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How do you deal with failure?





Haiku2016
We've all been there. Failed at something. How do you deal with it? Do you walk away, try something else? Or do you bounce back and try again? Trying again is hard, unless you know what you've done wrong and can do it differently.

For me, I find it hard to change. I tend to just focus on what I can do well and avoid what I cannot. But it's very limiting. I feel really stupid, like I need someone to spell it out. I read somewhere that the lessons you can learn from failure is nuanced. That's so true. I often don't know (don't want to know?) where I went wrong and how to do it right. I feel that the thoughts in my head are not right (like I tend to dumb down, assume the other person is just too stupid to know what I am trying to do and that I have to simplify). I think there's a right way to do things but I just don't get it sometimes.

It's easy to say bounce back, but how do you do it? It's a little silly to just try and try again.
standready
I feel like I am a trained professional at failing. Suck it up and move on, learning from each.
deanhills
I'm more or less like Standready. I move with the punches. I never give up though. Like it takes very long for me to admit failure. I'm very stubborn with that. I try, try and try again .... and if it's really impossible I try to find a few Plans B,C, and D's. Work arounds. I find there is always more than one way to get something one wants or to do something one needs to do. I also don't think one really fails at anything until one has decided it's a failure. Like there's always a silver lining or a solution in every failure one can work with. It may even be a lesson to do something different - like the lesson spontaneously pointing a new direction for one, when one is open to see it.
Haiku2016
standready wrote:
I feel like I am a trained professional at failing. Suck it up and move on, learning from each.

Thank you for the responses, @standready and @deanhills. Yes. But how? Can we be more specific? For example, let's say that you have a son/daughter who hates to study and is getting into a lot of trouble at school. Do you take that as a 'fact' and accept that they'll never do well in school or do you find ways to help them overcome their resistance to books and school? The first option may sound wrong, but why force someone to be something they're not naturally inclined for? Shouldn't they be following their passion and natural inclinations in life? Maybe they'll be good at stuff that doesn't need studying, like art, music, etc. Maybe they'll do better learning from life. Many successful people are not successful in school. On the other hand, a good education is a very important stepping stone in many careers. How do you decide which route to take? How do you define success? Every move you make involves not taking up other opportunities.

Often, I find that trying harder involves making some change in myself too. For example, maybe I'm not good in school myself and I want my children to have more opportunities than I have. Yet, I don't want to be blind to their needs as well. There are usually several options. I often do not know which route to go. Maybe I'm stubborn in the wrong way, lol.

deanhills wrote:
...when one is open to see it.

Exactly. What if there's a solution I can't see? How do you overcome the feelings on resentment, anger, etc. that makes it difficult to see the best solution. Like in the example above, there's all these feelings you have as a parent to overcome. It can be very confusing. We all want to do the right thing. I think the difficulty is in not knowing what is the right thing to do.
Blaster


There is a great video of an interview taken just the other day about failing. For those who don't know its Nick Foles and he was the Super Bowl MVP. He was a starting quarterback a few years ago for the Eagles and was traded, moved to a back up position, thought about leaving football but made his way to a coach he wanted to play under. Moved from there back to the eagles this season and was put in and led his team to winning the Super Bowl. Everyone said he couldn't do it, that they were the under dogs and yet he showed he can succeed.

I treat failure the same way. Don't forget it happened but learn from it and move on. I've failed a lot in my life but I've been able to learn from it and keep moving forward.

And one last piece of motivation.

loveandormoney
Haiku2016 wrote:
We've all been there. Failed at something. How do you deal with it? Do you walk away, try something else? Or do you bounce back and try again? Trying again is hard, unless you know what you've done wrong and can do it differently.

For me, I find it hard to change. I tend to just focus on what I can do well and avoid what I cannot. But it's very limiting. I feel really stupid, like I need someone to spell it out. I read somewhere that the lessons you can learn from failure is nuanced. That's so true. I often don't know (don't want to know?) where I went wrong and how to do it right. I feel that the thoughts in my head are not right (like I tend to dumb down, assume the other person is just too stupid to know what I am trying to do and that I have to simplify). I think there's a right way to do things but I just don't get it sometimes.

It's easy to say bounce back, but how do you do it? It's a little silly to just try and try again.




" How do you deal with it? "


Ask for help.


Do You ask for help?
Do You ask Your friends for help?
Or dont You ask Your friends for help for not blaming them?
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:

Ask for help.


What if, unlike here, the advice given is to give up? And do something less difficult?

I was reading Tony Robbins, probably the world's most successful motivator, and he said that we need to align our expectations with our worldview. Well, what's the right worldview? He also said that the problem is usually with us, not with other people, or circumstances. I agree. Change is needed. But which path do you take? Try them all? The hardest are those that challenge your current worldview, since we tend to blame other people rather than ourselves.

Do successful people 'blame' themselves a lot? If you have overcome many failures in your life, do you look on the bright side or do you 'admit' to yourself what an idiot you are?

There is also a countervailing trend, in psychology and some religions (like Christianity) to let go and let God. That sometimes we need to NOT try harder but allow 'nature' to take its course. I'm thinking here about psychological trends like mindfulness - learn to be detached. All that stress is not good for you.

Am I missing something here?
loveandormoney
"What if, unlike here, the advice given is to give up?"

Are You tzold this in a hospital by a doctor?
Change the hospital or the enemy.


(Friends dont fool and friends dont insult and friends dont hurt like Your mom.)
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:
"What if, unlike here, the advice given is to give up?"

Are You tzold this in a hospital by a doctor?
Change the hospital or the enemy.

LOL. Ya, counsellors and psychologists. Self-help motivators on the other hand is don't give up, no matter what.

Quote:

(Friends dont fool and friends dont insult and friends dont hurt like Your mom.)

Nice one. Except that sometimes you have choose between being honest and hurting someone. Sometimes the truth hurts.

Let's cut through the platitudes. We know of people who are so focused on their work and ambitions that their relationships and families suffer. On the other hand, we also know of people who don't know how to give up and keep knocking their heads on hard walls. For every successful guy who didn't give up, there are at least 100 or more other people who didn't give up and didn't succeed (did you guys see Amadeus and the tragic case of Salieri? Or Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak/Tim Cook?)

Failure teaches us something. Sometimes, it just that one way didn't work and we can try another way. But sometimes the message is that we need to find something else better suited to us. My problem is, when do you know what to do? On the one hand, you're advised to fight back no matter what, on the other hand, there are all these dead bodies lyiing around. Sometimes the victims are not just you but the people around you too, people you love and who love you. Really, it's not so black and white.

Don't you guys ponder over it?
loveandormoney
" Steve Jobs "

Kicked out by his own company.
What do You wanna say?
Or better like Zuckerberg: Fighting against friends?
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:
" Steve Jobs "

Kicked out by his own company.
What do You wanna say?
Or better like Zuckerberg: Fighting against friends?


Haha. Yes, not so straightforward, ya? So often, "success" requires really difficult decisions. Which also begs the question as to what makes for success. In another thread, @deanhills noted that progress can come out of wars. It's the price acceptable? How do you live with being the guy who invented the atomic bomb, for example? How do you live with being the general who led the soldiers to their deaths? Or the manager who led the company to bankruptcy? It's not always people who has the wrong values, but people to whom these things happen unexpectedly, or which consequences were not anticipated.

Don't you guys struggle with it? Haven't you been at the crossroads and made difficult decisions and wondered if you did the right thing? And have things fall apart and you cannot so easily pick up the pieces and try again? Sometimes even feel that there's nothing you can do and feel a sense of despair?

Or be at the crossroads and not know which way to turn?
Blaster
Since we are looking at people you can also look at Thomas Edison. He was quoted as saying something along the lines of he never failed he just simply found ways not to do something.
loveandormoney
" "success" requires really difficult decisions."


Thats totally wrong.

When You are sick in a hospital after suicide try then You have difficult decisions.
When Your wife left You and is doing sexxx with You neighbour then You ll have difficult decisions.
When Your car is broke or Your kid is sick then You ll have difficult decisions or Your wife is
to much drinking.

SUCCESS is love and so when You have a company throw it away
if You have 3 cars or a house
throw it away.

If You dont have money or car then its difficult.

Or are only rich people in Your town sick?
Haiku2016
Blaster wrote:
Since we are looking at people you can also look at Thomas Edison. He was quoted as saying something along the lines of he never failed he just simply found ways not to do something.


It's simpler when it's just about technology or something theoretical/technical. But, I'm talking more about the social consequences. Perhaps Edison lived in a much simpler time, when people are more easily content (or maybe we just don't know what's the true reality then). For example, fewer women today are happy just to be the housewife and take care of the family and home for you while you focus on your career and work all sorts of hours. It's hard to say since we know so little about them and lots are unhappiness are just not acknowledged.

As a general policy, yes, we do just need to try harder and never give up. But, in practice, it's a lot harder, no?

loveandormoney wrote:
" "success" requires really difficult decisions."

Thats totally wrong.

When You are sick in a hospital after suicide try then You have difficult decisions.
When Your wife left You and is doing sexxx with You neighbour then You ll have difficult decisions.
When Your car is broke or Your kid is sick then You ll have difficult decisions or Your wife is
to much drinking.

SUCCESS is love and so when You have a company throw it away
if You have 3 cars or a house
throw it away.

If You dont have money or car then its difficult.

Or are only rich people in Your town sick?


Nope. Lots of people I know are 'sick', or unhappy or dysfunctional. In a way, that's the point. We are all struggling to find the balance in life, to define what success means to us, and to deal with the curve balls life throws at us.

I really can't believe that life is so simple for you guys, Smile.
loveandormoney
"Lots of people I know are 'sick', or unhappy or dysfunctional. In a way, that's the point. We are all struggling to find the balance in life,"

Thank You for Your very good and excellent post.

I ask all members here to read it twice
the post made


10.2.18 12 h 37



Alone You are gone.
This is the word
every kid at the age of 3 has to learn.

Did You visit a school?

"Lots of people I know are 'sick', "
Yes- Hospotals are full with sick or lonely people.
And who they are.
I learned in school:
There are 2 kids:
Kid one is in the group and laughing and playing with others. These kids do this 80 years heltlyly.
Kid Number 2 is saying:
I hate kids I wanna be alone I love my TV and I hate to leave my house.
Those kids become sick.
We started in 1,991 to bring humans together so we cook today on Sunday with 12 Loners.
They become healthy because they learn

alone You are a victim.

So here in the board tell me: Why is a dog or a TV a better friend who is solving Your problems than a friend.

A friend is helping You and in this cold society
together is good
I wanna live alone makes You sick.

Idea: Its a good concept to start to stop insulting others.


***
Friendly advice Listen to the Beatles Eleanor Rigby.
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:

So here in the board tell me: Why is a dog or a TV a better friend who is solving Your problems than a friend.
...
Friendly advice Listen to the Beatles Eleanor Rigby.


Exactly, look at all the lonely people. We can easily look up statistics and see how many marriages fail, how many students fail (not in terms of exams, but in terms of giving up on themselves and turning to drugs and so on). So many of us do not handle failure well. It's easy to say try and try again. But, it's there a difference between Edison's perseverance and the others, whose efforts lead to failures in other areas? The children who didn't want to make friends with the kid who don't fit in are simply looking out for themselves, focusing on their own needs, and struggling to succeed themselves. It's not that they don't care, it's more like they don't even know.

Can you succeed without hurting people in the process? Does caring for others mean automatically that you won't succeed? Must you overwork to succeed? People like Elon Musk sleep in their workplace and work in their underwear. Must you go that far? What price success? How do you know which path to take?
loveandormoney
Thank You for Your very interesting post. Thank You again.
I think 100 users will gain in profit to read it.
First part is fine, secong part is a bug.
Lets look.

"Exactly, look at all the lonely people."
We do and we study it since 1,972. 1,985 a company was founded to help humans
not to hit each other out of pleasure. Cause like You said, many people like to hurt.
They love revenge in the family.
Yes
You are rigt.

" We can easily look up statistics and see how many marriages fail, "
2/3

1/3 is success.

Do You wann be in the group 2/3 oder 1/3. Its Your life.

"how many students fail"
90%

Do You wanna read more statistics
we can post them.

" (not in terms of exams, but in terms of giving up on themselves and turning to drugs and so on). "
Yes
Drugs and violence.
And drugs destroys relationships
did You know?

"So many of us do not handle failure well."
Exactly. 66%.

" It's easy to say try and try again."
its wrong and its difficult and it is stupid.
You boot a computer and accident.
Many people are booting for 40 years and every day accident.

" But, it's there a difference between Edison's perseverance and the others, whose efforts lead to failures in other areas? "
Yes

The children who didn't want to make friends with the kid who don't fit in are simply looking out for themselves, focusing on their own needs, and struggling to succeed themselves.
"No."
Ask a kid.
Do You talk with kids?
Do You remember Your childhood?


It's not that they don't care, it's more like they don't even know.
EIGHT.

A drunken man hitting his wife and she must go to hospital
is not able to do love.
He is blind.
He needs help.


"Can you succeed without hurting people in the process? "
Now You are confused.
Succeed makes friends.
Destroying makes enemies and hurts people. A drunken man is hurting his wife by hitting
not a man winning a car.
Success is good fail is bad.



"Does caring for others mean automatically that you won't succeed?"
Wrong.
A mother caring others is healthy and successful.
A drunken mother and not caring is making problems.
She is hating success and the poor kids.




" Must you overwork to succeed?"
Using drugs.
Yes.
Overwork makes cancer.
Wrong.
Cancer is bad.


" People like Elon Musk sleep in their workplace and work in their underwear."
Who is she or he?

"Must you go that far? What price success? How do you know which path to take?"

Kissing is good and success
divorce is bad and is hurting.
Lets talk more.

Question: Why do people hate to ask for help (their darling or sister) ?
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:
Thank You for Your very interesting post. Thank You again.

Thank you, love&/money. I love your name. It's a really good summary of what I'm getting at. Actually, I'm doing this just for the points, haha. I have another 60+ more to go before I get into positive territory, Wink. Just joking. Your replies are really interesting.


Quote:
Do You wanna read more statistics
we can post them.

Seriously, I don't mind. I love statistics. All those numbers. Something very alluring about them. (But often misleading, but that's another story.)

Quote:

Ask a kid.
Do You talk with kids?
Do You remember Your childhood?

Yes, I do. And I remember that all I cared about was myself and never felt pity or sympathy enough to go and help other children who are not doing well. If a kid was unpopular, I may still be their friend but not so much to help them fit into the group. It's not that I didn't care or that I was a bully, just that I didn't feel in control of my environment. I was usually more worried about whether or not I fit in.

Quote:
A drunken man hitting his wife and she must go to hospital is not able to do love.
He is blind.
He needs help.

Exactly. And what he feels most of the time is that he is a failure. And because he doesn't know what to do, he hits out and blames other people. This is exactly what I mean. We want to try and try again, but often we end up making it worse. How do you know which is the right path to take?


Quote:
"Can you succeed without hurting people in the process? "
Now You are confused.
Succeed makes friends.

Often the wrong kind of friends. Often, it's failure that shows you who are your real friends.

Quote:
Destroying makes enemies and hurts people. A drunken man is hurting his wife by hitting
not a man winning a car.
Success is good fail is bad.

I don't think it's so straightforward. If success is good, then Donald Trump is good because he has made the economy stronger over his term of office. And, again following the same logic, if the success of the economy is not because of him, then he is bad? No, he is bad because of the kind of person he is. The man who won a car is not necessarily a good man. Nor is a drunk necessarily a bad man. I don't agree with hitting other people, and in fact, I don't agree with getting drunk in the first place, even if it's just to drown your sorrows and it's just one time. But, like you said above, the drunk is someone who needs help.

Quote:
A mother caring others is healthy and successful.

Oddly enough, it's often the poor mothers, who cannot afford childcare, who care for others. And that includes those "mothers" (fathers, children, etc) who cares for their parents, brothers, etc. because they cannot afford to pay someone else to do it. Those who can afford it (who are successful?), often pay other people to do this - childcare, invalid parents, retarded children, etc. The richer (the more successful?) we are, the less we are able to care for one another. It's not that we don't care, we don't have time to show we care. Time is money.

Quote:
A drunken mother and not caring is making problems.
She is hating success and the poor kids.

I don't agree. What I see is someone struggling to do the right thing and failing. Failing so badly that her emotional needs have taken over her kinder self. How can we help her? From her point of view, she has tried and tried so hard, she doesn't know what to do. She hates herself for what she is. But she cannot see a way out. Life is too hard. It's not that she's too lazy (at least not from her point of view).


Quote:
" People like Elon Musk sleep in their workplace and work in their underwear."
Who is she or he?

You really don't know? Google him, Smile.

Quote:
Kissing is good and success
divorce is bad and is hurting.
Lets talk more.

Yes. What if you kiss someone who doesn't want your kisses? What if you really want to kiss them but they just don't like you? What if both partners in the marriage just cannot get along, and everytime they try, they just end up quarreling, blaming each other, and feeling that the marriage is just a big mess? The high level of failure in our society is not because people don't want success, they just don't know how to get it. Like me. I don't know how to move forward. Every move I make seems to make things worse.

Quote:
Question: Why do people hate to ask for help (their darling or sister) ?

Haha. Good question. Maybe this needs a new thread.
loveandormoney
"And because he doesn't know what to do, he hits out and blames other people. "

Sorry. Im busy and its holiday, and so today there is a shor post.
Yes.
He does not know.
He wife is noisy and he smashes her his hand in her face to make her silent.
He cannot talk.#

Alc oder Rum:

A group is sitting together. Lets become drunk or are You weak.
And so they drink and destroy cars.
And number 13 who is stupid, 13 says: I hate to drink and I hate to destroy.
So 12 young men cry Loser Loser Loser and hit him in the face.

So those 12 go to the party and sing and the loser number 13 is cleaning the toilet.




****
Here is a fun for young men:
Become 16 years old
buy or steal a car.
Drive with 150 miles/h through villages with kids in the streets and Your wife will happily scream.

And Your friends ll become proud. (remember Shelton)
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:

So those 12 go to the party and sing and the loser number 13 is cleaning the toilet.

Are you saying that society is at fault here? This is a difficult one. A) There's nothing you can do to change society (Or, is there? How?), B) We are part of society . So, maybe we need to change too? Assuming we're not the kind of parents who condone this kind of behavior, nor adults who will sit by and let it happen, what can we do? Do we act, or do we simply say to ourselves, we can only protect ourselves and our children. The bigger picture is out of my hands. Let's say you're the parent of 13. What should you do? Or the parent of one of the other 12... Or their teacher (assuming they go to the same class)... Or just someone who lives in the neighborhood...

When you get down to specifics, it's suddenly not so clear. A lot of solutions may be out of your hands: you may not be able to afford to move to a better neighborhood, you may be a minority and feel that the rest of the neighborhood will not support you, you may be working so hard just to keep afloat and don't have time to talk to the other parents/school/authorities - will they do anything anyway...

Quote:

And Your friends ll become proud. (remember Shelton)

Haha, my turn. Who is Shelton? Why are "your friends" like that? It seems to be more prominent in Western countries than in Eastern ones (at least those that I know). There is a "rumor" (wrong word?) in the West that bad is good, that you have to be a Dirty Harry, or a Mad Man, or Game of Thrones. Most Westerners are OK, actually, and we take all this as some kind of entertainment but try to be good and kind ourselves.
loveandormoney
I m sorry.

This is the answer from yesterday.

Today Valentine.



***

I ll answer Your post 14.2.18 12 Uhr 49

**

Answer to Your older post:




Quote:

Seriously, I don't mind. I love statistics.

OK
Here we go.
Why do in all countries in the world every year and every month the same number of humans do suicide? How do they cooperate and how to they plan the common schedule?




Quote:
just that I didn't feel in control of my environment.

Who is Your enemy?
Yourself?





Quote:



Exactly. And what he feels most of the time is that he is a failure. And because he doesn't know what to do, he hits out and blames other people. This is exactly what I mean. We want to try and try again, but often we end up making it worse. How do you know which is the right path to take?


Workshop. They do exercises to learn how to fly a plane or drive a car but they are not interested to learn to talk to humans. Its so much funny.




Quote:

Often the wrong kind of friends.


Dont pay friends. Friendship is not Red Light.


"I don't think it's so straightforward. If success is good, then Donald Trump is good"
Funny point. Did the wall talk?


Quote:
A mother caring others is healthy and successful.


"who cannot afford childcare,"
Thats wrong. Also rich women misuse babies.


" What I see is someone struggling to do the right thing and failing."
OK
Here we go.
Where do You buy responsibility?




Quote:
A drunken mother and not caring is making problems.
She is hating success and the poor kids.

I don't agree. What I see is someone struggling to do the right thing and failing. Failing so badly that her emotional needs have taken over her kinder self. How can we help her? From her point of view, she has tried and tried so hard, she doesn't know what to do. She hates herself for what she is. But she cannot see a way out. Life is too hard. It's not that she's too lazy (at least not from her point of view).



"You really don't know? Google him, Smile. "
No.
I talk with humans.
He can send me an Email.

"What if you kiss someone who doesn't want your kisses?"
Thats violence.
Lets talk about violence+rape.
Haiku2016
Dear loveandormoney,

Sometimes I don't understand what you are saying. For example:
loveandormoney wrote:

Why do in all countries in the world every year and every month the same number of humans do suicide? How do they cooperate and how to they plan the common schedule?

Really? I can't believe this. Please give me a link.

Quote:
Who is Your enemy?
Yourself?

??? I don't understand what you are trying to say here. Can you explain?

Quote:

Workshop. They do exercises to learn how to fly a plane or drive a car but they are not interested to learn to talk to humans. Its so much funny.

Again, I don't understand. What's your point?


Quote:

Dont pay friends. Friendship is not Red Light.

???

Quote:

Funny point. Did the wall talk?

You talk in riddles. What wall?

Quote:

Where do You buy responsibility?

No.
I talk with humans.
He can send me an Email.

Thats violence.
Lets talk about violence+rape.

I don't mean violence or rape. The topic here is how to deal with failure. I'm talking about loving someone who doesn't love you. Not about hitting them or raping them. Just asking what can you do? If you love someone who doesn't love you, don't you feel lousy? As if you're not good enough? It's very painful, isn't it? Some people find it very hard to find someone to love. And the harder they try, the more they are rejected, because they try too hard, and are annoying, or a nuisance. And other people are so popular, they have so many people who wants to be their lover. It's not equal for everyone. Some people have bad breath, for example. And no matter how hard they try, they can't get rid of it. While other people just smell good.

Life can be very unfair. What do you do about it?
loveandormoney
Quote:
I'm talking about loving someone who doesn't love you.


Lets talk about that.
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:
Quote:
I'm talking about loving someone who doesn't love you.


Lets talk about that.


OK. This is just one example of failure where you cannot so easily just try and try again. Most teenagers, for example, are worried about their attractiveness to other people. Some are smart(lucky?) enough to find someone who likes them too and not chase after those they know are not interested in them. But many teenagers go to extremes, and often end up harming themselves (take drugs, diet until they are anorexic or fall sick in other ways, do dangerous things to impress other people, or when they are really desperate, even commit suicide or try to). Many also "fall in love" or get married, nor because they really love the other person but because they don't want to be unpopular, or they think that they had to get married for one reason or another. I even know of one guy, who is a homosexual, who loves someone else who is not and who, in fact, hates homosexuals.

The ideal is for each person to discover love through a relationship, and for the love to grow through the relationship - through doing things for one another and learning things about one another. But love can also be felt as an attraction, maybe because they are good-looking, or clever, or rich, or for whatever reason that makes them attractive.

Teenagers do all those things (take drugs, go on dangerous diets, etc) because they are trying to be more popular and attractive. Obviously, that's the wrong kind of trying. But when all your friends are taking drugs and you are the only person who isn't, it's hard to resist. What about when your friends like to say bad things about other people (whether it is racist, or sexist)? Or even, what if all your friends are smart and you are not? What if they like to study but you like sports (or vice versa)?

There are so many instances where love is not reciprocated and we do things just to be accepted by the people we love. Even when the love is shared, there are many times when we need to do something we don't like to please the other person. There are many situations when we have to compromise or make sacrifices when we love someone. Where do we draw the line? When do we say, no, I won't do this, or I won't accept that?
loveandormoney
I hope it is ok, I ll use ,, to show Your quotes.
I am sorry I have to follow You now one day later.




,,So those 12 go to the party and sing and the loser number 13 is cleaning the toilet..............
Are you saying that society is at fault here?,,

We have to clear something.
Do we talk about community or society. I did talk about community.
So as solution let us split it up

Group one in the society is family
G2 ist company or school
G3 ist country like USA or Canada or Brazil.

So question:
Is the social behaviour the same out of Your view ( all other users can answer too )
in G1
G2
G3
.

Are teachers more fair or less fair then parents.
Is a friend more or less rude than a stranger in the train.

Who is offering more fun on a part: a new date or Your wife after 40 years marriage?



,, This is a difficult one. A) There's nothing you can do to change society (Or, is there? How?),,,
Are You a priest.
So let us talk about community and then
how to change a whole cold country.


,, B) We are part of society .,,
Boss of slave?
Or all humans are the same and the same level?


,, So, maybe we need to change too?,,
Are You happy?

,,Assuming we're not the kind of parents who condone this kind of behavior, nor adults who will sit by and let it happen, what can we do?,,
Communication.


,, Do we act, or do we simply say to ourselves, we can only protect ourselves and our children.,,
Its thwe same.


,, The bigger picture is out of my hands. Let's say you're the parent of 13. What should you do? Or the parent of one of the other 12... Or their teacher (assuming they go to the same class)... Or just someone who lives in the neighborhood... ,,

First view:
Communication. In every violent community there is no communication. Or its wrong. The communication is hitting instead of words.
So when You know something about prisoners: They dont talk they judge.

,,When you get down to specifics, it's suddenly not so clear. ,,
It is.

,,A lot of solutions may be out of your hands: you may not be able to afford to move to a better neighborhood,
,,
Thats wrong.
Sorry.

,,you may be a minority,,
Like every human in a family.



,,and feel that the rest of the neighborhood will not support you, ,,
Here we start
how to make a community like a neighbourhood to follow You and not to fool You.

Example:
kid is destroying a bicycle
and the kid is the child of a neighbour.



,,you may be working so hard just to keep afloat and don't have time to talk to the other parents/school/authorities - will they do anything anyway...
,,
I dont understand.
What is the problem talking and working?

,,And Your friends ll become proud. (remember Shelton) ..... Haha, my turn. Who is Shelton? Why are "your friends" like that? It seems to be more prominent in Western countries than in Eastern ones (at least those that I know). There is a "rumor" (wrong word?) in the West that bad is good, that you have to be a Dirty Harry, or a Mad Man, or Game of Thrones. Most Westerners are OK, actually, and we take all this as some kind of entertainment but try to be good and kind ourselves.,,

YES
There is a figure in a comedy who does not understand Sarkasm. So his name in the Big Bang Show is Sheldon. And because he cannot understand humour we call him Shelton.
So question:
Is Dirty Harry good as father or husband or does Dirty Harry have a good way only in the cinema?









This was the old answer
from yesterday.
I was busy with Urteil von Nuernberg.















Quote:

This is just one example of failure where you cannot so easily just try and try again.


So You ask for Your brother. His wife lefrt him
You wanna help him
he loves her
and she is cold as ice.

Is this Your problem?
I m happy, that You help Your brother.
spinout
well, there is a good song for this : fight fire with fire!
loveandormoney
Thats true. Many people start a relationship with crying and then they ll wonder, why did darling run sadly away?
dude_xyx
I hate to admit failure and believe you are not lost till you accept you are lost. But when I accept it I cut my losses and move on. In my opinion regret, sorrow, hate, happiness etc are choice you make. I always like to look at the bright side of a situation. There is always lesson to learn and experience to gain. Small failures teach you valuable lessons so you won't make same mistakes large scale.
loveandormoney
Quote:
I hate to admit failure and believe you are not lost till you accept you are lost


This is also very true. I know this from a many of therapists and doctors. The exercise is like this:

Morning lunch dinner
You go into the bathroom, alone
go to the mirror and say:
"I am beautiful."

If You like repeat it sometimes.

And then You ll forget sentences like "I am not good enough".

Should I recommend You a book?
deanhills
dude_xyx wrote:
I always like to look at the bright side of a situation.
As difficult as that can be when one has really been badly treated, this is always the best side for me to be on too. What helps me is to picture that other people never think the same as I do and always come from a different place I'm in. So maybe one can never really get the 100% correct picture. It's also the side that is physically the healthiest to be on. I struggle with it sometimes, but over the years this was one of the lessons I learned.
Haiku2016
Hey, hey, hey. So good to hear from so many people. Maybe it will help if I recap a little.

The Topic is: How do you cope with failure?
Initial Response: Try and try again.

BUT...
this is easier said than done. Things get complicated when we get into specifics. For example:
1) Technical failures (Thomas Edison model)
These are often more straightforward. Here we're talking about stuff like scientific experiments, or how to repair cars, and so on. Where the solution is to keep trying until you find the answer. These kinds of problems are often actually quite enjoyable, and engaging. They are often very satisfying too.

2) Personal failures (Tony Robbins model)
These are goals you set for yourself and examples of such goals include being successful in your career, getting rich, becoming a great artist, and so on. They are a little more complicated because other people are often hurt, or feel that they are used, in your journey to the top. You also need to hold on to your values and not fall prey to greed, or temptation (drugs, promiscuity, etc). But it's largely personal. It's often the goal or some personal sacrifice. For example, you may give up family life to pursue wealth.

3) Social failures (Dear Abby model)
These are the relationships that somehow go wrong, and didn't start on the right foot. Parents who cannot get along with their children, people who bully or beat their spouses, people who become addicts (drugs, alcohol, etc), and those who become self-destructive, maybe even commit suicide.

Did I miss anything?

Obviously, as @loveandormoney says so eloquently, your values are important. You need to know right from wrong. And if possible, do the right thing. Or as @deanhills and @dude_xyx wrote: look at the bright side of a situation. There are two dangers with this:
i. You are often on the 'losing' end. You often will let the other person have their way, just to avoid a confrontation. So, you often lose in the materialistic sense.
ii. There is also the carer's syndrome. Where you are always giving and to some extent is victimized. The continuous giving takes a strain. You also lose emotionally. We all need to win sometimes (in fact, it is generally believed that we need to feel, every day, that more good things have happened to us than bad). "Looking at the bright side" is one way to remind yourself things are not that bad and to regain that sense of self-worth.

Many of the "winners" in society, like Elon Musk, Steve Jobs, Donald Trump, are not people we will like if we meet them. They are often so self-centered that you feel that they have no space for the ordinary people. Do we have to be like this in order to be materially successful? Or is success only for those who can be like Gandhi or Mother Teresa?

Or do we just accept the lives we have and not worry about whether we are successful or not? This too can be a problem, because you don't want to be so inward looking that you are not aware of your social needs at all. We all need friends and contact with the outside world. And the outside world values success.
loveandormoney
Quote:
I always like to look at the bright side of a situation.

This is a good concept. You go one step futher than the mirror exercise. Its stupid to doubt the whole day. This makes Your husband nervous also. Do clear decisions.



Quote:
As difficult as that can be when one has really been badly treated, this is always the best side for me to be on too. What helps me is to picture that other people never think the same as I do and always come from a different place I'm in.


She ist talking.
He is talking.
Then there ll be understanding.
Look at his/her view.

Thank You deanhills.



Quote:
It's also the side that is physically the healthiest to be on.


When You are in good health and You are relaxed, then its more easy to do clear decisions.
Da Rossa
I rethink everything. But most likely I'll try to always be prepared for the less desirable outcome. It must be foreseeable. That way, the pain is weaker and you can rationalise better and be more resilient.
loveandormoney
Quote:

The Topic is: How do you cope with failure?
Initial Response: Try and try again.

BUT...
this is easier said than done. Things get complicated when we get into specifics. For example:
1) Technical failures (Thomas Edison model)
These are often more straightforward. Here we're talking about stuff like scientific experiments, or how to repair cars, and so on. Where the solution is to keep trying until you find the answer. These kinds of problems are often actually quite enjoyable, and engaging. They are often very satisfying too.



Your post is so very good
I ll answer with 3 parts
because You did talk about 2 chapters.
This is chapter one.

Technical problem.
This is the most important thing
but the most adults cannot see it.
Lets watch:
,,Aljona Savchenko und Bruno Massot,,
Its like Edison and they do the perfect dance.
They are losers and special she is weak and small and little.
But she said
its cold
its raining
but I ll win.

Do You like it.
Cause the most people say its cold its raining I dont like Edison I go back to bed and let my darling bring me a cup of coffee.

And watch You class at school.
Who is happy. The man in the bed or Aljona Savchenko.


Thank You again for Your very good examples. It did help.
Haiku2016
loveandormoney wrote:

Your post is so very good
I ll answer with 3 parts
because You did talk about 2 chapters.
This is chapter one.


Thank you. I look forward to your posts. Thank you for your thoughtful answers. They are very good.

Quote:

Who is happy. The man in the bed or Aljona Savchenko.

Actually we don't really know. We can say that we all want to be like Aljona, and not be the lazy man in the bed. But I think that if I am the man in bed, waiting for my loved one to bring me breakfast in bed, I will be happy. But can we say that Aljona is happy? We know, from the media, three things:
1. Successful people had often suffered more than we do. And this is not from trying so hard at what they are doing. Simply that they often have difficult backgrounds or had a difficult life which made them so much more determined to succeed than we are.
2. They work harder than most people do. In fact, they spend their lives trying to get as much from it as they can.
3. There are very many stories of how unhappy successful people are, even after they have achieved success - Robin Williams, Marilyn Monroe, the list is very long.

I don't think we can say that successful people are happy. In fact, that's another way to phrase my question: How do you choose the right path so that you have both success and happiness?
dude_xyx
The hardest part is those lessons we learned put into use. We tend to do same mistakes again.
deanhills
dude_xyx wrote:
The hardest part is those lessons we learned put into use. We tend to do same mistakes again.
That is so true. Not that it should be surprising. We're born and trained with a certain template in place, and some of the parts are probably very set in their way. Smile
loveandormoney
dude_xyx wrote:
The hardest part is those lessons we learned put into use. We tend to do same mistakes again.



Ask friends for help.
Alone You r gone.
We fool ourselves.
Who told You, You are ferfect?
Haiku2016
deanhills wrote:
dude_xyx wrote:
The hardest part is those lessons we learned put into use. We tend to do same mistakes again.
That is so true. Not that it should be surprising. We're born and trained with a certain template in place, and some of the parts are probably very set in their way. Smile


Exactly. So, what do you do when you realize that you have to change the template? It's really hard, and no one's perfect. You try harder one way and you fail another way. For example, you work too hard and your health fails, you don't have time for your relationships, maybe they even fail to the point there's a divorce. You spend too much time with your family and you miss that promotion, or that opportunity, etc.

Maybe you think you're just too lazy. Or too impatient. Or too greedy. There's a long list of our failures and they're really difficult to change. The easy part is to keep trying if it doesn't involve us changing who we are. But our failures are often the result of who we are. We need to change. The question is how? And how do we know we're doing it right? Also, where do you find the energy to keep trying?
loveandormoney
Quote:

2) Personal failures (Tony Robbins model)
These are goals you set for yourself and examples of such goals include being successful in your career, getting rich, becoming a great artist, and so on. They are a little more complicated because other people are often hurt, or feel that they are used, in your journey to the top. You also need to hold on to your values and not fall prey to greed, or temptation (drugs, promiscuity, etc). But it's largely personal. It's often the goal or some personal sacrifice. For example, you may give up family life to pursue wealth.


This is the failure. And many people become sick because they do it or they did it. Its calles Muenchhausen Syndrom.
Here is the righ way without failure. I am lazy so I write between Your words:


These are ,,teacher and they have fun and they have goals and You like it and then You wanna go to this goal and there are ,, goals you set ,,by Your teacher,, for yourself and examples of such goals include being successful ,,like Your teacher,, in your career, getting rich, becoming a great artist, and so on. ......So foolers swim from England to Ireland and they are drowned because they hate to accept a teacher.

Solution:
Come down to earth and ask for help.
loveandormoney
Quote:


3) Social failures (Dear Abby model)
These are the relationships that somehow go wrong, and didn't start on the right foot. Parents who cannot get along with their children, people who bully or beat their spouses, people who become addicts (drugs, alcohol, etc), and those who become self-destructive, maybe even commit suicide.



Quote:
These are the relationships that somehow go wrong

OK.
Lets look on the 2 persons. The violent person we call him Strong and the hitten and fooled and misused and robbed person, we call him Weak.
So can a Strong leave the marriage?
Yes.
He is jumping to another bed.
*
Can the weak leave the relationship?
No.
###
Same hitten kids. Can they leave? No.
Weak is living with a drunker loser. Can Weak leave now?
No.

So what do have to do in a bad relationship.?
And you ll be surprised.
Post here on the and in the board.
*
Write down
12
complaints insults attacks bad things angry things bored things wrong behaviour and so on
*
write down 12 things You love in the/Your relationship
'
And then give this letter to all others in Your house.
***
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