agreeing for Chrissake.
And it wasn't his childish stupidity, only your failure to recognise a honest joke, however, noticing the delicateness of the situation, I would not wish upon the demise of anyone, I apologised nevertheless,without reason.
And by the way the fact that lumberjack laid down, about factories etc., is very relevant to the topic: the reason why there is a sudden out-rage over illegal immigration ( its been happening for decades - the inflow from Mexico ) is that citizen are finding it hard to find employment in the face of illegal immigrants taking up jobs because they charge less than legal rates...so it IS infact very relevant...its a labor struggle.
oh and I don't know anything about him, not that I need to clarify it for you, but anyway...some of us consider ourselves to be human and compassionate, no matter which "side" we're on.
If he is so close minded that he doesn't want to play, then leave it alone.
I have been "told" anyways.... so what is the difference 
Apprechate the effort though. I might just PM you the joke.... oh and s3nd, not everyones out to get you.
though I can understand why you fear everyone.
np lumberjack. would like to see the pm.
1. Please tell me the minefield thing was a joke. Well don't bother posting about it, but that's pretty bad taste.
2. I'd like to mentioned the different policies regarding Cuban and Mexican immigrants. We send them back on boats when they flee their country and only recently have we begun to seriously crackdown on Mexican immigration. Disparity much?
| benwhite wrote: |
2. I'd like to mentioned the different policies regarding Cuban and Mexican immigrants. We send them back on boats when they flee their country and only recently have we begun to seriously crackdown on Mexican immigration. Disparity much? |
I really don't care WHERE they come from. (I'm sure if we made the Cubans walk back to Cuba the ACLU and Greenies would throw a tissy fit.) So long as they get sent back, or more specifically, OUT.
I saw something about a bill to make it a felony to be in this country illegally. If it's not already on the books, WTF not? I think if you're caught in this country illegally you should be jailed and charged with a felony, slapped with a hefty fine and then kicked out of the country. | S3nd K3ys wrote: |
I really don't care WHERE they come from. (I'm sure if we made the Cubans walk back to Cuba the ACLU and Greenies would throw a tissy fit.) So long as they get sent back, or more specifically, OUT.
I saw something about a bill to make it a felony to be in this country illegally. If it's not already on the books, WTF not? I think if you're caught in this country illegally you should be jailed and charged with a felony, slapped with a hefty fine and then kicked out of the country. |
The disparity is that Mexican immigrants, once they've made it, are generally not sent back. Cubans are. That was the disparity, way to read.
Hate to break it to you, but the economy of the south relies heaviliy on the illigal immigrant industry for services and construction. Low wages and such. It's not as easy as 'kicking them out.' Even if that we're practical, it would have some really bad consequences for the economy. | benwhite wrote: |
The disparity is that Mexican immigrants, once they've made it, are generally not sent back. Cubans are. That was the disparity, way to read.
|
Oh.
Then allow to me re-phrase my statement...
I really don't care WHERE they come from. (I'm sure if we made the Cubans walk back to Cuba the ACLU and Greenies would throw a tissy fit.) So long as they get sent back, or more specifically, OUT.
| Quote: |
Hate to break it to you, but the economy of the south relies heaviliy on the illigal immigrant industry for services and construction. Low wages and such. It's not as easy as 'kicking them out.' Even if that we're practical, it would have some really bad consequences for the economy. |
Hate to break it to YOU, but the economy is in deep shit because of illegals...
| Center for Immigration Studies wrote: |
Illegals Cost Feds $10 Billion a Year; Amnesty Would Nearly Triple Cost
...
Among the findings:
*
Illegal alien households are estimated to use $2,700 a year more in services than they pay in taxes, creating a total fiscal burden of nearly $10.4 billion on the federal budget in 2002.
*
Among the largest federal costs: Medicaid ($2.5 billion); treatment for the uninsured ($2.2 billion); food assistance programs ($1.9 billion); the federal prison and court systems ($1.6 billion); and federal aid to schools ($1.4 billion).
*
If illegal aliens were legalized and began to pay taxes and use services like legal immigrants with the same education levels, the estimated annual fiscal deficit at the federal level would increase from $2,700 per household to nearly $7,700, for a total federal deficit of $29 billion.
*
With nearly two-third of illegals lacking a high school diploma, the primary reason they create a fiscal deficit is their low education levels and resulting low incomes and tax payments � not their legal status or their unwillingness to work.
*
Amnesty increases costs because illegals would still be largely unskilled, and thus their tax payments would continue to be very modest, but once legalized they would be able to access many more government services.
*
The fact that legal immigrants with little schooling are a fiscal drain on federal coffers does not mean that legal immigrants overall are a drain. Many legal immigrants are highly skilled.
*
Because many of the costs are due to their U.S.-born children, who are awarded U.S. citizenship at birth, barring illegals themselves from federal programs will not significantly reduce costs.
*
Although they create a net drain on the federal government, the average illegal household pays more than $4,200 a year in federal taxes, for a total of nearly $16 billion.
*
However, they impose annual costs of more than $26.3 billion, or about $6,950 per illegal household.
*
About 43 percent, or $7 billion, of the federal taxes illegals pay go to Social Security and Medicare.
*
Employers do not see the costs associated with less-educated immigrant workers because the costs are spread out among all taxpayers.
|
Benighted much?
BTW, the 'catch and release' program is about to be removed. Hopefully.I don't agree with the wall either. Why would the US want to do such a thing if anything the US ahould be investing in Mexico and making Mexico it's largest trade partner if anything.
s3nd K3ys, You miss the point of my statement. I didn't say illegal immigrants make the economy better, I said there are a huge part of it. Kicking out the ones already here wouldn't magically solve all problems, it would create a host of new ones. In the long run it might help things, but the process is complicated and messy. That is all.
And as for where they come from, I don't care if you want them to leave. I was pointing out the disparity in the CURRENT policy for other readers of this thread. A wall for mexico would be similar to what we ALREADY do to Cuban immigrants. Just laying some facts out there. I'm not advocating either way, stop being so damn defensive.
As far as I'm concerned, any nation can do whatever it wants to prevent any illegal activity as long as it doesn't infringe on people's rights. That said, I don't think a wall infringes on anyone's "rights", even the rights of those trying to break the law and enter the country illegally.
While it would require enormous amounts of money to hunt down every illegal immigrant and deport them, it's not exactly difficult for immigrants to enter the country illegally. Building a wall would make it at least a little more difficult for them to enter and it doesn't hurt anyone else. (Personally I suggest the use of 3 18ft electric barbed wire fences.) Continuing to allow illegal immigrants to freely cross the border is a slap in the face to each and every immigrant that has respected US law and has taken the time to enter the United States legally.
Not only that, it's one thing if a man seeking to earn a living for his family crosses the border illegally, but just as easily can a terrorist looking to cause mass destruction cross the border. It's much more difficult to smuggle explosives across the border if you have to climb over a huge wall to do it.
I agree with S3nd. What right to non-us vagina entrancers have to being here. Making it a felony to be in the US illegally is a great idea. I just wish we could send them to hell. They need to burn. What are they thinking!!!! Myoooo I want a better life. I want to send money back to my family to possible keep my sick father alive and send my youngest son to sixth grade. EVIL I say!!!
You know what really burns me? Not only do these indigents come across our sovereign borders and take all of our monkey jobs that we will have machine taking over in the next five years but they are attracting factories with our wonderful union type jobs. In other words a job leaves the US from a hard working fat white male with a truck payment equal to the family wages of the average Mexican and goes to three Mexicans with bachelor degrees. Sick!!!
The bottom line is we need to ignore the fact that the US is unique because it was originally composed of men and woman with such strong and brave spirits that they were not only willing to breach walls and cross oceans to reach a possible better life but also willing to do it burring their loved ones along the way. We need to realize that OUR immediate costs are the important thing and that we need to keep cheep labor out. We need to keep Americans, who have thing such as education and finances that make our citizens extremely competitive when utilized, able to keep their easy mundane monkey jobs that pay more than professions such as teachers. It is also important to keep union strangling our industries to make them completely unable to compete in the world market and then protect them with legislation limiting imports.
Several things are going to happen if we don't stop these ****** fighters.
1. Goods and services will start costing less.
2. Americans will either be able to start working less OR work the same amount and buy more stuff. (This is assuming WE continue retraining and education)
3. Americans will have to spend more time at school. SUCKS but hey, where have you ever meat more chicks sober?
4. Some Americans may experience temporary discomfort. I don't mean discomfort like starvation like 80% of the planet during hardship. I mean Wendy's instead of Big Boy’s.
5. And finally, what will happen eventually will happen sooner.
So please, let's keep our minds focused on statistics and figures that show someone is removing a little stuffing from our over weight ass cushion. It is absurd that Mexico has such a large income from the US. Especial since the US benefits so much from the cheep labor.
We should just build a wall around the whole country. History shows that that is the best way to go. Do a little reading. Societies in there peak of growth aren’t building roads into unsettled land, they are building walls.....Or wait, is it walls road. Who cares, keep them out, keep it the same, don't make we move, it's not my fault it’s theirs!!!!!
| mstreet wrote: |
| I don't agree with the wall either. Why would the US want to do such a thing if anything the US ahould be investing in Mexico and making Mexico it's largest trade partner if anything. |
The answer is money. Mexico is a poor country. They don't have the money to buy what we have to sell. They are taking money out of our economy. They cross the border and work in the US then take the money back to Mexico, not to mention the other costs listed this thread. Building a wall will save money in the long term, and thats what its all about. | Quote: |
voteforsamuel:
The answer is money. Mexico is a poor country. They don't have the money to buy what we have to sell. They are taking money out of our economy. They cross the border and work in the US then take the money back to Mexico, not to mention the other costs listed this thread. Building a wall will save money in the long term, and thats what its all about. |
Oooh voteforsamuel, save money? SAVE money?
Is economics really that complicated. I remember in community college it was treated as an enigma. But come one, do you really think building a WALL will SAVE money. Mexicans are coming across the border, working really hard for little pay (saving US money) sending that money to Mexico where they buy crap that is made in our factories in Mexico... and OK food too. Well, mostly food. Not cable TV and McDonalds. And making US money.
Save money................... 
| horseatingweeds wrote: |
| What right to non-us vagina entrancers have to being here. |
okay now what exactly are you referring to here? (and I'm asking seriously, no sarcasm intended)
| horseatingweeds wrote: |
| We should just build a wall around the whole country. History shows that that is the best way to go. Do a little reading. Societies in there peak of growth aren’t building roads into unsettled land, they are building walls.....Or wait, is it walls road. Who cares, keep them out, keep it the same, don't make we move, it's not my fault it’s theirs!!!!! |
If I remember correctly that is also the last stage before the demise of an empire. | horseatingweeds wrote: |
But come one, do you really think building a WALL will SAVE money. |
Well as it is now the government has to pay a lot of border patrolmen to send the illegals back to Mexico. Once they're sent back, most of them just turn around and try again until they get through. Either we need to just forget about our borders or something we need to do something new. I'm not saying that a wall is the only option, but I am saying that, yes, a wall would save money in the long term. I'm not going to go about proving that the illegals are costing the U.S. money - that has already been done in this thread. If we prevent them from entering the U.S. then we save money. A wall isn't the only way to keep them out, but it is one way. I believe that if we're going to pay money to keep them out then we should do it right.voteforsamuel
| Quote: |
| A wall isn't the only way to keep them out, but it is one way. I believe that if we're going to pay money to keep them out then we should do it right. |
Agreed, so….not a wall. I see your point about a wall replacing personnel. But a wall won’t. A wall will slow illegals down. Sort of like the OCEAN does.
earthchild
| Quote: |
horseatingweeds wrote:
What right to non-us vagina entrancers have to being here.
okay now what exactly are you referring to here? (and I'm asking seriously, no sarcasm intended) |
Being born in America, sorry for the language. Our country was begun by immigrants. Now that we are born here we feel we have special rights as apposed to someone born over there or over there. I don't remember doing anything special to be born here.
earthchild
| Quote: |
horseatingweeds wrote:
We should just build a wall around the whole country. History shows that that is the best way to go. Do a little reading. Societies in there peak of growth aren’t building roads into unsettled land, they are building walls.....Or wait, is it walls road. Who cares, keep them out, keep it the same, don't make we move, it's not my fault it’s theirs!!!!!
If I remember correctly that is also the last stage before the demise of an empire. |
Aaaaa but what does history matter....... HEY!
did you know that there are just as many Chineese illigals as there are mexicans, FOR your information. And did you also know, that without mexicans 'latinos' california alone will suffer a greater loss for MORe than 10 bill? so people need to think twice before they vote or open their mouth.
FOr all these ignorant racist people, i suggest you go and rent ' A day without a MExican' flick and learn something valeuble.
| todabeat wrote: |
HEY!
And did you also know, that without mexicans 'latinos' california alone will suffer a greater loss for MORe than 10 bill? so people need to think twice before they vote or open their mouth.
|
Wrong. Post sources or STFU.
| Quote: |
FOr all these ignorant racist people, i suggest you go and rent ' A day without a MExican' flick and learn something valeuble. |
Racist?
This isn't about race you idiot. 
It's about ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION!I meant to say 'or' racist. not to state that their is, but if there were. My bad. there is no need for you to call me an idiot.
Hey, does it mean that I am a racist if I can't help, when I read todabeat’s post, to hear a really stereotypical Latino accent? Like Chich and Chong.
Illegal Immigration, particularly from Mexico has been a problem that has only grown larger over the years. The number of illegal immigrants filling U.S. jobs is almost equal to the number of unemployed American CITIZENS. See a problem there? I do.
And Mexico can't argue abotu what we do with whatever is o nour side of the border as it is ours. What he could have done instead is take further measures to make illegal immigration less possible, but that doesn't seem to be a concern of his due to the fact that we contribute heftily to their economy...due to illegal immigrants.
This is not an issue of racism, it's an issue of legality. It's illegal so I will denounce it. SImple as that.
| horseatingweeds wrote: |
| Hey, does it mean that I am a racist if I can't help, when I read todabeat’s post, to hear a really stereotypical Latino accent? Like Chich and Chong. |
That isn't very nice man. I won't answer to that.
| Quote: |
Illegal Immigration, particularly from Mexico has been a problem that has only grown larger over the years. The number of illegal immigrants filling U.S. jobs is almost equal to the number of unemployed American CITIZENS. See a problem there? I do.
And Mexico can't argue abotu what we do with whatever is o nour side of the border as it is ours. What he could have done instead is take further measures to make illegal immigration less possible, but that doesn't seem to be a concern of his due to the fact that we contribute heftily to their economy...due to illegal immigrants.
This is not an issue of racism, it's an issue of legality. It's illegal so I will denounce it. SImple as that. |
Now when i comes to what you have just said, I can agree with you on the 'issue of legality' what it is 'is' man. You know what they can build this wall as big as they want it's their money they are spending. But here is just another issue to direct people's attention off the war. And the fact that people want to take bush out off office.
the goverment gives them all this statistics and dollar signs showing people how much they loose with 'illigal imigration' stuff. When a war cost billions of dollars more than that.
Just me
Will | todabeat wrote: |
| horseatingweeds wrote: | | Hey, does it mean that I am a racist if I can't help, when I read todabeat’s post, to hear a really stereotypical Latino accent? Like Chich and Chong. |
That isn't very nice man. I won't answer to that. |
Or can't answer that. That was a stupid comment about racists and ignorants. | Quote: |
S3nd K3ys
| Quote: | todabeat wrote:
| Quote: | horseatingweeds wrote:
Hey, does it mean that I am a racist if I can't help, when I read todabeat’s post, to hear a really stereotypical Latino accent? Like Chich and Chong. |
That isn't very nice man. I won't answer to that. |
Or can't answer that. That was a stupid comment about racists and ignorants. |
What’s wrong with answering the question? Of course it means I am racist. Everyone is racist. Racist and prejudice. What type of accent do you hear when you read my posts?
Further more. I have an additional question. Why is it that anytime there is an issue, not necessarily even, having to do with racism people start throwing around the word “ignorance”. I agree, many people in our resent history that have and are currently propagating racism are ignorant. However, I would hold the argument that it is rather fear and depravity that perpetuates such things. Saying simply “they are ignorant” I feel does not hold them accountable and gives them too much credit as being a human being.I think we can all agree illegal immigration is wrong on the basis of it being illegal.
Now some of you may disagree, but I think we should temporarily cut off ALL immigration from Mexico due to a very high Mexican population in the US. We did it to Japan when there was too many of them here and it wasn't a big deal because there wasn't a Bush in office. The NSA's spying has been around forever bun only comes to light when democrats try to bring down a president (e.g. Nixon).
I think Bush should grow a pair and do something about the Mexican PROBLEM. It IS a PROBLEM and it should be dealt with by any means necessary.
shr3dd
| Quote: |
| I think Bush should grow a pair and do something about the Mexican PROBLEM. |
Yeh...... Bush has no balls..... 
Selective balls. When it comes to Iraq his nuts are HUGE. Due to politicians depending on the hispanic (all lower case for a reason) vote, all politicans are ball-less.
I'll rephrase my statement, Bush needs to grow a pair concerning the southern border.
You know what would be weird? If Mexico, for some reason, put up a high-tech wall on there side of the border and the U.S. put up another high-tech wall on our side of the border, then what would someone do if they were trapped between the borders? Would they be in Mexico, or in the U.S.? Would it be like that one scene in Rookie of the Year where that funny guy gets caught in between the two doors to the hotel rooms and stands there in like a foot of space for a long time? Or would it be like Family Guy, where the land isn't on the map and its residents could start a whole new country with pre-built high-tech walls?
Yep. Definitely weird.
