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A statement about the USA, discuss.





ocalhoun
This has ceased to be a country governed for the people, by the people. It is now a country governed by the media, for purposes unknown.
(Because ultimately, the television controls the minds of a majority of people... And that majority is large enough to overrule the minority that thinks for itself on every issue.)
Discuss.
Solon_Poledourus
~ You're beginning to believe the illusions we're spinning here, you're beginning to believe that the tube is reality and your own lives are unreal. You do. Why, whatever the tube tells you: you dress like the tube, you eat like the tube, you raise your children like the tube, you even think like the tube. This is mass madness, you maniacs. In God's name, you people are the real thing, WE are the illusion.~ Howard Beale, from the movie "Network" - 1976

I think they pretty much summed it up 30 plus years ago in that movie. We have become a somnambulist society of zombies, droning through life, living only as television tells us to live. That's the majority, anyway. The media creates fear, and then that same media sells the products to alleviate that fear. As long as they keep us confused and afraid, we are easier to control.

Almost every media outlet in the world is owned by one of six major media conglomerates. Of these six major companies, the men and women who sit on the board of directors for each, is almost interchangeable. The members of these boards also happen to have very close government ties, and in many cases, are directly working for government agencies. In essence, all the major media outlets are working for the interests of government. Which means that you and I only see and hear what they approve of. This creates a world-wide society of sheep, who only get the information that a handful of people have approved of.

For this reason alone, we need to protect the freedom of the internet. This is the last place where the truth can be shown to people, with as much speed and efficiency as traditional media. This is ours, and we must not let the emperors of media take hold of it.
liljp617
I can't say I think this country was ever run "by the people." It's a lovely idea, but I don't think it ever happened.
deanhills
ocalhoun wrote:
This has ceased to be a country governed for the people, by the people. It is now a country governed by the media, for purposes unknown.
(Because ultimately, the television controls the minds of a majority of people... And that majority is large enough to overrule the minority that thinks for itself on every issue.)
Discuss.
Totally agreed. What brought this on? Smile

I would go a step deeper in that the media is controlled by those who have the money including Government with tax payer money. If one can trace the money to the media, then possibly it will indicate who the real rulers are? Evil or Very Mad
Solon_Poledourus
deanhills wrote:
I would go a step deeper in that the media is controlled by those who have the money including Government with tax payer money. If one can trace the money to the media, then possibly it will indicate who the real rulers are?
There are a few ways to find out who owns the media. I provided a link in my post above, but you can also check out the website They Rule, and do a search in media and government. You'll find that the media is basically owned by government, and vise versa.

It's almost disheartening to see how only a few people control most of the money and the flow of information in the civilized world. I can't stress enough the importance of keeping these peoples' hooks out of the internet as much as possible. This is the last place where ideas flow at the speed of light, with total freedom, and very little cost to us. It truly is the only free media, and we must keep it that way.
deanhills
Solon_Poledourus wrote:
deanhills wrote:
I would go a step deeper in that the media is controlled by those who have the money including Government with tax payer money. If one can trace the money to the media, then possibly it will indicate who the real rulers are?
There are a few ways to find out who owns the media. I provided a link in my post above, but you can also check out the website They Rule, and do a search in media and government. You'll find that the media is basically owned by government, and vise versa.

It's almost disheartening to see how only a few people control most of the money and the flow of information in the civilized world. I can't stress enough the importance of keeping these peoples' hooks out of the internet as much as possible. This is the last place where ideas flow at the speed of light, with total freedom, and very little cost to us. It truly is the only free media, and we must keep it that way.
Thanks Solon, this is pretty awesome and yes really worrisome too. So now it makes sense how the Banks were "bailed out", when there was no bailing out needed in Canada. Those mortgages that landed the Big Banks in trouble were Government backed. So all they had to do is get the media to trumpet an "emergency" and the stage was set for a nice 1.2-trillion package to be voted by the public. Fear can be a good tactic to garner support for evil projects of the Government.
sondosia
Absolutely false. What distinguishes us from cats, dogs, and mosquitoes is our intellect. If you can't think for yourself, and decide to just absorb whatever you see on TV instead, that's nobody's fault but yours. The media is just one outlet for expression in this country. There are dozens of nonpartisan websites dedicated specifically to digging up the truth. There are lots of partisan ones, too. There are also plenty of independent writers, artists, and ordinary people publishing their opinions online and in print. Each source of information brings its own perspective to the table, and it is YOUR responsibility to search for different perspectives and make your own opinion.

Rather than wasting time thinking up outrageous conspiracy theories about how your television is out to turn into a zombie, educate yourself about the issues that matter to you. There is no shortage of opportunities to do that in this country. In that sense, we are very lucky here in America.
pampoon
I have always been a fan of the artist John Mayer, and I think that a line in one of his more popular songs has a nice message to it.
Quote:
Waiting on the World to Change
"And when you trust your television
What you get is what you got
Cause when they own the information, oh
They can bend it all they want"

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/johnmayer/waitingontheworldtochange.html

As long as we allow the media of society to be our only source of news and information, then they will be our only source of information and news. The only way to ensure this doesn't happen is just to stop being so gullible. If we simply think for ourselves, they won't have so much "control" over us.

-Pampoon
deanhills
sondosia wrote:
Absolutely false. What distinguishes us from cats, dogs, and mosquitoes is our intellect. If you can't think for yourself, and decide to just absorb whatever you see on TV instead, that's nobody's fault but yours. The media is just one outlet for expression in this country. There are dozens of nonpartisan websites dedicated specifically to digging up the truth. There are lots of partisan ones, too. There are also plenty of independent writers, artists, and ordinary people publishing their opinions online and in print. Each source of information brings its own perspective to the table, and it is YOUR responsibility to search for different perspectives and make your own opinion.

Rather than wasting time thinking up outrageous conspiracy theories about how your television is out to turn into a zombie, educate yourself about the issues that matter to you. There is no shortage of opportunities to do that in this country. In that sense, we are very lucky here in America.
Perhaps what Solon and Ocalhoun discussed show insights in the workings of controlling human minds through the application of the intellect. Furthermore, those who would like us to think in certain ways so that they can control the outcomes are using their intellect too, as well have lots of taxpayers' money available to get what they want. More than using our intellect, it calls for action to rebut this control. Being passively conned and using one's intellect are not enough.
quex
deanhills wrote:
Being passively conned and using one's intellect are not enough.


I love this phrase and would quote it, given your assent, for unrelated reasons. :D

Where do you get your news? Local, national nightly? CNN? Try the radio; humans are largely sight-reliant, and a vast amount of the spin can be removed from a report by removing the picture. That said, radio can also lie like a dog, so you must still pick your sources carefully. Ignore harassing radio shows (Rush Limbaugh et. al.), avoid call-in shows unless taken with very many grains of salt.

Now, there are those of us who take everything with proverbial salt. Some among us can carefully consider exactly what the media is saying and what we are seeing and hearing for ourselves. You may not trust in my ability to distinguish facts from spin in the mainstream media, but then again, you have already recognized manipulation and distanced yourself from those you see bamboozled... perhaps there are many more like us, not so easily swayed, who make up the true core of the country. What if the ones who follow the media are also the ones who get the most attention from it? In effect, I believe the idea that the media controls the hearts and minds of the majority of the US is simply a media fantasy that a few on the outside fall for and consequently become incensed about. The rest of us, those actually thinking for ourselves, are the ones who control America, and the media, and the believers of the media.

Rise above. :D
ocalhoun
quex wrote:
... perhaps there are many more like us, not so easily swayed, who make up the true core of the country. What if the ones who follow the media are also the ones who get the most attention from it? In effect, I believe the idea that the media controls the hearts and minds of the majority of the US is simply a media fantasy that a few on the outside fall for and consequently become incensed about. The rest of us, those actually thinking for ourselves, are the ones who control America, and the media, and the believers of the media.

No, I'm pretty sure the majority are the stupid ones... Ever tried talking to random people about more than just day-to-day stuff? Most of them show no evidence of thinking for themselves, either taking a party line they've been taught to repeat, or claiming to not care at all about it.
deanhills
ocalhoun wrote:
quex wrote:
... perhaps there are many more like us, not so easily swayed, who make up the true core of the country. What if the ones who follow the media are also the ones who get the most attention from it? In effect, I believe the idea that the media controls the hearts and minds of the majority of the US is simply a media fantasy that a few on the outside fall for and consequently become incensed about. The rest of us, those actually thinking for ourselves, are the ones who control America, and the media, and the believers of the media.

No, I'm pretty sure the majority are the stupid ones... Ever tried talking to random people about more than just day-to-day stuff? Most of them show no evidence of thinking for themselves, either taking a party line they've been taught to repeat, or claiming to not care at all about it.

That is very true. When I hear myself talking, I sometimes think about where I got my information from, and exactly how sure I can be that that information is reliable, authentic and real. I wonder whether any of us, even the "intelligent" ones, could ever have a meaningful discussion that would lead to real information. All of us are brainwashed so it does not really matter whether we are intelligent or stupid. In fact, maybe in a system like this, ignorance is bliss. Maybe we all are made into marionettes on a string. The system we are living in has also made us to accept this very passively, including the illusion of a democracy.

Last night when I was clicking around the TV, it by accident landed with Dr. Phil, and I immediately clicked away, as at that very moment he got someone to agonize about some or other problem, and I saw this person being photographed, zoomed in, on pain, misery, anxiety and tears. AND he is being paid for it too!!!!!! Evil or Very Mad
ocalhoun
deanhills wrote:
All of us are brainwashed so it does not really matter whether we are intelligent or stupid. In fact, maybe in a system like this, ignorance is bliss. Maybe we all are made into marionettes on a string. The system we are living in has also made us to accept this very passively, including the illusion of a democracy.

The trick is, when you cut the strings, you have to make your own strings; use real, hard data, not what someone tells you. And when someone does tell you something, look up the facts about it, especially if you agree with it; try to disprove it before accepting it.

You have to start with a premise of what you stand for.
Personally, I want maximum freedom for the individual, with a minimum of interference. Most of my views can be traced back to that core belief.

And above all: Don't be afraid to say "I don't have enough information to have an opinion about that."
The worst thing you can to do is take a side without having the information to back it up.
andrewsteinborn
Argh...

This is why I hate to be an American... (sigh)
deanhills
ocalhoun wrote:

Personally, I want maximum freedom for the individual, with a minimum of interference. Most of my views can be traced back to that core belief.
Herein lies a paradox for me too. In order to have that freedom, one has to surrender some to Government and Society so that we can live safely and securely and enjoy as much freedom as we can. There are certain things we can do of course, like trying to collect as much money as we can so that we are independent, and to be as little dependent on others. But at some point we would need some sort of protection in order to have maximum freedom. Either that, or move as far away as possible from human beings. Solon was mentioning an island at one stage, I really like that idea!
ocalhoun
deanhills wrote:
But at some point we would need some sort of protection in order to have maximum freedom.

The trick is having maximum freedom for EVERY individual. When one individual is restricting the freedom of another, that's when government 'protection' is benign.
lagoon
This is why a public-owned broadcaster is so valuable like our very own BBC. Every person that watches TV has to pay for a license, and the money goes towards making high-quality public service TV and radio programmes. There is a trust with representatives from the public that makes sure programmes are politically neutral and commit to their remit of public service.
deanhills
lagoon wrote:
This is why a public-owned broadcaster is so valuable like our very own BBC. Every person that watches TV has to pay for a license, and the money goes towards making high-quality public service TV and radio programmes. There is a trust with representatives from the public that makes sure programmes are politically neutral and commit to their remit of public service.
Excellent point. They have a similar one in Australia too. I don't know whether it is still the case but when I visited Australia many years ago, I was totally bowled over by the quality of their home-grown TV productions. BBC is tops, I'm thinking about David Attenborough type sponsored shows too. Smile
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