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Wartime sex slaves were necessary to maintain discipline,





nickfyoung
When the Japanese came ashore in the Philippines during the war it is reported that they shot all men on sight and took the women and girls as 'comfort slaves' for the night time entertainment of the troops. The same thing happened in most Asian countries.

"Wartime sex slaves were necessary to maintain discipline, says Japanese politician " .

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/wartime-sex-slaves-were-necessary-to-maintain-discipline-says-japanese-politician/story-e6frg6so-1226642016419

Do you think such comments by today's politicians are warranted or is it all to long ago to be an issue.
spinout
Hm, this is a bit tricky and a lie. Are asians different and more hard to keep control of in war? No, and Japs do have the military background already in their mind! (brain washed people !!!). Remember tha kamakazie, that means loyalty !

This is a LIE!
catscratches
I don't really see how it matters if the events were "too long ago"; I'm not a moral relativist.

Hardly surprising that he's a part of the right-wing nationalist party.
handfleisch
Did you know that the US military creates a boom in prostitution and sex trafficking everywhere it goes? The word "hooker" comes from the name of a US Army general. The US has been known for creating entire prostitution sub-economies in places where it puts its bases. Thailand, Philipines, Korea.... Militarism is evil

Links to get you started below.

http://www.timesdispatch.com/news/vuic-prostitution-and-the-u-s-military/article_1bd36741-1244-5aaa-9d2d-ff71c9ec0d40.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patpong

http://muse.jhu.edu/journals/journal_of_world_history/v010/10.2shaffer.html

www.japanfocus.org/-Katharine_H_S_-Moon/3019

gradworks.umi.com/15/30/1530232.html

I'm just showing historical fact about US military bases and prostitution and its tragic, ignored legacy. Of course that doesn't mean every soldier goes to prostitutes. But as US society becomes less male-chauvinist, and things like the Steubenville football players rape case cause a national discussion and change in the USA, I think the subject of prostitution-epidemics around military bases will become an issue.

The military has a long way to go, however:
http://www.npr.org/2013/03/21/174840895/sexual-violence-victims-say-military-justice-system-is-broken
Quote:

Sexual Violence Victims Say Military Justice System Is 'Broken'


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/us/teenagers-found-guilty-in-rape-in-steubenville-ohio.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0



There is a lot of noise too in Australian military at the moment. Seems sexual harassment and abuse has become common place in the ranks.

nickfyoung wrote:
There is a lot of noise too in Australian military at the moment. Seems sexual harassment and abuse has become common place in the ranks.


In the US military, rape has increased (and not just because of better reporting of cases, even above and beyond that).

MOD - Three serial posts combined into one
- Ankhanu
deanhills
@Handfleisch. I see a big difference between voluntary prostitution and prostitution that is forced on women (war rape), as it has been during WWII by Japan in its occupied territories. That was definitely a war crime that was committed, and Japan has admitted to that as well (refer Young's article that is quoted in the OP):
Quote:
Japan's top government spokesman and Chief Cabinet Secretary Yoshihide Suga refused to comment directly on Mr Hashimoto's remarks.

However, he said: “The government's position on the comfort women issue is that, as I repeatedly said here, we feel pains towards people who experienced hardships that are beyond description and (this) administration shares the view held by past governments.”

In a landmark 1993 statement, the Japanese government offered “sincere apologies” for the “immeasurable pain and suffering” inflicted on comfort women.

Two years later, Japan issued a broader apology expressing “deep remorse” for war suffering.


It probably should also be noted that it wasn't only Asian women, but also Western women who were forced/coerced into prostitution by Japan during WWII - makes sense as there were many Western women who were imprisoned by the Japanese in concentration camps. The article below mentions the Dutch, but as far as I know there were other Westerners similarly forced/coerced.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women
Indi
handfleisch wrote:
Did you know that the US military creates a boom in prostitution and sex trafficking everywhere it goes? The word "hooker" comes from the name of a US Army general. The US has been known for creating entire prostitution sub-economies in places where it puts its bases. Thailand, Philipines, Korea.... Militarism is evil

Where i grew up in the Caribbean, you can still feel the effects of that to this day. You may not think of the Caribbean as a "war zone" where the US is concerned, but you'd be wrong - not only were there several overt military actions, including in Grenada and Dominica, the Americans often threatened small nations to allow them to set up bases and intimidated their navies and merchant fleets. (Indeed, it still continues to this day, for example in the form of "shipriders".) Generally they swaggered about the Caribbean, being a loud, boorish, dangerous nuisance. In fact, a lot of our traditional culture refers to the exploitation of the local populations by the US military.

For example:

Quote:
CHORUS
Brown skin girl, stay home and mind baby.
Brown skin girl, stay home and mind baby.
I am going away on a sailing boat,
and if I don't come back,
stay home and mind baby.

Now the Americans make an invasion.
We thought it was a help to the island.
Until they left from here on vacation,
And left the native boys here to mind their children.

CHORUS

Now I tell you the story about Millie.
She made a nice blue-eyed baby.
And they say she fancy the mother,
but the blue-eyed baby don't know her father.

Brown skin girl, stay home and mind baby.
Brown skin girl, stay home and mind baby.
I am going away on a sailing boat,
and if I don't come back,
throw away the damn baby. (Other versions do "throw away the damn pickaninny".)

In case it isn't clear, the lyrics are about the aftermath after American naval sailors came down to the islands, staying in makeshift bases, and knocked up local girls. The original lyrics have other verses that strongly suggest prostitution, but never come right out and say so - calypso lyrics are usually subtle and sly (remember, that! it will be important in a moment!). The American sailors went home to their American sweethearts and married, but they left these small islands in turmoil. Hundreds of young girls were lured away from their native lovers and traditional work to the naval bases, where they were showered with money (American dollars went a long way in poor islands) and attention... then were just ditched, and left with mixed-race babies ("blue-eyed babies" and "pickaninnies") they had to support - leaving it to hundreds of "native boys" to pick up the pieces and act as fathers and support these unwanted children. The social aftermath was horrible - the girls who had consorted with Americans then been ditched were condemned as ****** and sluts, but they had to sit back and take it to keep getting support from the guys they had casually ditched when the sailors were around, and don't forget these mixed-race, fatherless children growing up in a culture hostile to what their American fathers had done.

Incidentally, the version i linked to is the Harry Belafonte version. Belafonte is the most famous of a number of American musicians who are reviled in the Caribbean, because what they did was come down to the islands, pick up a number of traditional songs as well as songs by artists of the time, then release them the US while claiming themselves as composer. This song, for example, was not just a traditional folk song, it was written by a calypsonian called King Radio - but his song was pretty just stolen from him, and of course, the poor musicians from the islands had no hope of getting justice. (In recent years, some of the songwriting credits have been restored for these stolen songs, but still, none of the original writers saw a penny of the fortunes their songs made in America.) Of course, they would often not only dull down the traditional Caribbean musical flavour and Americanize the songs, they would usually bowlderize the lyrics substantially, to remove some of the nastier references. You won't hear Belafonte singing the line, "throw away the damn pickaninny".

This actually led to some hilarity. For example, there is the case of Rum and Coca-Cola. This was another song stolen by American musicians. This time, it was originally written by Lord Invader, who is a Trinidadian legend and who - decades later - actually had the resources to go after the thieves, and he won in the end (only a partial victory, though - the thieves retained the copyright, which means they can continue to make money off of it). But when it was originally stolen, it was performed by the Andrews Sisters - and it was a huge hit for them. They were the darlings of the US military during WW2, and they often performed for the official US military entertainment tours, often doing Rum and Coca-Cola.

The joke? Well, the original Lord Invader lyrics are clearly about the problems caused by US servicemen creating prostitutes out of local girls. When it was stolen, the thief obviously removed the more obvious references to prostitution and the social problems US soldiers created... but remember when i said that calypso lyrics are usually subtle and sly? ^_^; They missed some references. In other words, for dozens of years, the Andrews Sisters - the paragon of American purity - were happily singing to cheering US troops... about how they were exploiting local girls and ruining societies.

Zing.

This is one of the reasons why Lord Invader is a Caribbean legend, by the way. The man burned the entire US military machine, including their entertainment division, and made a farce out of the American ideal of purity and innocence... by accident. He did it by writing his lyrics so subtly and cleverly, that the US military didn't even realize it was criticizing itself.

But yes, the effect of the US military on local societies and cultures was enormous, and you can find references to it all over. Here's a song about... well, penises. And yet...

Quote:
BRIDGE
Money in the land is the Yankee dollar bill.
Money in the land is the Yankee dollar bill.

Well, I asked my lady, what should I do,
to make her happy, and make love true.
She said, "the only thing that I want from you
is a little, little piece of the big bamboo."

CHORUS
She want the big, big bamboo, bamboo.
Oh, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la!
Working for the Yankee dollar, yee-hah!

Well, I gave my lady a sugar cane.
Sweet for my sweets, I did explain.
She gave it back, to my surprise.
She liked the flavour, but not the size.

CHORUS

Well, I gave my lady a coconut.
She said, "I like it, it's okay, but...
the only thing that worries me...
what good are the nuts, without the tree?"

CHORUS

Even in this silly, fun song, you can see hints of the social impact of the American military bases. The song is about a woman who is really into penises, and, "oh, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la... working for the Yankee dollar, yee-hah!". It's subtle, but basically it's calling her a ****** ("oh, la, la") working for American ("Yankee") dollars, riding ("yee-hah!") men. It's not even trying to be nasty! That was just the perception in society at the time: a woman being sexually "loose" meant they were servicing the servicemen, for American money.

These problems don't just exist in Indonesia or the Philippines, and they weren't just caused by Japan.
nickfyoung
Very interesting story Indi. Enjoyed it immensely and learned something yet again.
handfleisch
Indi wrote:
...

Awesome post, Indi, about the songs and everything, thanks

deanhills wrote:
@Handfleisch. I see a big difference between voluntary prostitution and prostitution that is forced on women (war rape), as it has been during WWII by Japan in its occupied territories. That was definitely a war crime that was committed, and Japan has admitted to that as well (refer Young's article that is quoted in the OP):


You're right in general, but I am kind of sick of such moral distinctions that say forced war prostitution is war crime but the ruination of entire cultures by the creation of a planned, encouraged, overt prostitution service for the military is good business as usual. The war crimes have happened in limited times and scales (thankfully) but the US promotion of prostitution has probably involved millions of women by now and for decades and decades. And prostitution is often coerced, so to simply call it "voluntary" is wrong.

It's like the equation is this:
Force 1000 women into prostitution during war = horrible war crime, big headlines
Encourage and promote 100,000 women into (often coerced) prostitution for military bases = That's life, good business, not news

MOD - serial posts combined into one.
-Ankhanu
deanhills
handfleisch wrote:
You're right in general, but I am kind of sick of such moral distinctions that say forced war prostitution is war crime but the ruination of entire cultures by the creation of a planned, encouraged, overt prostitution service for the military is good business as usual. The war crimes have happened in limited times and scales (thankfully) but the US promotion of prostitution has probably involved millions of women by now and for decades and decades. And prostitution is often coerced, so to simply call it "voluntary" is wrong.

It's like the equation is this:
Force 1000 women into prostitution during war = horrible war crime, big headlines
Encourage and promote 100,000 women into (often coerced) prostitution for military bases = That's life, good business, not news
Well if this kind of prostitution is not "war prostitution" then you'd have to include prostitution every where in the world, including inside the United States. Are you saying that prostitution inside the United States is OK, but if they did the same in other countries it is not? It would ruin the culture outside the United States, but not the culture of the people inside the United States?
handfleisch
deanhills wrote:
handfleisch wrote:
You're right in general, but I am kind of sick of such moral distinctions that say forced war prostitution is war crime but the ruination of entire cultures by the creation of a planned, encouraged, overt prostitution service for the military is good business as usual. The war crimes have happened in limited times and scales (thankfully) but the US promotion of prostitution has probably involved millions of women by now and for decades and decades. And prostitution is often coerced, so to simply call it "voluntary" is wrong.

It's like the equation is this:
Force 1000 women into prostitution during war = horrible war crime, big headlines
Encourage and promote 100,000 women into (often coerced) prostitution for military bases = That's life, good business, not news
Well if this kind of prostitution is not "war prostitution" then you'd have to include prostitution every where in the world, including inside the United States. Are you saying that prostitution inside the United States is OK, but if they did the same in other countries it is not? It would ruin the culture outside the United States, but not the culture of the people inside the United States?
.
The things a country encourage within its own borders are one thing (and by the way prostitution is not encouraged in most of the USA).
Another thing is the most powerful country in the world setting up military bases around the world in poor, weak countries, and doing it with full knowledge and complicity that it will be creating a prostitution economy that intrinsically involves coercion and rape on a mass scale for years and years.
JoryRFerrell
spinout wrote:
Hm, this is a bit tricky and a lie. Are asians different and more hard to keep control of in war? No, and Japs do have the military background already in their mind! (brain washed people !!!). Remember tha kamakazie, that means loyalty !

This is a LIE!


Well...the fundamentalist Christians who fought and died during the crusades, raped, murdered and pillaged (and some willingly, and gladly died) for the religion. Dying because you are loyal to a cause does not exclude you from committing evil acts. Many Japanese folks considered themselves civilized. And as most morauding civs do, they felt that those beneath them were slaves in any manner they saw fit, as laborers, or sex-wise. The same is the case with Spanish Conquistadors. They murder, raped, and pillaged despite holding "Catholic values". In fact, they did it with the grace of those values: Popes authorized and gave clemency for such actions as long as they spread the word of god.

Dying for a cause doesn't prevent humans from acting paradoxically in issues concerning those "strong" beliefs/values. Many just find a way to justify consciously/sub-consciously.
B88maritime
You probably have read the latest news in Syria where they are sending female jihadist for sex jihad. It's funny how people bend morality just to satisfy sensual needs.
Indi
B88maritime wrote:
You probably have read the latest news in Syria where they are sending female jihadist for sex jihad. It's funny how people bend morality just to satisfy sensual needs.

That story seems to be complete bullshit, made up by Tunisian politicians to rile up indignation and disgust for political gain.
sailor69
(This thread seems a little to serious for Frihost in comparison to the usual. For those who have difficulty with such serious material, moderators should consider requiring a keyword in the thread title indicating this. Many people reading this might be rape victims, or could be teenagers not yet exposed to this, even children with parental consent.)

War rape, or any rape, maybe especially that which is institutional, should definitely be taken seriously and should always be a felony with a very long prison sentence.

When the perpetrator is unwilling but does it anyway at gunpoint or due to having extreme drugs or hypnotism or brainwashing, then some mitigation of that punishment may be in order. According to the book Flyboys (mostly about another subject in the Japanese army's conduct in WWII), Japanese soldiers were beaten repeatedly during training by officers. Most if not all were required to kill someone at some point up close and personal, just to show their "warrior spirit". This was usually by beheading a prisoner with a katana.

These soldiers were seen as having an "evil" in their eyes. I regarded this as a mild form of brainwashing--the most extreme which I know there is at least some evidence of. To my knowledge, none were ever punished, although many if not all attempt some form of atonement.

As far as comfort women, I did not know specifically of the Philipines. I did know of those on ships. Some of those women were raped up to 400 times per day. Many were Japanese. According to Flyboys, the soldiers in China also killed all the people in the villages they passed through. They also raped all or most of the women and girls until the leadership became concerned about venereal disease and required that the men not have any intercourse except at brothels they set up. The women were slaves and definitely unwilling. They would get one day off a month during which they would be examined by a doctor for venereal disease.
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