FRIHOSTFORUMSSEARCHFAQTOSBLOGSCOMPETITIONS
You are invited to Log in or Register a free Frihost Account!


Why do people hate bands once they 'sell out'?





rocking
I think its kinda silly. Is it just that once they become mainstream, they're totally uncool?
Usually, the only thing that has changed is the fact that they are more well known, nothing to do with the actual music.

And I reckon if they're good, it isnt just selling out, isnt it just that they've finally got the recognition they deserve?

What do you think?
Ankhanu
I think some of it comes down to self-identity and a sense of personal connection. When a band is obscure, it's "yours", when that changes, it's everyone's... some people can't handle that.

In many cases too, there is a fair change in the song writing and production, the "their first album was better" situation. While often true, it again also comes back to making an initial connection with a particular sound.

For some, they genuinely DO sell out Razz They adapt and mold themselves to what is going to sell, rather than maintaining any kind of artistic integrity... though they may not have had any in the first place and you just bought into what they were presenting previously Razz

Here's a little bit by Henry Rollins on the topic (strong language):
Radar
Ankhanu wrote:
I think some of it comes down to self-identity and a sense of personal connection. When a band is obscure, it's "yours"


I think there's a lot of that mentality in the indie sub-culture as well. There's a mindset that the more obscure a band, the better it is. There is definitely a personal element to that situation.
Flakky
Some artists change their style to suit the majority of the crowd while others are forced to change their style to the majority of the crowd. Which is the same thing.

This change of style is unwanted and you actually wished that they would not be popular as they would not have a different, forced style.
gandalfthegrey
A 'sell out' is someone who is in it just for the money and fame. If it truly is still just about the music, I think fans can still recognize when it is.

When I think of sell outs, I think of ****** like Lars Ulrich of Metallica.

Musicians who rather profit off their music (especially when they are already right), rather then having their music in the hands of the most people possible (regardless if they paid for it or not - many people, especially young people can't afford paying for tons of music) - those musicians are sell outs in my opinion.
Ankhanu
gandalfthegrey wrote:
When I think of sell outs, I think of ****** like Lars Ulrich of Metallica..


Just Lars? What about the rest of the band??
Afaceinthematrix
Ankhanu wrote:
gandalfthegrey wrote:
When I think of sell outs, I think of ****** like Lars Ulrich of Metallica..


Just Lars? What about the rest of the band??


People tend to pin point Lars because he was the main face and the one responsible for the Napster controversy. Personally, I actually have nothing wrong with that. Downloading music is illegal and it is illegal. I personally own stacks and stack of CDs. I buy all my music. I do not download it (I don't even legally download it because I like to have to actual CD with the booklet and everything). I support the bands that I listen to (I've been to tons and tons of metal shows - I go to a show every couple weeks). However, on a personal level, I used to love people downloading my music when I was a recording musician. I used to give it out for free. But that was because I was not looking at music for a career - I was making it for fun. But to someone that is a career musician - album sales matter (although Metallica still sells so many albums so I think it was probably more about record sells stats and wanting to have the status of reaching triple/quad/whatever platinum). MySpace and other similar sites are a great resource for musician. Out of the stacks of CDs I own, most of those I would not have ever purchased (or paid to see the band in concert) if it hadn't been for them uploading their music onto the internet. That's mainly because I would never have found out about them!

And to answer the question (why do we hate sellouts)... Most people hate sellouts because it damages the music quality. I respect music, musicians, and great musicianship. I don't care about the money and most metal people also don't. If money is going to be the driving force behind what you write, then you will stop producing good music. This sounds like it should be their business. However, if I've purchased 4 albums from your band (4*$13 = $52), a t-shirt ($20), seen you live four times ($25*4=$100), so in other words, spent $172 on you and your band, it's a slap in the face to me and the other fans to have the band sell out to us and cater to commercial instincts and their roots. However the money part doesn't bother me very much because if I spent the $172, then I still have the CDs and I still enjoyed the shows (although I won't wear the shirt anymore), but I still don't respect them because I respect musicianship and people who care about making the best music possible.

BTW... Anyone heard the new Morbid Angel album lately? I don't know if it was selling out or just falling off (maybe they just lost all their ideas and went crazy...)
iiinvest
Quote:
And to answer the question (why do we hate sellouts)... Most people hate sellouts because it damages the music quality. I respect music, musicians, and great musicianship. I don't care about the money and most metal people also don't. If money is going to be the driving force behind what you write, then you will stop producing good music. This sounds like it should be their business. However, if I've purchased 4 albums from your band (4*$13 = $52), a t-shirt ($20), seen you live four times ($25*4=$100), so in other words, spent $172 on you and your band, it's a slap in the face to me and the other fans to have the band sell out to us and cater to commercial instincts and their roots. However the money part doesn't bother me very much because if I spent the $172, then I still have the CDs and I still enjoyed the shows (although I won't wear the shirt anymore), but I still don't respect them because I respect musicianship and people who care about making the best music possible.


Afaceinthematrix, I couldn't have said it better. Music has a personal connection as well as a financial connection, though I feel the personal connection is slightly more important to most listeners. For a band to sell out is to deny any relationship with the previous fans. The reason most bands sell out is for greed and for a listener to have created a relationship, promoted the band and provided financial support for the betterment of the music, only to find out the music has changed for the worst is the highest form of disrespect to a listener. The word music and the word business shouldn't be used in the same sentence, but it is.
Hello_World
Selling-out isn't refering necessarily to artists whose alt music is recognised by mainstream culture.

Selling out, strictly speaking, is where artists put money and profit before artistic integrity.

People do use it for the first scenario sometimes, because perhaps they are annoyed.

I, for example, don't like seeing music in big arenas, I like smaller venues. If an artist I like becomes too popular, I have to go see them at the MCG and pay over $100 for one ticket and I am not happy. But this doesn't necessarily mean they are a sellout, if their music is still their music.

On the other hand, I'd love to see one of my favourite bands, The Cat Empire, get the recognition and money they deserve. They are 5000 times better IMHO than 50 Cent or Madonna or Beiber or whoever else is making millions, why shouldn't they be paid well for the beauty they have brought into my life and others?

I'd hate to see them change their music to fit in with what the money people think is what is going to sell well. And that is the point - that would make them a 'sellout'.

So I agree with you.

I think people use the word 'cool' a lot as an insult these days, but all it means is identity. What is 'cool' with one person or group is different to another. Some people think mainstream music is 'cool' or else, it wouldn't be mainstream now, would it?

But it is true that if you limit yourself to one type of music you will miss out on some beauty in another. There are rare gems in mainstream music, in all types of music.
gverutes
I don't think that bands who sell out are bad. But people don't have to like them if they don't want to.
Nameless
Because they poor and be jelly.
rogue_skydragon
Nameless wrote:
Because they poor and be jelly.


LOL.

Well, for me, the bands who I grow attached to are oftentimes bands that very few people know about. That's what makes them special to me...the fact that I and only very few others represent their fanbase. Once that fanbase explodes, the novelty of liking that band wears away.
Dialogist
Artistic integrity suffers once an artist sells out. The label "artist" gets thrown around more than "love" and "hate" anyway and if this title is anything to go by, two out of three is not bad. You're right though, in suggesting that it is silly. Although not ill-founded. If I see a band like U2 (for example) doing a commercial for Apple merchandise, I as somebody who heard their early work like "War" have every right to draw a comparison between the hungry Irish no-name meat and potatoes rock no rock band, and the current silver cowboy hat wearing corporate (w)hores who are now prostituting their art for money (and just money). This is where the contention comes in (and why it can be a little bit silly)...

The artist creating Picassos in a wooden hut on a mountainside in Tibet is still an artist, but art is arguably subject to the void (communication) between the item and the appreciator. Otherwise, it's just a tree falling in an empty forest, no matter how loud it is. This is relevant because for an artist to define himself as such, he has to create art and quality or authenticity aside for a moment, it's art when a third party says so. I could take a dump right now and call it "The Infinitude of Futility", but if it doesn't get pondered, viewed, experienced, acknowledged and critically, "felt" (not literally) then is it art? Damien Hurst has made his living mocking modern art via modern art. He probably knows the next bit: The artist himself becomes a product. And to sell raw, naked and genuinely honest emotions is perhaps more expensive than selling ipods. He has to (w)hore himself out though. See Banksy's reaction to himself being in museums and auctions. He knows this fine well too, which is why he mocks it, as any self respecting artist would. See Muse refusing to do adverts and suing that one ad who used their song ("Feeling Good" - a cover version - a 'borrow' of somebody else's art lol) and then gave the money won from that lawsuit to charity. Even "true" artists are very conscious of the self-whoring aspect which is sadly a necessary evil of not ending up that mountainside in Tibet creating art that nobody validates as such. Human beings need to be loved. Every one has to peddle something, whether it be Walker's Crisps (Lionel Richie) or the word of God (Pope). The ends are sometimes seen as justifying the means. Publicity is required. Trees and forests again.

However, being an artist myself, a title I was sure to validate via taking paypal payments for artwork I've produced for clients, I know a bullshit artist when I see one. I have my thing and the public thing. My thing doesn't pay well nor does it keep me fed, but it does keep me alive. The public thing pays okay and keeps me fed. Necessary evils again. That said, my view of this is very old school and traditional and conservative. A band with the pop music making talent of U2 doesn't need to peddle corporate products to survive, stay popular nor relevant. They could have retired 10 years ago and never worked again. They are selling these items simply to suck satan's balls. For greed.

Bill Hicks wrote:
Any performer that ever sells a product on television is now and forever and for all eternity removed from the artistic world, I don’t care if you shit Mona Lisas out of your ass on cue. You’ve made your f***ing choice.


Sums it up.
Related topics
When will you buy a Hybrid?
issues you hate
Pop-punk, the worst thing to happen to music in loooong time
Pirated Software : What if we can't afford original ones
Love Between Aishwarya Rai and Abishek Bacchan
Emo
Custom Computer Spec - Give Opinion
sell my house online
Most hated man in the world - who?
New way to sell albums?
The hate for the existing GOD...
NBA Finals: I Want A Lakers -- Celtics Showdown!
Was Osama Bin Laden really killed by U.S. special troops?
Why do you smoke?
Reply to topic    Frihost Forum Index -> Sports and Entertainment -> Music

FRIHOST HOME | FAQ | TOS | ABOUT US | CONTACT US | SITE MAP
© 2005-2011 Frihost, forums powered by phpBB.