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Was Osama Bin Laden really killed by U.S. special troops?





Tommyfromneverland
Firstly, the news was without footage of the killing, at least picture of the corpse.
Secondly, the explaination that his body was buried at sea is really weird.
To down play the death of the most wanted man on earth doesn't sound like the U.S. government. Remember how they captured Sadam Husein; they exposed everything.
From what I think, this creepy creature was dead before the raid in Pakistan few days ago. Maybe he died of illness, or took VIAGRA too much (muslim could have 4 wives or more) and this could happen weeks, months, or even years ago. Of course when the CIA found out about this news, they saw an opportunity to boost the american moral. And so they painted a story about Obama... oops I mean Osama's dead. Mr. Obama in turn get the benefit of this story for his next election campaign. Razz
truespeed
Tommyfromneverland wrote:

Secondly, the explaination that his body was buried at sea is really weird.


Why is that weird,they flew his body straight from his hideout, out to a ship at sea,why take him back to land just to bury him.also burying him on land comes with its own problems,possible shrine for fanatics or possible target for his enemies,the burial at sea in the circumstances seems the logical choice.
menino
Yes truespeed, you are right, which makes sense to bury him at sea, then they won't be able to make a shrine out of it.

But still the whole story is weird in itself.
jmlworld
truespeed wrote:
Tommyfromneverland wrote:

Secondly, the explaination that his body was buried at sea is really weird.


Why is that weird,they flew his body straight from his hideout, out to a ship at sea,why take him back to land just to bury him.also burying him on land comes with its own problems,possible shrine for fanatics or possible target for his enemies,the burial at sea in the circumstances seems the logical choice.


I'm in the same boat as Tommyfromneverland. Why bury him in the sea immediately after his capture? And I really gutted when they said that they buried him in an Islamic way.

Also they said that he was not armed at all, so why did they kill him instead of taking him alive to face the justice?

The whole story is complicated, mate. It's weird that Obama and the CIA are playing a very suspicious game.
psychomonkey
i think he is sunbathe on islands:)
micho_2008
@Tommyfromneverland,

I agree with you that the story of Obama (not to confuse with Osama) contains lots of mystery. However, the daughter of Osama confessed what happened and said they killed her father after capturing him. Why would she say so if he was already dead. Why didn't his wife say so too?

If what his daughter said is true, then there is a blame on the American administration for not capturing Osama and judging him.

If you noticed well what the American administration said over the last few days, you'd see lots of contradictions in their speachs. Once they said there was a fight, and then they said Osama did not fight. Once they said he shielded behind his wife, and another time they did not say so. They said they did not lose a plane, while some so-called eyewitnesses said they saw a plane falling. The American later said the plane entered in an empty area (no air) and thus the plane fell. Obama said they would bury his corpse according to the Islamic custom, and then they said they dropped him in a sea.

Can you understand anything from this?
I understand that the American administration does not want to say the full truth. The only truth they said is that Obama is dead.

How? When? Where? By whom? On whose side was Pakistan? Why has Taliban been silent now that three days have passed after his death? Why no pictures of his death? Why no story of the American administration resembles the other from the same administration? Osama's wife and daughter are alive; why are they forbidden from talking to the media? How would Osama live in a house and area that is not guarded, knowing that he is chased by a strong country, and knowing that he is a security man, not someone who doesn't know how intelligences work? How could the American planes go as far as 70 miles inside the Pakistani land without being fired? How could Osama live about 100 meters near a big Pakistani camp for five years without the Pakistani army know of his existence there??? Don't they see his wife, daughter, son going in and out of the house? The American administration said there was a fight for about 40 minutes. Notice that this fight took place about 100 meters near a big Pakistani army camp, and they did not interfere? Why?

Simply speaking, I do not believe all the story of 9/11 attacks and Bin Laden. Bin Laden is a CIA agent. He made America occupy Afghatistan, Iraq, and be on the border of China. So, why hate him?
liljp617
Tommyfromneverland wrote:
Firstly, the news was without footage of the killing, at least picture of the corpse.
Secondly, the explaination that his body was buried at sea is really weird.
To down play the death of the most wanted man on earth doesn't sound like the U.S. government. Remember how they captured Sadam Husein; they exposed everything.
From what I think, this creepy creature was dead before the raid in Pakistan few days ago. Maybe he died of illness, or took VIAGRA too much (muslim could have 4 wives or more) and this could happen weeks, months, or even years ago. Of course when the CIA found out about this news, they saw an opportunity to boost the american moral. And so they painted a story about Obama... oops I mean Osama's dead. Mr. Obama in turn get the benefit of this story for his next election campaign. Razz


Alternatively, a team of special operations Navy Seals trained extensively, invaded the compound, got involved in a firefight, and killed bin Laden. But that's just too damn crazy to believe isn't it?

micho_2008 wrote:
@Tommyfromneverland,

I agree with you that the story of Obama (not to confuse with Osama) contains lots of mystery. However, the daughter of Osama confessed what happened and said they killed her father after capturing him. Why would she say so if he was already dead. Why didn't his wife say so too?

If what his daughter said is true, then there is a blame on the American administration for not capturing Osama and judging him.

If you noticed well what the American administration said over the last few days, you'd see lots of contradictions in their speachs. Once they said there was a fight, and then they said Osama did not fight. Once they said he shielded behind his wife, and another time they did not say so. They said they did not lose a plane, while some so-called eyewitnesses said they saw a plane falling. The American later said the plane entered in an empty area (no air) and thus the plane fell. Obama said they would bury his corpse according to the Islamic custom, and then they said they dropped him in a sea.

Can you understand anything from this?
I understand that the American administration does not want to say the full truth. The only truth they said is that Obama is dead.

How? When? Where? By whom? On whose side was Pakistan? Why has Taliban been silent now that three days have passed after his death? Why no pictures of his death? Why no story of the American administration resembles the other from the same administration? Osama's wife and daughter are alive; why are they forbidden from talking to the media? How would Osama live in a house and area that is not guarded, knowing that he is chased by a strong country, and knowing that he is a security man, not someone who doesn't know how intelligences work? How could the American planes go as far as 70 miles inside the Pakistani land without being fired? How could Osama live about 100 meters near a big Pakistani camp for five years without the Pakistani army know of his existence there??? Don't they see his wife, daughter, son going in and out of the house? The American administration said there was a fight for about 40 minutes. Notice that this fight took place about 100 meters near a big Pakistani army camp, and they did not interfere? Why?

Simply speaking, I do not believe all the story of 9/11 attacks and Bin Laden. Bin Laden is a CIA agent. He made America occupy Afghatistan, Iraq, and be on the border of China. So, why hate him?


There were no planes involved -.-

For the rest, please provide some evidence for your extraordinary claims.
saratdear
liljp617 wrote:
There were no planes involved -.-

Plane as in a copter. There was in the news that a copter had malfunctioned and it had to be destroyed.
jmlworld
- May be they captured him alive and they're torturing him in a secret place.

- May be he was not killed at all and he escaped the scene.

- May be he's was a CIA agent and they're protecting him on one of their many submarines...

- May be the whole 9/11 thing is a plot by the democrats to claim the 'National Hero' tag and secure their reign in the White House for many, many years.
menino
I think that Osama Bin Laden was killed, to prevent terrorists from creating a scene for terrorist negotiations, i.e. they kidnap some important officials and demand an exchange with Osama bin Laden.
Also, I think they might have put the story that they buried him at sea, so that his cohorts wont come after his body in the way of terrorist negotiations, as above.
With his body, they can give a burial, and form a shrine with which to take more revenge on.

With them killing him off immediately, I think it makes sense that way, so that there are no further investiagations.
It is also possible that his daughter might have lied to the press, to gain more sympathy.

Either way, Osama Bin Laden is dead and a lot of Americans can finally find peace (hopefully), in that knowledge.
Osama's followers will now try to take more drastic measures to ensure their revenge now.
liljp617
saratdear wrote:
liljp617 wrote:
There were no planes involved -.-

Plane as in a copter. There was in the news that a copter had malfunctioned and it had to be destroyed.


Those are two fairly different objects.

jmlworld wrote:
- May be they captured him alive and they're torturing him in a secret place.

- May be he was not killed at all and he escaped the scene.

- May be he's was a CIA agent and they're protecting him on one of their many submarines...

- May be the whole 9/11 thing is a plot by the democrats to claim the 'National Hero' tag and secure their reign in the White House for many, many years.


Maybe his compound was invaded by a team of Navy Seals and he was killed.
coolclay
I would never fault anyone for asking questions. But some of the conspiracy theorists just blow me away. I knew it wouldn't be long after UBL's death until some elaborate theories would spewed out. Seriously though everyone isn't out to spread misinformation, and make up lies, and all the other crap people automatically doubt.

This is obviously a sensitive subject as a whole, we will probably never know all the details and that's probably a good thing. Just take things as they are unless you have probable cause or evidence to doubt a subject.

I'd imagine all the different details people are hearing is from misinformation that accidentally changes as news travels. Even different news providers are giving different information, which is probably because they have different sources.
jmlworld
coolclay wrote:
[...]unless you have probable cause or evidence to doubt a subject[...]


- Denying to show any photo evidence.
- Claims that he was armed, then saying he was not armed at all.
- Burying him at sea immediately after the claims of him being killed.
saratdear
jmlworld wrote:
- Denying to show any photo evidence.


Reuters released 3 photographs - none of them showing Ladan, 3 other men, apparently killed in the attack. Bit graphic.
liljp617
jmlworld wrote:
coolclay wrote:
[...]unless you have probable cause or evidence to doubt a subject[...]


- Denying to show any photo evidence.
- Claims that he was armed, then saying he was not armed at all.
- Burying him at sea immediately after the claims of him being killed.


- He got shot in the face. If you want to see that, more power to you. They're not going to show off the photo all over the media. It would do nothing but raise tensions even more concerning his following and it's just really not necessary in general. Even if they showed it, people like yourself would still be ranting and raving about "OH THAT'S NOT EVEN REALLY HIM, HIS EYE COLOR IS DIFFERENT!"

- Faulty reports have never happened, have they? Especially with the US media. Especially with people who just came out of an unimaginably high-stress situation.

- They offered the body to the Saudi government and bin Laden's family, both of which declined. They did not want to bury it on land for obvious reasons. Islamic tradition requires quick disposal of the body.


Those are the explanations and unless you have more reasonable explanations, then please stop with the nonsense. If you want to question things (which is fine), then please come with some evidence to back up your extraordinary conclusions. Otherwise, you look ridiculous.
IceCreamTruck
micho_2008 wrote:
The only truth they said is that Obama is dead.


I have seen this time and time again. They're names are so close many are reporting Obama is dead... crazy interwebs and typos.
saratdear
liljp617 wrote:
They offered the body to the Saudi government and bin Laden's family, both of which declined.

Can you offer some citation for that? No problems with anything else you said. The version I heard in the news was that "finding a country willing to accept would have been difficult", that's all.
IceCreamTruck
Can't find a place to rest, but was able to find a place to live, and that doesn't make sense. The US should have threatened the world that we will bury him where ever we find him especially since everyone is so hands off now that he's dead. If we bury him in Pakistan we would doom them to millennia of insurgency, and they might have been quicker to give him up.

What blows my mind is that Osama was willing to live within 1 mile of a US airbase. The only thing I like about the last six years of him hiding is that every day he was probably unnerved by the helicopters flying over head, and that fact probably helped them get very close to him indeed before he realized the game was ending. I hope he enjoyed six years of wondering if that helicopter he was hearing was coming for him or not.

The release of Osama's death was closely watched because we know we made mistakes with the release of Saddam's death, and they probably did everything in their power to not mess up a golden political opportunity for the Obama Administration. It's a rare last chance for Obama to try to return to his former glory days. Never going to happen, however, cause it's hard if not impossible to make America fanatical about something TWICE.
ocalhoun
IceCreamTruck wrote:
micho_2008 wrote:
The only truth they said is that Obama is dead.


I have seen this time and time again. They're names are so close many are reporting Obama is dead... crazy interwebs and typos.

Not only the interwebs!

The TV too!
(Of course it's FOX... Who would have expected otherwise? Freudian slip, there, FOX employees?)
IceCreamTruck
That's a horrible suggestion Ocalhoun, but probably true! haha

You know... that "Obama Bin Laden" makes the guy in the suit look retarded... replace that man with someone in a monkey costume and you've just about got it!! No offense to the man pictured in the photo who I'm sure has spent a good deal of his fox news salary feeding starving children in Mississippi. Well, no press is bad press, and he's seeing his face all over the place for the moment as Fox's latest and greatest mess.
jmlworld
liljp617 wrote:
- He got shot in the face. If you want to see that, more power to you. They're not going to show off the photo all over the media. It would do nothing but raise tensions even more concerning his following and it's just really not necessary in general. Even if they showed it, people like yourself would still be ranting and raving about "OH THAT'S NOT EVEN REALLY HIM, HIS EYE COLOR IS DIFFERENT!"

- Faulty reports have never happened, have they? Especially with the US media. Especially with people who just came out of an unimaginably high-stress situation.

- They offered the body to the Saudi government and bin Laden's family, both of which declined. They did not want to bury it on land for obvious reasons. Islamic tradition requires quick disposal of the body.


Those are the explanations and unless you have more reasonable explanations, then please stop with the nonsense. If you want to question things (which is fine), then please come with some evidence to back up your extraordinary conclusions. Otherwise, you look ridiculous.


- I'm OK with a photo showing a dead man got shot in the face as long as it's an evidence for a complicated theory. I've gone through times I witnessed the corpses of dead people on fire and tens of people being slaughtered. I don't think the photo of OBL would devastate me that much.

- It wouldn't create tension among the Muslims. Even Al-Qaeda members are hard men, and in my opinion, they prefer the death more than the life. That's why they blow up themselves and that's why they chose to mess with the World's Strongest Nation (TM). The US is stupid to suggest that only the photo evidence of OBL will devastate people, forgetting the mess they did in Iraq and their utterly intolerable support for Israel's aggressions.

- Faulty reports may happen, but we'll never discover them as long as these stories remain in the closets of the CIA and the White House.

- I didn't see and hear any reports claiming that they offered the body to the Saudi government and Bin Laden's family. That's another horribly pointless story. Sorry if this offends you mate. Can you please back this with a citation?

Seeing is believing mate. I don't know how you guys believed something like this. Anyway, me and my likes will take everything they say with a pinch of salt.

Cheers,
liljp617
There's a difference between healthy skepticism and paranoid conspiracies.

The body was offered to the Saudi government. I was mistaken about his family, though it's not that ridiculous an assumption...and even less ridiculous to assume they would decline the body given the history of the family's relations with Osama.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2011/05/bin-laden-buried-at-sea-apparently-after-saudi-arabia-refused-the-body/1



The public has not received the whole story, and probably won't for a long time. That doesn't mean he wasn't killed and that doesn't mean the US Navy didn't kill him. You've shown nothing to prove the situation didn't go down as explained and evidenced by those involved. If you have some evidence that this whole ordeal is a farce, please post it. Saying "they haven't shown his blown up face" isn't evidence that this is all staged.
jmlworld
liljp617 wrote:
There's a difference between healthy skepticism and paranoid conspiracies.

The body was offered to the Saudi government. I was mistaken about his family, though it's not that ridiculous an assumption...and even less ridiculous to assume they would decline the body given the history of the family's relations with Osama.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2011/05/bin-laden-buried-at-sea-apparently-after-saudi-arabia-refused-the-body/1


That USA Today article doesn't mention clearly the source of the Saudi government apparently denying the body. Also the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia didn't confirm or deny whether they were offered the chance to bury their man.

liljp617 wrote:
The public has not received the whole story, and probably won't for a long time. That doesn't mean he wasn't killed and that doesn't mean the US Navy didn't kill him. You've shown nothing to prove the situation didn't go down as explained and evidenced by those involved. If you have some evidence that this whole ordeal is a farce, please post it. Saying "they haven't shown his blown up face" isn't evidence that this is all staged.


Seeing is believing my friend. The timeline of how the US government dealt with captured fugitives shows why people are suspicious.

I don't believe that Bin Laden is alive and kicking and I don't believe that he's killed by the US. What I think however is.

1) He's dead long ago and what they discovered were bare bones without face and flesh; or

2) He blew up himself and it's nobody's fault for the lack of photo evidences. They had nothing to photograph. Scattered flesh, you know it...
jwellsy
I wonder what Chairman Mao would say about the killing of OBL.
truespeed
jmlworld wrote:


1) He's dead long ago and what they discovered were bare bones without face and flesh; or

2) He blew up himself and it's nobody's fault for the lack of photo evidences. They had nothing to photograph. Scattered flesh, you know it...


You say that but.. instead of making up your own version of events based on no evidence at all, why not look at the actual evidence at hand.

Al-Qaeda has acknowledged the death of its leader, Osama Bin Laden.

How does this work into your conspiracy theory,why would Al-Qaeda play along with the American version of events?

Also the Americans report that Bin Ladens wife and daughter were witness to his murder,if the Americans just made the whole thing up as some kind of ruse,why include witness's in the ruse,his daughter and wife are hardly likely to play along with an American conspiracy are they?
liljp617
truespeed wrote:
jmlworld wrote:


1) He's dead long ago and what they discovered were bare bones without face and flesh; or

2) He blew up himself and it's nobody's fault for the lack of photo evidences. They had nothing to photograph. Scattered flesh, you know it...


You say that but.. instead of making up your own version of events based on no evidence at all, why not look at the actual evidence at hand.

Al-Qaeda has acknowledged the death of its leader, Osama Bin Laden.

How does this work into your conspiracy theory,why would Al-Qaeda play along with the American version of events?

Also the Americans report that Bin Ladens wife and daughter were witness to his murder,if the Americans just made the whole thing up as some kind of ruse,why include witness's in the ruse,his daughter and wife are hardly likely to play along with an American conspiracy are they?


There's really nothing you can say to conspiracy theorists. It's more frustrating than trying to talk to creationists.
jmlworld
truespeed wrote:
[...]instead of making up your own version of events based on no evidence at all, why not look at the actual evidence at hand.

Al-Qaeda has acknowledged the death of its leader, Osama Bin Laden.

How does this work into your conspiracy theory, why would Al-Qaeda play along with the American version of events?[...]


I've gone through the statement. I don't know what to say except that the whole thing is frustrating. BBC says that the statement was released on an Islamic Jihad forum.

Al-Qaeda, the CIA and Obama have something in common. Nobody knows what they're doing. May be Fidel Castro was right and they're close friends behind the scenes.
Bikerman
What you are essentially doing is taking your own belief, and building a fantasy to support it rather than critically examine it. It is a 'theory' in search of a conspiracy to attach to. First birth certificates, now this suggestion that the worst criminals imaginable are our leaders. I would happily see Blair in court for Iraq, but I don't think it would help the case to to charge him with being part of the best kept and most evil conspiracy the world has ever seen, not without at least some fairly important things, like a coherent understanding of the middle-east, geopolitics in general, and a theory would be nice - not just a vague 'they are all in it' which isn't really worhy of comment...I like to see an acceptance, at the very least, that gut instinct does not over-rule evidence, and that that the habit of post-dicting is a nasty one to catch. Trying to say that a particular event was unbelievable (therefore paranormal), cannot be done in reverse. First you say what we should look for that would be unbelievable, THEN we look. It doesn't work backwards, as it is simple to illustrate:

The golfer hit a fair t-shot. It lands within 10 metres of where he wanted it on the fairway.
We'd call that a fair shot, nothing outstanding and certainly not improbable. But then come the other way. We've found the ball, on grass blade r1928 in sector 12. Apparently it was aimed at this blade from a long distance away, and yet it still landed on exactly this blade of grass rather than any of the other 25 million ones around. That has to be a25 million to one chance....impossible, surely?


It is rather trivial and schoolboyish error which no serious person would make. It is one reason Dembski, the creationist maths guru, can't get published Smile
bukaida
OSAMA-->substitute the S with B. You get the name of the killer.What a coincidence!!
IceCreamTruck
Obama was just a normal guy before all this "he's going to save us" fanaticism and such. One thing that really makes me angry is all these people turning on Obama now just because the media is making their usual hype based suggestions to drive ratings.

It really makes all you messiah believers look really foolish. First you elevate him like he's a god, and now you tear him down because he isn't perfect. If you ask me anything Obama does wrong also paints the american people's hands red. We elected him almost without really collectively knowing who he really is, but a savior he has never been.

Honestly, I like the guy an unbelievable amount more than Georgie Weorgie, daddy's boy, wicked little mouse of a man we had in office before Obama, but I'm still not sure about Obama. I'd like to think he has the strength to stand up for what's right, but honestly he is attacking our freedoms and he did this while he was campaigning. Many of his tactics were questionable, and I wasn't a fan of the Obama brigade or whatever they called it that definitely did some questionable things in the offensive of Obama's campaign. They were ruthless and very cult like, and were less concerned about our freedoms then they were about winning the election.

Through it all I think he's done a fair job considering the violent political landscape we've been in for years. He complained at first that he couldn't get anything done, but that's because I kind of think he would have leaned toward being a tyrant if the checks and balances were not in place, but apparently he's learned how to get things done in our system because you don't hear him focusing on his opposition any more and he has some accomplishment like the death of OBL.

However you slice it the blood is on American's hands. Anything he does wrong you are guilty of because you elected him, and wanted him to save you. You cannot claim to be blameless here when you pushed past everyone who was voicing concern because you thought Obama was going to save us like a messiah, and could do no wrong. The thing is that many of his tactics were questionable during his campaign and so it stands to reason that his tactics in office would also reflect the man that he is. I don't think he's a bad person, but I do think he's used to getting what he wants without considering the other guy who looses out in his strategy.

I am under the understanding that BHO sent his campaign staff to cause trouble with other campaigns, had them throwing dirt at anyone who said anything negative about BHO, and intended to silence those to continued to speak out against him. How he intended to do that is speculation, but my point is that these are dangerous, anti-american, thoughts that our leader shouldn't have. he should have a better understanding of free speech then that because it is our right.

I'm a little worried that he will continue his attacks on our freedoms before he leaves office. You know how they always pass horrible things before they leave office, well I think BHO isn't going to be any better, and I've already heard rumor that we're going to have to kill more of his bad legislation in the next presidential term after he leaves. I don't think we'll have him two terms, but I also don't underestimate our "messiah" anymore.

Stop being so fickle about people America. You can't trust anyone, so picking a president is often picking the less of two evils.
jmlworld
IceCreamTruck wrote:

Stop being so fickle about people America. You can't trust anyone, so picking a president is often picking the less of two evils.


It's not only America and the Americans, mate. The whole people are the same, they elect a man and then they slag him off. That's the nature of the mankind.

What were the reasons they elected Obama? 1) To save USA; 2) To restore the dignity of the country; 3) To do something with the financial problems.

I'm not an American, however I've a common sense and I believe the aforementioned reasons are correct.

So why people are turning against him? I'll try to answer this as my sole opinion, so please don't ask me to cite it. This is not Wikipedia Very Happy

1. The Bush administration has left a lot of mess and it wasn't easy to correct all the previous problems with one magic strike.

2. Obama and his democrat friends had plans; but since the republicans are still dominating the political landscape of the country, it's not easy for them to apply all their promises into actions.

3. Mankind were born to criticize.

Yea, and I noticed that we're bit off topic.
deanhills
IceCreamTruck wrote:
Obama was just a normal guy before all this "he's going to save us" fanaticism and such. One thing that really makes me angry is all these people turning on Obama now just because the media is making their usual hype based suggestions to drive ratings.
I have not seen anyone turning on Obama. Obviously there are critics and your conspiracy theorists, but I'd say that he came out of this announcement looking pretty good.

IceCreamTruck wrote:
It really makes all you messiah believers look really foolish. First you elevate him like he's a god, and now you tear him down because he isn't perfect. If you ask me anything Obama does wrong also paints the american people's hands red. We elected him almost without really collectively knowing who he really is, but a savior he has never been.
Who elevated him to God status? I think there was the normal percentage of people who were happy when he got elected, and then when had not delivered on some of the promises, people got disappointed. All one has to do is look at the ratings. They go up and down all the time.

IceCreamTruck wrote:
Honestly, I like the guy an unbelievable amount more than Georgie Weorgie, daddy's boy, wicked little mouse of a man we had in office before Obama, but I'm still not sure about Obama. I'd like to think he has the strength to stand up for what's right, but honestly he is attacking our freedoms and he did this while he was campaigning. Many of his tactics were questionable, and I wasn't a fan of the Obama brigade or whatever they called it that definitely did some questionable things in the offensive of Obama's campaign. They were ruthless and very cult like, and were less concerned about our freedoms then they were about winning the election.
I don't think Obama has been a bad President, but since the US is the leading country in everything, I would have expected someone much better than Obama for President. Surely there are better guys around than him and where are they? Very Happy

IceCreamTruck wrote:
Through it all I think he's done a fair job considering the violent political landscape we've been in for years.
What do you mean with "violent political landscape"?

IceCreamTruck wrote:
He complained at first that he couldn't get anything done, but that's because I kind of think he would have leaned toward being a tyrant if the checks and balances were not in place, but apparently he's learned how to get things done in our system because you don't hear him focusing on his opposition any more and he has some accomplishment like the death of OBL.
If he is no longer criticizing Bush, then that is a really good sign, but he has been criticized for doing that for most of his Presidency. I think however what he will be finally judged on the state of the economy more than anything else and that seems to be pretty dismal right now.

IceCreamTruck wrote:
However you slice it the blood is on American's hands. Anything he does wrong you are guilty of because you elected him, and wanted him to save you. You cannot claim to be blameless here when you pushed past everyone who was voicing concern because you thought Obama was going to save us like a messiah, and could do no wrong. The thing is that many of his tactics were questionable during his campaign and so it stands to reason that his tactics in office would also reflect the man that he is. I don't think he's a bad person, but I do think he's used to getting what he wants without considering the other guy who looses out in his strategy.
Right, he is a politician and he excels at doing his homework on the marketing side of things. If he stays the course I'm almost certain he will be getting a second Presidency, not because he is really that great, but because there is no one in the Republican Party that is worth looking at ..... yet .... anyways. I'm still hoping the Republicans could come up with something better than what we have seen in the media over the last few years to at least provide some meaningful competition. Am certain however that I will be disappointed. I see very little competition for Obama, other than protest votes.
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Was the US wrong to invade Pakistan?
Familia de Bin Laden expulsada de Pakistan
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